IS THERE A LANGUAGE NAME FOR RM2K/3 EVENT SCRIPT?

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Obviously, it's not C++, or Java, or anything else like that, but the text that appears in the script editors for your inputted commands in RM2K/3 certainly seem to exhibit the traits of qualifying as a programming language (even if only a very narrow, focused, and limited one (not to overstate that last adjective)). Does it have a name? I've wondered this for many years now. Or is it just "RM2K/3 event script"? lol. Not to be confused with RPGXP's (and onwards') RGSS language. I'm not talking about that.

I guess that the main reason why I ask is because I don't know any "real" programming languages despite my very intimate familiarity with RM2K/3 event script possibly being able to give me a leg-up from the start. When I tell people that I make games, and they ask me what programming language(s) I know, the ensuing response which itself tends to demand an explanation in its own right is a tiresome and dissatisfying answer for both myself and the expectant listener, which is an annoyance that could potentially be solved by simply having a proper name.
As far as I know, it doesn't have a name, but I can tell you it's not a "real" scripting language or anything. Typically, any sort of coding language can be completely textual (no GUI to interact with). For instance, you could write uncompiled C++, Java, Ruby, HTML or something entirely in a text editor, but in 2k3's case, you have to use the GUI editor (point and clicking your way through), and the scripts basically get saved into the lmu files with a mess of other information related to the maps that you can't edit other than with the editor.

That's not to say you can't do a lot with 2k3's scripting, but there's a lot of roundabout ways of doing things that from a programming perspective are really inefficient. For instance, to make a custom battle system or menu system, you really have to understand how certain scripting techniques impact performance, and can only build that sense through trial and error. Prior to using DynRPG (C++ built into the unofficial 2k3), I've basically built menu systems multiple times just trying to get them to be faster, more responsive, and more efficient.
author=PepsiOtaku
Typically, any sort of coding language can be completely textual (no GUI to interact with). For instance, you could write uncompiled C++, Java, Ruby, HTML or something entirely in a text editor, but in 2k3's case, you have to use the GUI editor (point and clicking your way through)

Right. But a person well-versed enough in the event scripting's syntax and grammar could potentially write it out in an all-text environment if the program would allow such an input method. So that potential does exist, even if no one has ever made that potential happen yet, to date. Well... with the exception of a few minor (but still important) details that just don't seem to end up in the text area.

author=PepsiOtaku
That's not to say you can't do a lot with 2k3's scripting, but there's a lot of roundabout ways of doing things that from a programming perspective are really inefficient.

This would be the "limited" factor I mentioned, yeah.

author=PepsiOtaku
For instance, to make a custom battle system or menu system, you really have to understand how certain scripting techniques impact performance, and can only build that sense through trial and error.

And this would be the "narrow and focused" factor I mentioned. :P (RM2K3's focus doesn't encapsulate these normally-important things; it's very narrow)

author=PepsiOtaku
Prior to using DynRPG (C++ built into the unofficial 2k3), I've basically built menu systems multiple times just trying to get them to be faster, more responsive, and more efficient.

I think that vanilla 2k/3 is generally not given enough credit (not to say that you're not giving it any credit or anything). I find that I can do just about anything in it if I really put my mind to it. Albeit, it is very inefficient in a lot of ways, like you said. So I don't disagree.

In short, I completely agree with your analysis, but I don't think that these limitations make it a "fake" programming language. Kind of in the same way that the simplified and highly reduced grammatical power of a spoken "pigin" language doesn't make that language any less of a spoken language; it just makes it a highly simplified and reduced spoken language. I feel like the highly reduced environmental scope of 2K/3 doesn't make it any less of a programming language; it just makes it a highly simplified and reduced programming language.

However, that's just my opinion, and you're free to disagree, of course. Admittedly, not being well-versed in any "real" programming language, my opinion is not *fully* informed, but I do feel that I know enough about the subject for my perspective to be worth mentioning, at least.

Either way, whether "real" or otherwise, I still feel like it needs a name...
Sailerius
did someone say angels
3214
author=Tor_Heyerdal
Right. But a person well-versed enough in the event scripting's syntax and grammar could potentially write it out in an all-text environment if the program would allow such an input method. So that potential does exist, even if no one has ever made that potential happen yet, to date. Well... with the exception of a few minor (but still important) details that just don't seem to end up in the text area.
The text representation is only for your convenience. It's probably just binary data. If you're at the level that you can read and write that kind of data and are finding yourself limited by the editor, you're probably better off just scripting it in XP+.
Pretty much always just called it eventing or event script if you're feelin' fancy.
author=Sailerius
The text representation is only for your convenience. It's probably just binary data.

