AMERICANA DAWN

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Australian settler culture is even younger than the U.S. (excluding Aboriginal folklore/culture obviously, which is like tens of thousands of years old)...So to me, America does have a richer folklore, and - yeah, maybe the novelty of not actually being taught much of its history in school is why I find this game, and Americana in general, appealing.

Anyway, let me reiterate THOSE GRAPHICS ARE BEAUTIFUL.
author=Max McGee
EDIT: Holy shitfucks! You guys, how has no one commented on the fact that SovanJedi, SOVAN FUCKING JEDI, is on this team?

Or am I just too old.


Nope, I also had a WTH moment, then investigated. Glad to see that Sovan Jedi is actually in the business of making games these days, although I am not utterly attracted to their Super House of Dead Ninjas.
I'm pretty indifferent about the subject matter as well, but there's no denying that this project is impressive from an aesthetic and technical sensibility alone. (Especially considering the smaller scope of the original Kickstarter) From what I've heard around, YDS poured her heart into this project over the past two years. I think that's something a lot of us can't say.

I hope it meets success! Kickstarter is a great tool for developers who want to eventually break out of RPGMaker, etc.. into the deeper larger indie scene.
Why is this in Kickstarter? I thought it already started production years ago.



And no. This question was not answered to my satisfaction by the previous posts.
(I've always thought the game looked great despite it not being my thing, it's just that I'd also like to see it completed)
Solitayre
Circumstance penalty for being the bard.
18257
No demo, no prototype for a game that's been in production for something like five years?

If YDS were here I'd ask her if she's really ready to ask for $70,000.
unity
You're magical to me.
12540
Forgive me if I'm showing my ignorance, but have any of these Kickstarter indie RPG projects ever resulted in a completed game? I backed a couple of them a few years ago and even though they reached their funding goals, they never completed anything.
Max McGee
with sorrow down past the fence
9159
Whoa, really? I'm not like an indie funding expert or anything but my thinking was that like when a project funds and fails to deliver it is a HUGE DEAL and the people involved are generally blacklisted forever. But I know way more about indie TTRPG kickstarters than I do videogames--in the tabletop world, that is definitely the case. Fund a kickstarter and fail to deliver and INTO THE HALL OF SHAME YOU GO FOREVER. So I've got a lot of pressure to actually get this game out, lol, because we funded by over 400%.

(Unity forgive my ignorance but who is the lady on your new avatar.)
Solitayre
Circumstance penalty for being the bard.
18257
Yeah, these DreamTeam Supergames always tend to go exactly nowhere. YDS has made some cute and stylish stuff but she has never produced anything, to my knowledge, that was much longer than 20 minutes or so in length. The scope of this project is to cover the history of three real world wars with 8 playable characters, two different combat systems, 100% original art and music...

Sorry, no, without a demo to demonstrate that there's an actual game here somewhere, I wouldn't put any money in this and I have to strongly recommend no one else does either. The fact that she seems to be asking for money up front to have all her assets completed first is completely backwards, in my opinion. Make the game first, then ask people for money to add all the art and extra features you want.
unity
You're magical to me.
12540
author=Solitayre
Sorry, no, without a demo to demonstrate that there's an actual game here somewhere, I wouldn't put any money in this and I have to strongly recommend no one else does either. The fact that she seems to be asking for money up front to have all her assets completed first is completely backwards, in my opinion. Make the game first, then ask people for money to add all the art and extra features you want.


Yeah, given how easy many people think it is to start a good RPG and then are hit with the real weight of what they want to create, I think you should at least have a demo before you go asking for money. Like you said, a game with playable content that captures the spirit of the game but is lacking polish that money would provide is a million times better than some polished screenshots and no demo at all.

author=Max McGee
(Unity forgive my ignorance but who is the lady on your new avatar.)


