IS THE WIIU REALLY THAT BAD?

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Ratty524
The 524 is for 524 Stone Crabs
12986
So, mainly around youtube and a few other gaming forums, it seems cool to talk trash about the WiiU system due to its poor sales and "lack of power." Not to mention the lack of 3rd party support the system has.

I'm wondering if this is actually deserved, however?

Getting past the terrible marketing campaign at its E3 spotlight, most console sales charts show that the Wii U is at least near the level of The Xbone, and the PS4 is dominating out of control.
http://www.vgchartz.com/

Yet looking here shows that absolutely none of the current gen consoles are surpassing their predecessors in sales. Heck, I only know one person in my immediate circle who even ones a current-gen console. The WiiU isn't dying alone, here.

Second, in regards to "power", I was reading up some info about the Cryengine 3 after the debacle that was "Sonic Boom" happened, and it actually works pretty damn well with the system supposedly.

Are people giving the WiiU less credit than what it deserves, or just what the hell is going on with this system?
It is not that bad, and is honestly the most fun console I've owned in a long time.

The games are a hoot, the tablet controller is really cool, and it's backwards compatible with Wii games.

True story: I tried out an Xbone and when I was presented with the menu I instinctively looked down so I could just tap what I wanted to load. Only to realize that I am not holding a tablet controller and that I have to fucking scroll with thumbsticks to get to where I want. That went through my mind and what my first impression of the xbone.

Also, why is the PS4 doing good? I look at it, and I can't think of anything that it is doing interesting other that improved graphix... The xbone intrigues me due to its myriad of features like kinect and tv services. The PS4, what does it got?


The Wii U has a clunky online store, well, just overall clunky online services, but I don't use that much.

But it comes down to the games, and right now the Wii U has all the games that I want to play or games that are going to come out that I want to play.
The Wii U is the only current gen console that I own, mainly because I have a beastly computer and therefore I have no need for the PS4/XBone, since they're just stunted PCs.

My main issues with the system stem from the terrible interface design all around. It seems hard to get anything done in a timely fashion on the Wii U, whether it be buying games on the e-shop, navigating the home menu, connecting to online games or whatever. I just feel like the "OS" of the system isn't really up to par, but that's something Nintendo never really got on with anyways.

Secondly, I don't often see good games coming out on the Wii U, or at least not titles that I wouldn't rather own on Steam (at least when it comes to indie stuff). The Nintendo first party games are obviously up to snuff, which is expected since that's the reason anyone even buys a Nintendo machine nowadays in the first place. As for third party games though, there are basically none, which is pretty disappointing, since the tablet controls are a LOT more interesting than the stupid WiiMotes.

Nintendo just sucks at managing itself as a company and attracting the attention of developers. Ever since the Gamecube Nintendo systems have only really had Nintendo first party games going for them and... That's pretty sad. There's just nothing to do with it, so I don't find myself playing it that much.
Sailerius
did someone say angels
3214
author=f
Second, in regards to "power", I was reading up some info about the Cryengine 3 after the debacle that was "Sonic Boom" happened, and it actually works pretty damn well with the system supposedly.
Well, CryEngine 3 is a last-gen engine, so that's really not saying anything in its favor... CE4 and UE4 don't run on it.

author=f
most console sales charts show that the Wii U is at least near the level of The Xbone
Well, it has also been out for a year longer. That it's only on par with a console with a year's less of content is pretty bad.

The bottom line is that Nintendo is unveiling their next console next year so you'd have to be pretty daft to invest in one now. Wait a year and get it in the bargain bin.
slash
APATHY IS FOR COWARDS
4158
The WiiU is a blast with a few friends. A lot of the NintendoLand games were super fun to play while hanging out and chilling, and I would love to see them do more asymmetric multiplayer stuff like the Mario escape game or the Luigi Mansion game from that. And, of course, Smash is fun with the right crowd.

It's lacking quite a bit in solid single-player games, but for small groups of friends it's a really good time.
There's a Digital Foundry article that's an anonymous developer's tale of developing a launch game for the WiiU that you can read here dated Nov 1st 2014. It's a great read to hear about problems on the WiiU from the developer's side where hardware actually mean something besides numbers to throw around.

Near the end there's a bit where the writer gives his thoughts on why third party developers are avoiding the WiiU:

- Previous development experience using the toolchain and hardware put off development teams from making another title on Wii U.