I guess you're probably right.

author=Sailerius
If you're at the level that you can read and write that kind of data and are finding yourself limited by the editor, you're probably better off just scripting it in XP+.

You're probably right about that too. lol. But I'm stubborn, and I stick to what I know. But perhaps more importantly, I feel like I need to release a finished product on this platform before I can justify to myself having spent over a decade of my life mastering it. Maybe that's just me, though. ::shrug:: I think that after I'm finished with my project, I'll likely sit down to really learn a "real" programming language once and for all.

author=Liberty
Pretty much always just called it eventing or event script if you're feelin' fancy.

Right, and that's all well and good most of the time, but it doesn't work well as an answer.
"You make games? Cool. What programming languages do you know?"
"Eventing."
"What?"

lol. :P
Then it's time you move on to RPG Maker XP and above if you're serious about game making. Because the so-called "scripting" in RM2k/3 is not even true programming language. If anything, this so-called "scripting" is pretty much exclusive to RM2k/3, though it is definitely still code-able in XP and above (called Common Events).

Well, either way, if you are able to create highly advanced stuff using Common Events alone, then programming shouldn't be a problem in XP and above. You should see some games (such as Seraphic Blue) that have very complex Common Events to create custom battle systems, menus and such.
Sailerius
did someone say angels
3214
author=Tor_Heyerdal
author=Liberty
Pretty much always just called it eventing or event script if you're feelin' fancy.

Right, and that's all well and good most of the time, but it doesn't work well as an answer.
"You make games? Cool. What programming languages do you know?"
"Eventing."
"What?"

lol. :P
The eventing system isn't a programming language, so I guess the answer would be "none." An event's underlying representation is just an array of commands which gets executed sequentially. If you use XP+, you can look at the event execution code to see exactly how it works.

There's not really any shame in admitting that you don't know a programming language. Most engines have some form of visual programming system that non-coders can use, whether it be first-party like UE4's Blueprints or third-party like Unity's PlayMaker.

That said, if you're afraid of making the jump, it's not that hard. There's a big learning curve in the very beginning, but once you grasp the basics, it's much easier and faster to script something than to try to do it with events.
Magi
Resident Terrapin
1028
It's probably Borland Delphi under the hood, but most people just refer to event scripting systems as "point and click".

author=eplipswich
Then it's time you move on to RPG Maker XP and above if you're serious about game making. Because the so-called "scripting" in RM2k/3 is not even true programming language.
Idk, this has always been such a weird argument. RPG Makers with proper scripting systems are by and large more flexible, but it still has a "hobbyists" tool status compared to more robust software. Game development is such a wide field of skills and abilities that you can use any piece of software and it's as serious as you decide to make it.
author=Sailerius
The eventing system isn't a programming language, so I guess the answer would be "none." An event's underlying representation is just an array of commands which gets executed sequentially.

I personally have a difficult time accepting that it's possible to make video games without programming. If I'm programming, then I must be using a programming language, since you kind of can't program without one. Even if the format in which I'm doing so is like the programming equivalent of tracing. lol.

Maybe that's a better analogy. It's still a "programming language" in the way that tracing is still "drawing". Although I really didn't intend for this thread to become a debate on the taxonomic analysis of pre-Ruby RPGM scripting. lol. Although it has proven interesting, nonetheless.

author=eplipswich
Well, either way, if you are able to create highly advanced stuff using Common Events alone, then programming shouldn't be a problem in XP and above. You should see some games (such as Seraphic Blue) that have very complex Common Events to create custom battle systems, menus and such.

Yeah, my current project has over 500 common events. They're like the core engine that drives the game. Though I'm sure I don't need to tell you that. :P
author=Magi
It's probably Borland Delphi under the hood, but most people just refer to event scripting systems as "point and click".

If true, then this is probably the closest I can get to an answer to this question.

author=Magi
Idk, this has always been such a weird argument. RPG Makers with proper scripting systems are by and large more flexible, but it still has a "hobbyists" tool status compared to more robust software. Game development is such a wide field of skills and abilities that you can use any piece of software and it's as serious as you decide to make it.