Agrias Oaks from Final Fantasy Tactics, in what's probably the most revealing outfit I've ever seen her in XD (but looks a little Christmasy, I think). I love Agrias.
Max McGee
with sorrow down past the fence
9159
Wow, I have played that game in its entirety multiple times and I certainly did not recognize her in that outfit.

/tangent

author=Solitayre
Yeah, these DreamTeam Supergames always tend to go exactly nowhere. YDS has made some cute and stylish stuff but she has never produced anything, to my knowledge, that was much longer than 20 minutes or so in length. The scope of this project is to cover the history of three real world wars with 8 playable characters, two different combat systems, 100% original art and music...

Sorry, no, without a demo to demonstrate that there's an actual game here somewhere, I wouldn't put any money in this and I have to strongly recommend no one else does either. The fact that she seems to be asking for money up front to have all her assets completed first is completely backwards, in my opinion. Make the game first, then ask people for money to add all the art and extra features you want.

I gotta say man this is mad harsh. Like I tend to be a bit harsh myself but...damn.
@Max: Yeah I agree. As much as I'd like to bring KS people down to reality there's a point where I have no idea where the line is for people like Soli

Why even bother using kickstarter if you have the hardest part already done? First someone shows 2 mock up shots and that's obviously not good enough, then someone shows some ingame cutscenes and maybe a little gameplay, and that's not good enough which I guess is fair. But then you have this game that obviously has an actual engine, gameplay footage, more pixel art to cover more than just one screen, an entire ost which is more than 4k can buy. No not good enough, needs a demo like that'll be any different.

I can see where the development cynicism comes from, as it is rpg maker, the land of recruitment threads with idea guys hiring for credits... and also a place where not finishing games is a disease or something. But this shit happens in the commercial game industry as well. I do not think many producers got greenlit because they happened to have half a game done in their closet. It's okay to promise and ask for some confidence.

No one has really mentioned it yet but uh, almost everyone wants this to go down like Rainfall it feels. Just saying.

LouisCyphre
can't make a bad game if you don't finish any games
4523
I really do want to see how the combat eventually turned out like in this game, though. I vaguely remember being asked for input way back, long before I had any idea what I was doing.

author=Max McGee
Wow, I have played that game in its entirety multiple times and I certainly did not recognize her in that outfit.


I did, because I am part trash.
author=Darken
No one has really mentioned it yet but uh, almost everyone wants this to go down like Rainfall it feels. Just saying.

The reputation of doing a kickstarter in general seems tainted(around here at least), but I keep my mind open. I would like to see this one succeed so there's one more promising looking project that actually delivers. That way we can site it as one of the good examples.
author=unity
Forgive me if I'm showing my ignorance, but have any of these Kickstarter indie RPG projects ever resulted in a completed game? I backed a couple of them a few years ago and even though they reached their funding goals, they never completed anything.

What games were those? So far I've had no bad experience of the sort with KS, though I guess I do tend to back slightly bigger projects on average.

Oh well, guess I'll still back this one, just in case. Even just helping someone out there live the dream may be worth it.
Max McGee
with sorrow down past the fence
9159
Why even bother using kickstarter if you have the hardest part already done?

Well I mean, again, videogames are different than the more papery kind but, generally speaking in the TTRPG industry, the hardest part isn't the most expensive part. If you're going to crowdfund an indie tabletop game, the basic expectation is that you actually have the writing of the manuscript 75% or 100% done before you ask for money that will cover the bulk of the art and publishing costs. As I found out during my KS, some people won't even consider funding those kinds of projects unless the actual writing (i.e. creation) of the game is 100% done. This is probably pretty off topic, but I thought it was interesting.
Solitayre
Circumstance penalty for being the bard.
18257
author=Darken
@Max: Yeah I agree. As much as I'd like to bring KS people down to reality there's a point where I have no idea where the line is for people like Soli



A manageable scope, for one. YDS already held a Kickstarter for this yet produced no game. There doesn't appear to be any sense that she has managed expectations or scaled the game appropriately. The game is bigger than ever and she's asking for more money than ever.