- The technical and feature support from Nintendo were lacking for third-party studios. There was a feeling internally that if you weren't a first-party development studio, you were largely ignored by Nintendo, as we were superficial to their profits. Internally developed titles would save Nintendo and we were just there to add depth to the games catalogue.


- The sales figures for the Wii U console were not looking that good soon after launch. There was a lot of confusion in the general population around the launch as most people thought that the Wii U was some kind of add-on to the Wii, they didn't know that it was a new console. This lack of awareness probably contributed to the console not getting off to the start that Nintendo would have hoped and put off studio from developing on the hardware.


- Nintendo also fell victim to bad timing. A few months after the console launched the next-gen hype train stepped up a gear as Sony announced the PlayStation 4, with Microsoft joining the fray a few months later. Don't forget that many of the larger studios would have known about the hardware months before it was announced, well before the Wii U hardware actually launched.

(Emphasis mine, general consumer observations that I share with the writer)

An addendum to the first quote, afaik the Wii did not have any sort of OS like the PS3 and 360 did that the user could interact with ingame. All that home button stuff in the Wii was executing code included in the game itself. It was more setup as all games should have the same code for handling the home button and the UI that comes with it instead of a call to the Wii's OS and have it responsible for that. Unsourced, it was something I read on another forum months ago from somebody who said they were a Wii developer... or maybe it was a hacker? If true it helps show how messed up the Wii's API is and how frustrating it can be working with their hardware never mind the debug issues mentioned in the article.

Or more likely the memories of old experiences with Nintendo. Doesn't Nintendo have a long history of treating their third party devs poorly and that was one of the reasons so many went to Sony to work on PS1 games?


He also talks some on the CPU and GPU:
CPU
As far as the CPU optimisations went, yes we did have to cut back on some features due to the CPU not being powerful enough. As we originally feared, trying to support a detailed game running in HD put a lot of strain on the CPUs and we couldn't do as much as we would have liked.


On the GPU side, the story was reversed. The GPU proved very capable and we ended up adding additional "polish" features as the GPU had capacity to do it. There was even some discussion on trying to utilise the GPU via compute shaders (GPGPU) to offload work from the CPU - exactly the approach I expect to see gain traction on the next-gen consoles - but with very limited development time and no examples or guidance from Nintendo, we didn't feel that we could risk attempting this work.

I'd assume it was a factor, maybe not the primary one (see the above quote on third party dev issues for more!), as to why Unreal Engine 4 and EA's Frostbite Engine won't be available on the Wii U.



As for current gen sales lacking compared to last gen sales, your wikipedia link only compares totals instead of y/y from launch which would be more helpful. There's also economic factors to consider like less real take home pay decreasing and the lack of selling features. You could already play with your friends online in "HD" last gen, what's the pressure to get the new console? The Japanese console market is falling apart too which isn't helping sales.


e:
author=Sailerius
The bottom line is that Nintendo is unveiling their next console next year so you'd have to be pretty daft to invest in one now. Wait a year and get it in the bargain bin.

Ahahahahaha, nice. Place your bets if Nintendo has learned anything from the WiiU or if they'll make the same mistakes again!

(I got a WiiU at launch. Never again
)
I find myself playing it a lot. At first it was only Smash Bros, which is the reason I bought one. But now I have some classic games like Super Metroid and Megamans and Ice climbers and Zelda Minish cap. I just beat How To Survive and I have pinball and darksiders 2. Most of which I got for free/on sale. It's great to crawl into bed and play some games or watch netflix to fall asleep. I love the touch screen. I don't like handheld gaming but when it's an extra screen and not the only screen, it makes more sense to me. It's convenient. Plus it's a full sized screen and controls, not tiny buttons designed for 8 year old hands.

I don't mind the store interface. The PS store is the worst. It's all high res info with long "lines" of tiles you have to scroll through. It takes forever to load and navigate. Much worse than the Nintendo Store, which has a quicker loading tile based main menu with easy to read and navigate category lists. They have tons of sales and there's no additional costs. Could use some more better games, but I certainly have enough to keep me going with more great games on the horizon. Mario Maker anyone?

There are wait times when going to things like the settings page, but there was that kind of slowness when navigating on the PS menu's too. Xbox has the better menu system but at least now on WiiU you can bring up a browser while the game is loaded and look up walkthroughs.

