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CAN WE TALK ABOUT THE MIKE BROWN/ERIC GARNER/ETC SITUATION?
Posts
ubon
66
ubon
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Closeauthor=pianotm
There's also the point that Bob "Scumbag Asshole" McCullogh tried this case and likes to make shit up. Remember, a grand jury is a bunch of nitwits with no law education whose opinion doesn't even matter and doesn't even affect due process. Grand Juries literally exist to pander to the people. They could literally play hop-scotch in their chambers and accomplish something more meaningful than actually examining the case they are "ruling" on. You also used my favorite argument. How does a police officer sitting in his car shoot a 6'5" man on top of the head? If you even have a clue how physics works, the only conclusion you can come to is murder.
there was a series of tweets from another state prosecutor who watched the trial and tore into the way that the prosecution was mishandling the case to Darren Wilson's benefit -- I'll try to find it, as it's a very interesting (and also disgusting) read.
e: found it! https://storify.com/germanrlopez/lisa-bloom-on-ferguson-grand-jury
really, though, there are so many inconsistencies in the cop's testimony that it barely bears mentioning. the most important thing to remember is this: even if every hastily-revised, self-conflicting story coming from the cops is true, Mike Brown did not deserve to be executed and then dismissed as someone who didn't even bear an investigation. I think it's easy to get lost in debunking Darren Wilson's story and lose sight of the most basic and fundamental crime in the murders of Mike Brown, Eric Garner, and countless others: the devaluation of black lives, and the racism in the surrounding system that paints each victim as either a 'thug' or a thug-to-be.
No, it wasn't suicide by cop. There's a bunch of eyewitnesses, the coroner's report (secondary since the first one did not take pictures or write much of anything at all because fuckwit racists covering for each other.) and a whole host of evidence to the contrary.
Liberty, most eyewitness evidence DOES seem to indicate that Michael Brown did reach into the cop car and start pummeling Wilson. This is far from a "suicide by cop" and I would never call it that but I would just describe it as a really fucking dumb thing to do. Especially if you're black, for obvious reasons. But I wouldn't advise, say, harmonic to punch a cop either. However you look at it, antagonizing a cop is a dumb idea. As someone with a majorly self destructive cop hate problem, I am often tempted but I never do it because you know...self preservation.
But the severity of the consequences will vary both on the basis of your race (and that's racism, folks!) and the nature of the antagonistic behavior. In this case, being a large black man in Missouri made antagonizing a police officer a fatal mistake.
This in no way clears what Wilson did.
Racism is a huge part of this but the state's monopoly on "legitimate" violence is the greater issue.
ubon
66
author=Max McGee
Liberty, most eyewitness evidence DOES seem to indicate that Michael Brown did reach into the cop car and start pummeling Wilson.
would you mind posting that? what I've heard seems to indicate that he was pulled toward the cop and began struggling to escape, and I'm interested to hear how you reached that conclusion.
He didn't even cross examine! Even a first year law student knows you have to cross examine. The reason McCullogh didn't cross-examine was because he knew that cockamamie story wouldn't stand a cross-exam.
I mean, to hear Wilson tell it, Brown looked just like a demon, and he pummeled him, and he was working up such a sweat beating that cop, he had to hand the cigarellos (tailored testimony for the express purpose of connecting Brown to the previous crime) to his friend. Then Wilson went for his gun and it was life or death struggle and Brown told him he was too much of a pussy to shoot him. And then he left laughing and the Wilson, oh, he had to do something! He shot and then Brown turned around and charged him like a bull, running through hail of bullets!
O_O
Wow!
Is James Cameron directing?
This is a crazy person talking!
Edit: I tell you, wow! Now, just to exercise some common sense here, you've just committed a crime. Are you going to A) fence your stolen goods and lie low for awhile or B) attack a heavily armed man in a car who has a lot of heavily armed friends?
I mean, to hear Wilson tell it, Brown looked just like a demon, and he pummeled him, and he was working up such a sweat beating that cop, he had to hand the cigarellos (tailored testimony for the express purpose of connecting Brown to the previous crime) to his friend. Then Wilson went for his gun and it was life or death struggle and Brown told him he was too much of a pussy to shoot him. And then he left laughing and the Wilson, oh, he had to do something! He shot and then Brown turned around and charged him like a bull, running through hail of bullets!
O_O
Wow!
Is James Cameron directing?
This is a crazy person talking!