I feel the same way, yeah.
Why do you feel the need to apply a name to it. You're not scripting at all, you're point and clicking, so you're not using any scripting language. Instead just say "I use 2k/3". If all you use IS 2k/3 then you don't script, YOU'RE not using a script (the program is, but YOU aren't) - it's as easy as that.
Mirak
Stand back. Artist at work. I paint with enthusiasm if not with talent.
9300
author=Tor_Heyerdal
Right, and that's all well and good most of the time, but it doesn't work well as an answer.
"You make games? Cool. What programming languages do you know?"
"Eventing."
"What?"

lol. :P
Well going by this example, you could answer "i use rpg maker 2003, an engine that requires no programming knowledge" like any honest person would. :v

If you want to wear the programmer nametag then do learn a proper programming language but in rpg2003 you're not really hardcoding anything, so you don't even qualify as a programmer in that regard if all that you ever use is that version of rpgmaker.
Sailerius
did someone say angels
3214
author=Tor_Heyerdal
author=Magi
It's probably Borland Delphi under the hood, but most people just refer to event scripting systems as "point and click".
If true, then this is probably the closest I can get to an answer to this question.

You're going to feel very silly if the person asking you is an actual Delphi programmer and they try to engage you in conversation about it. I wouldn't recommend it.
author=Mirak
Well going by this example, you could answer "i use rpg maker 2003, an engine that requires no programming knowledge" like any honest person would. :v

That would be the tiresome and awkward explanation that I mentioned.

author=Mirak
If you want to wear the programmer nametag then do learn a proper programming language

Okay, this feels a little elitist to me. Maybe I should've expected that coming in here, but I didn't. lol.

author=Mirak
you're not really hardcoding anything, so you don't even qualify as a programmer in that regard if all that you ever use is that version of rpgmaker.
I at least agree that I *should* learn something more "serious" (for want of a less dismissive term), but to say that the lack of having done so means that I don't even program to begin with? That's kind of harsh, in'nt it? I'm not here to compete with anyone, though. I'm just a guy who programs in 2K3. If that makes me a not-a-programmer, then okay. I don't have to wear a nametag. Though I respectfully disagree with your perspective.

I just want to be able to tell people what I do without a dozen asterisks and without giving people the mistaken impression that all I do is produce regurgitated reskins of essentially the same game, which is what people usually assume as soon as the word "RPG Maker" is mentioned (at least in my experience). If that's not possible, I can accept that. I just figured that if it were, then this would likely be the place where someone would know the information I was looking for.
author=Sailerius
You're going to feel very silly if the person asking you is an actual Delphi programmer and they try to engage you in conversation about it. I wouldn't recommend it.


Hahaha, yeah, no. I wouldn't go around saying such a thing, either. lol. "Closest thing" to the answer I was looking for isn't close "enough" to the answer I was looking for to treat it as though it were in actual practice. lol. I'm totally with you on that. xD
Mirak
Stand back. Artist at work. I paint with enthusiasm if not with talent.
9300
Like, i didn't even try to be elitist, i'm just being truthful. You're technically coding, but the emphasis is on technically, since you're mostly using a point and click interface. I mean i guess it's elitist if real programmers don't consider rpgmaker 2003 programming, but i wouldn't be able to say that that assesment is not fair. It IS true that terms and uses of variables you learn in eventing can be translated fairly easy in other programming languages, but you're not hardcoding them in rpg2k3.

Like, i'm not here to tell you what you should or should not call yourself (i use rpg2003 too, and game maker studio which i did have to learn some gml of but i digress), i'm sorry if i came off this way, but it is true that using 2003 is not using xp+.
author=Mirak
You're technically coding, but the emphasis is on technically, since you're mostly using a point and click interface. I mean i guess it's elitist if real programmers don't consider rpgmaker 2003 programming, but i wouldn't be able to say that that assesment is not fair.


I completely agree. I apologize if I gave the impression that I was not speaking within the context of a technicality. I agree that even for someone like myself who will call it programming, it only barely qualifies by the skin of its teeth. That's why I find it understandable that people might disagree with me on this.

author=Mirak
but it is true that using 2003 is not using xp+.


Yup. Absolutely. Not arguing that point either. :)
I hope I'm not adding fuel for a flame war here, but...as somebody who has a degree in computer science and who has been heavily involved in using an uncontested programming language (C++) to extend RM2K3, I'm going to cast a vote on the "RM2K3 eventing is programming" side. Programmers tend to make a distinction between "programming languages" and "scripting languages" based on whether it's compiled into a machine-language executable or interpreted at run-time, but the essential skills involved are the same. A program is a set of instructions for a machine to carry out. It's largely immaterial how the instructions are encoded, or input by the coder. I'd also argue that saying "You don't need to know programming to use RM2K3" is like saying "You don't need to know how to play platformers to play Mario". You don't need prior knowledge because it's a relatively easy environment to learn those skills, but you will be doing it, and it'll be easier if you're already experienced.

And to answer the original question, I typically call it RM2K3 scripting.
There is no answer. That should be clear by now. All you will get is each person's interpretation of what it's called. So just pick one or make up your own.
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