As for gfx power? I find it good enough. Smash Bros looks amazing and the next gens are barely more powerful in terms of how it looks. They might have more realistic collisions and hair physics, but there are still plenty of low res textures. In the games I played, anyways.
Ratty524
The 524 is for 524 Stone Crabs
12986
I kind of figured there was some hardware issues with the console that discouraged third parties from developing games from it, but damn. A shitty debugger? Long compilation times? Rotten support from the core company itself? It sounds like this system was rushed to catch up with the last gen, but then then their competitors already leaped a full step ahead of them by the time the WiiU was released.

I'm still more attracted to the WiiU's library over that of other consoles, though. I feel like the games out on the Xboner and PS4 look same-y.
author=kentona
But it comes down to the games, and right now the Wii U has all the games that I want to play or games that are going to come out that I want to play.
I've been considering getting a Wii U ever since I got a new tv (that is actually HD and not a fifteen year old behemoth) but so far I've been putting it off. Mostly because of the opposite reason from Kentona. There doesn't seem to be any games I really, really want to play.

My sister and her husband got a Wii U for Christmas and playing Super Mario Kart is a lot of fun and they've also had use of the tablet approach where she has been playing some SNES game on the tablet while her husband is playing PS4 on the TV.

But the fact that everyone keeps saying that Nintendo's online infrastructure is horrible and stuff like the games being expensive (as a PC gamer I'm spoiled I guess)

Most of the games I might be interested in are digital download games and Virtual Console games (that should still exist right?( but due to Nintendo being strange in their online thingies I'm afraid any such games will just disappear at any time. (again, too spoiled by Steam and how awesome it is with moving your library from one machine to another)

So those are the reasons I'm hesitant towards shelling out money for a Wii U. But of all the consoles Wii U is the most intersting to me. It just isn't interesting enough.
unity
You're magical to me.
12540
I don't have any current gen systems except for a 3DS. Last generation, I had access to both an XBox 360 and a Wii, so I missed a few PS3 exclusives. So while I have no real desire to get a current gen console, if I did, I might go for PS4 if they have downloadable PS3 games available. That, and it'd be nice to have a Blu-ray player.

More on-topic, from what I've seen, I don't think WiiU is bad. It's just not as essential as maybe the Wii was to me. Though, am I missing any awesome RPGs that are on WiiU that I don't know about?
author=Shinan
Most of the games I might be interested in are digital download games and Virtual Console games (that should still exist right?( but due to Nintendo being strange in their online thingies I'm afraid any such games will just disappear at any time. (again, too spoiled by Steam and how awesome it is with moving your library from one machine to another)

Yeah, VC's still there. There's technically two of them now: One for the WiiU (which has save-states and configurable controls and can be played with the gamepad), and the old Wii one you can access through the Wii menu. Any VC titles you have on a regular Wii can be transferred to a WiiU, but doing so removes them from the Wii console. And finally, if you own a Wii VC game (on the WiiU), you can also buy the WiiU version for a flat $1.50 if you really want those save-states/controller-config/not having to grab a WiiMote and go in to the Wii menu.

Honestly, I think VC is half the reason to own a Wii/U.

As for online, well, Smash is the only game I've tried, and it was about as wonky as anything I tried on 360. I don't even know how friending and invites work. MiiVerse (pseudo Twitter thing) is kinda cool I guess, though given Nintendo's primary age group, most of the posts are stupid. It's at least pretty well moderated, though. Perhaps overly moderated...

author=Link2112
The PS store is the worst.

Damn straight it is (on PS3). Slow as balls; disorganized as hell; 2/3 of the titles have no screenshots, videos, demos, genre tags, or much of anything telling you what it is; you always have to buy a minimum of $5; crashes on me constantly... Please tell me the PS4 has improved!
e. And finally, if you own a Wii VC game (on the WiiU), you can also buy the WiiU version for a flat $1.50 if you really want those save-states/controller-config/not having to grab a WiiMote and go in to the Wii menu.

I. DID. NOT. KNOW. THIS.


brb spending like $15.


I watched Smash battles online and played Mario Karyt 8 online once. Both seemed fine, but that is a very limited sample window. I didn't get a console to play online, though. That's what PCs are for.
Windwaker HD looks great on the Wii U.
The PS store can't be as bad as the Nintendo one because one has discovered a wonderful technology known as a shopping cart. I'd consider buying some Theaterrythm DLC if I didn't have to buy them one at a time.