Throwing $70,000 at this game isn't going to make it more likely to be finished.
DE
*click to edit*
1313
It pains me to do so, but I have to agree with Soli. Even when I worked on AM, back when it was still the game the original backers paid for, I repeatedly told Max to reign it in. Shortly after I left, she basically overhauled the entire game, scrapping most of the assets. I then knew the game was suffering from the most fatal of flaws - overambition.

What AM aims to be is Suikoden, but on a fraction of its budget. Needless to say, it's a doomed effort. There is no guarantee that should she get those 70 grand, she won't start the game over again, squandering most of what has been done so far. She already did that once after the first KS. What do the backers have to show for their support? Not the game they paid for, that's for sure.

The scope is so vast, it'd be grand for an established Japanese studio in the 90s, let alone a motley crew spread all over the globe. Add to this the lack of accountability on Kickstarter (vide Rainfall and hundreds of other projects that will never see the light of day... or refunds), and there's no chance in hell I'd back a game like this. It reeks of development hell. It lacks restraint, it lacks a clear business and development plan, it has all the trappings of a dream game instead of feasible game. It's another specimen of the emerging generation of post-RPG Maker vaporware, only this time it is *we* who pay a tidy sum for each to never be completed, fueling their flights of fancy. Where there was creator's spare time, there now is would-be players' cash.

You could give this 200 grand and I doubt it'd impact the likelihood of its completion any. But if you like to waste your money on someone's folly, be my guest.
unity
You're magical to me.
12540
author=Hasvers
author=unity
Forgive me if I'm showing my ignorance, but have any of these Kickstarter indie RPG projects ever resulted in a completed game? I backed a couple of them a few years ago and even though they reached their funding goals, they never completed anything.
What games were those? So far I've had no bad experience of the sort with KS, though I guess I do tend to back slightly bigger projects on average.

RAiN (sent out refunds), Dungeon Panic! (indefinite hiatus), Echoes of Eternia (was supposed to be finished over a year ago and shows no signs of nearing completion). Maybe I'm just the worst chooser of RPGs to back on Kickstarter ever, but after being disappointed so often, it's hard to be optimistic.

I'm not looking to rain on anyone's parade, but the simple fact is that it's a hell of a lot easier to generate some good-looking screenshots than it is to put together a working demo, and a lot of these people seem to go into this with no freaking clue on how long it's going to take to actually make their project, much less how to use the money they're gathering wisely.

If someone's project gets funded, they get the money, they spend it, and then they scrap it all to start over and do a new Kickstarter to get even more money, then it seems to be that they've broken trust with all the people that funded them in the first place.

author=Max McGee
Why even bother using kickstarter if you have the hardest part already done?
Well I mean, again, videogames are different than the more papery kind but, generally speaking in the TTRPG industry, the hardest part isn't the most expensive part.

This. No one says that the demo you put together has to be perfect. That's what all the money's for, afterall! But I don't think it's too much to ask to have one. Because anyone with stars in their eyes can say they plan to do something, but it takes a level of determination and follow-through that I'm finding is surprisingly rare to actually complete a project.

author=LouisCyphre
author=Max McGee
Wow, I have played that game in its entirety multiple times and I certainly did not recognize her in that outfit.
I did, because I am part trash.

Why does that make you trash? XD
Max McGee
with sorrow down past the fence
9159
It pains me to do so, but I have to agree with Soli. Even when I worked on AM, back when it was still the game the original backers paid for, I repeatedly told Max to reign it in.

hold up sorry YDS' real name is 'Max'? or wait...AM? I thought the game was called American Dawn?

Anyway...idk....70,000 honestly seems a bit high to me. I feel like if she'd asked for like...30,000 she'd totally have got it, and I think with a smaller and slightly less ambitious team, she could have made the game with that. But I'm not so sure she's gonna fund (with or without our help/support).

The one thing I know for sure about this is that going from an ask of 2,000 to an ask of 70,000 is a crazy fucking leap straight out of crazytown.