Edit: I tell you, wow! Now, just to exercise some common sense here, you've just committed a crime. Are you going to A) fence your stolen goods and lie low for awhile or B) attack a heavily armed man in a car who has a lot of heavily armed friends?
EdgeOfChaos
1755
This seems to be how people believe it went: http://i.imgur.com/seRfxv4.jpg . It actually didn't. Brown was shot in self defense.
I think you've got the evidence/witness part reversed. Wilson is backed up both by forensic evidence and eyewitnesses.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2014/11/29/b99ef7a8-75d3-11e4-a755-e32227229e7b_story.html
Over half a dozen black witnesses back up Wilson
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/10/22/michael-brown-shooting_n_6030220.html
Brown tried to wrestle away Wilson's gun. That's when he got shot first. He was fatally shot when Brown charged Wilson. When you attack a cop, you generally get hurt regardless of your race. This was not a racially motivated shooting. I'm ready for your links.
Also: more white people are fatally shot by cops than black people. Interesting fact.
author=Liberty
My God.
No, it wasn't suicide by cop. There's a bunch of eyewitnesses, the coroner's report (secondary since the first one did not take pictures or write much of anything at all because fuckwit racists covering for each other.) and a whole host of evidence to the contrary.
Yes, this was all motivated by race. Else why shoot a guy in the back with no warning when he was carrying around an airsoft gun in a state that allows you to carry in public. While he was on the phone. Turned the other way. With no warning.
Every 28 hours a black person is killed by the police in the good ol' US of A. Yup.
Oh hey, look at how the media presented Mike Brown as a thug and no-good person when he wasn't. He was just a kid.
Don't you dare say it was not a racially motivated crime. I will slap you upside the head with so many links to the contrary it will take you four weeks to come back down to earth.
FFS
I think you've got the evidence/witness part reversed. Wilson is backed up both by forensic evidence and eyewitnesses.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2014/11/29/b99ef7a8-75d3-11e4-a755-e32227229e7b_story.html
author=article
A blood spatter at the scene suggests that Brown moved about 21 feet back toward Wilson after turning around. The pattern of shell casings on the street suggest Wilson was moving backward as he fired at Brown.
Over half a dozen black witnesses back up Wilson
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/10/22/michael-brown-shooting_n_6030220.html
Brown tried to wrestle away Wilson's gun. That's when he got shot first. He was fatally shot when Brown charged Wilson. When you attack a cop, you generally get hurt regardless of your race. This was not a racially motivated shooting. I'm ready for your links.
Also: more white people are fatally shot by cops than black people. Interesting fact.
Right, that's it. Link time.
Grand Jury Testimony and Evidence
Autopsy Report
Witness Testimonies
Eyewitnesses
No struggle
Eyewitness stories all agree on key points
Forensic Pathologist
148 feet away
'Injuries' to cop
Witness testimonies
Orbital Blow blown out of water
Officer's Story Unbelievable
Lying about time
Photos missing of initial autopsy
Shut up and read some shit.
Also, there are some tumblr posts in there. Deal with it. It's a good site for sharing links and images.
Grand Jury Testimony and Evidence
Autopsy Report
Witness Testimonies
Eyewitnesses
No struggle
Eyewitness stories all agree on key points
Forensic Pathologist
148 feet away
'Injuries' to cop
Witness testimonies
Orbital Blow blown out of water
Officer's Story Unbelievable
Lying about time
Photos missing of initial autopsy
Shut up and read some shit.
Also, there are some tumblr posts in there. Deal with it. It's a good site for sharing links and images.
Dyhalto
7536
On the topic of racially motivated lynch behavior, political activist Rev. Edward Pinkney is convicted by an all-white jury despite there being no evidence.
What the actual fuck?
Is this a contest? Are they actually trying to see how lawless they can be and still have right-wing nuts stick up for them?
Is this a contest? Are they actually trying to see how lawless they can be and still have right-wing nuts stick up for them?
every single time every single victim white black or whatever I have the same thought
how THE FUCK were they seriously NOT CHARGED
how THE FUCK were they seriously NOT CHARGED
author=pianotm
What the actual fuck?
Is this a contest? Are they actually trying to see how lawless they can be and still have right-wing nuts stick up for them?
Fact 1) Not all ring wingers are nuts
Fact 2) We don't stick up for cops unless they deserve it (darren wilson)
Fact 3) Left wing nuts stick up for guys like Mumia, Che Guevara, and Bill Ayers.
nurvuss
958
author=harmonic
Being white doesn't mean you can grab cops guns and not be killed. Go ahead, try it.