Can't comment on the Wii U's store, I got a basic one and never intended to buy games online through Nintendo. Plus having five physical games is enough to max out my Wii U's storage, should've seen that one coming!



e: I may be a bit bitter about how Nintendo has done things recently
author=unity
Though, am I missing any awesome RPGs that are on WiiU that I don't know about?
Nope. There are a few but I think they are mediocre. In the way they look, anyways. But there is one game coming this year that has me really excited



I heard it has some kind of online multiplayer aspect to it. It's gonna be tight, y'all!

I play Smash Bros online almost daily and it works great as long as you are connected to someone close with a good connection. I have a pretty low speed, 7mbps, and I still have mostly good connections. I don't play against anyone with japanese name tags, that's guaranteed to be laggy for me. When I play with ppl in the same province, it's always a fast connection. If there is lag, I don't notice it.

author=GreatRedSpirit
Plus having five physical games is enough to max out my Wii U's storage, should've seen that one coming!
You can plug in any usb HDD for storage. I read that if you fill the WiiU's storage, it makes the system run slow, like when your switching between menus and loading up a game. But if you put everything on an external it avoids that problem.
Puddor
if squallbutts was a misao category i'd win every damn year
5702
Nintendo consoles are almost exclusively for Nintendo games. And given I did not have an N64 or a Gamecube or a Gameboy growing up, no Nintendo-exclusive titles really do it for me. The only one I'm remotely interested in is Legend of Zelda, and I own a 3DS (when I have some cash I'll probably look into MM). Even though my 3DS is currently a Square Enix machine.

So, if you aren't hardcore Nintendo, Wii U just isn't a viable console. If I do get another Nintendo console it will be the New 3DS, because my 3DS is having issues and I want to continue playing my 3DS titles. Plus that overhauled Xenogears title will be on the New 3DS as well.

In terms of the PS3's store, I don't know about that $5 minimum (I've bought 90c avatars and $2 themes before in single transactions). It IS fucking slow (and I've had it crash) and it needs a serious overhaul, but the actual available library is pretty massive. Majority of classic PS1 titles are available, a great deal of indie titles, a number of PS3 games, bundles of series' like RE and Jak & Daxter, etc.

I'll probably be getting a PS4 as my next-gen console. And not just for Square Enix titles, ftr (even though I already own Type-0 and will be buying XV and KH3). I'm really interested in The Order 1886, Bloodbourne, and a few other titles I can't bring up on a whim. At the very least, any titles that are dual console, I'd rather play on a PS4.

The PS4 also has a pretty nice controller ngl
author=Link_2112
You can plug in any usb HDD for storage. I read that if you fill the WiiU's storage, it makes the system run slow, like when your switching between menus and loading up a game. But if you put everything on an external it avoids that problem.


Sure, but I think it's bullshit that I have to throw more money at a console to play games on it. If I was purchasing games online I'd say it was foolish of me to buy the basic version (all the deluxes were sold out, another reason why it was foolish to get one at launch) but if owning five games * is enough to hit the capacity of the basic then I'd rather not throw good money after bad.


* One being Hyrule Warriors which I think takes up more space on its patches than the others combined.
Yeah, 32GB is pretty damn pathetic, but at least it actually supports external drives... dunno why 360 only supports 32GB thumbdrives (or only uses 32GB of whatever USB storage you connect to it) that also doesn't allow for file sizes larger than 4GB. Real pain in the ass when you've got your main drive filled up with 6~7GB On Demand or mandatory install games.

I don't know about that $5 minimum ... but the actual available library is pretty massive.
I tried to buy a $2.50 game with no money in the wallet some time last year and it told me I need to add a minimum of five dollars of funds to the wallet. Maybe they've changed the policy since then, or maybe I was just using the wrong pay option. I dunno.
And yeah, no doubt PSN has tons of great games. Plenty of good classics in there, too. It's just too bad about the store itself.

It's really hard to deny that Nintendo has been behind on the technology beyond their gimmicks, which even then go underutilized. I mean, really, how many Wii games actually had well-programmed motion controls that didn't just feel like a roundabout way of pressing a button or a broken right analogue stick. They really live by the weight of their first-party game franchises and the fans who buy them (like me).
8GB for the original basic version. Which translates into something like 7.5 GB capacity then there's the OS and all of its patches and you have like two gigs left for everything else and let me tell you that goes real quick. It's a good thing Nintendo doesn't subsidize their consoles because otherwise they probably wouldn't make a dime off me.
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