Are you sure?
author=harmonicauthor=pianotmFact 1) Not all ring wingers are nuts
What the actual fuck?
Is this a contest? Are they actually trying to see how lawless they can be and still have right-wing nuts stick up for them?
Fact 2) We don't stick up for cops unless they deserve it (darren wilson)
Fact 3) Left wing nuts stick up for guys like Mumia, Che Guevara, and Bill Ayers.
Fact 1) I don't think all right winger's are nuts. That's why I specifically used the word "nuts"; to differentiate between the normal right winger and the demented one.
Fact 2) Darren Wilson has very powerful people sticking up for him, and many of them actually resent us "commoners" trying to help them.
Fact 3) The world isn't divided between left-wing and right-wing.
Yeah... for the record, outside of America Left and Right wing either don't exist or have very different beliefs, so...
Also, there is so much proof against Wilson, it's not funny. He's changed his story so many times, the evidence doesn't support his claims and he's had past issues with being an asshole to black people before.
The fact he made Mike out to be a giant demon (despite them being the same height) is also reprehensible. Oh, and there's the small detail of being supported by KKK and neo-nazis...
It doesn't take much to see why he's catching flack for killing an innocent, unarmed black kid who had his hands up and was on his knees. Even if he'd had a gun and had been guilty of the crime, that would still have been enough to put him up on charges of at least man-slaughter IF HE WERE WHITE.
Hello all those school shooters who were white and brought in alive because, dear lord, let's not kill poor white boys who have their whole future against them!!!
Add the many, many, many crimes against black people before and since then by the police...
Also, there is so much proof against Wilson, it's not funny. He's changed his story so many times, the evidence doesn't support his claims and he's had past issues with being an asshole to black people before.
The fact he made Mike out to be a giant demon (despite them being the same height) is also reprehensible. Oh, and there's the small detail of being supported by KKK and neo-nazis...
It doesn't take much to see why he's catching flack for killing an innocent, unarmed black kid who had his hands up and was on his knees. Even if he'd had a gun and had been guilty of the crime, that would still have been enough to put him up on charges of at least man-slaughter IF HE WERE WHITE.
Hello all those school shooters who were white and brought in alive because, dear lord, let's not kill poor white boys who have their whole future against them!!!
Add the many, many, many crimes against black people before and since then by the police...
Here's another one.
People stick up for the cops who kill these people but the problem is that ABSOLUTELY NONE OF THESE THINGS JUSTIFY DEATH.
And Libby, I was moving from Florida back home to Missouri (St. Louis, as a matter of fact...I'm a 20 minute drive from Ferguson) when this shit started, and I was catching this on television stations on the way. Have very distinct memories of things that were said, such as Wilson relating to investigators that he had no knowledge of the cigarellos or the robbery. He later said that he knew about the cigarellos but didn't know Brown was the robber. He finally added that Brown was holding the cigarellos, but Wilson didn't know those were same ones. Also, Wilson had originally said that he had called Brown over to his cruiser (think about that. Who's going to attack an officer in a car?). Then without warning, Brown attacked him! Okay...I could buy that...if Wilson didn't already sound like a nut wagon full of nutty nut bars.
People stick up for the cops who kill these people but the problem is that ABSOLUTELY NONE OF THESE THINGS JUSTIFY DEATH.
And Libby, I was moving from Florida back home to Missouri (St. Louis, as a matter of fact...I'm a 20 minute drive from Ferguson) when this shit started, and I was catching this on television stations on the way. Have very distinct memories of things that were said, such as Wilson relating to investigators that he had no knowledge of the cigarellos or the robbery. He later said that he knew about the cigarellos but didn't know Brown was the robber. He finally added that Brown was holding the cigarellos, but Wilson didn't know those were same ones. Also, Wilson had originally said that he had called Brown over to his cruiser (think about that. Who's going to attack an officer in a car?). Then without warning, Brown attacked him! Okay...I could buy that...if Wilson didn't already sound like a nut wagon full of nutty nut bars.
You know how in Earthbound you could enter "Your favourite thing" in the beginning?
My favourite thing is white people arguing about racism on the internet
EDIT: Yeah, sorry, I made a joke at the expense of white people. But you guys don't mind, right? I mean, you're literally the scum of the earth after all.
My favourite thing is white people arguing about racism on the internet
EDIT: Yeah, sorry, I made a joke at the expense of white people. But you guys don't mind, right? I mean, you're literally the scum of the earth after all.
