HOW DO YOU STOP GOING BACK??

Posts

Pages: 1
To anyone working on/who has worked on a game for an extended period, I'm wondering how you deal with the issue of going back and redoing certain things you might have done earlier in the game that you've figured out a better way of managing later on after more experience. I'm talking either redrawing things, or remaking entire events from scratch?

Do you just leave the early game in your projects as is? Or do you go back numerous times to redo things? When is it enough??

One example is I've redrawn projectile weapon animations three times now. 100+ guns times 5+ characters is a lot of redrawing...

I'm wondering how the rest of you deal with things like this.
Unless it's something major or a fundamental system that affects everything, leave the revisions until much later, preferably towards the end of development. And make as many major decisions about the game as early in development as possible, because holding off a major variable until later will very likely bring things to a halt when you decide what it is.

Going back mid-way will mean you will eventually go back a second time. And a third, and a fourth, and that's how so many indie projects never get finished.

This is especially true for any "art evolution" that your game experiences during development if you're doing custom assets. No matter what, your game's early areas will look nothing like later ones. So I strongly recommend waiting until much later in the project to redo your graphics: tackle it all at once, so that art evolution becomes less of an issue. Absolutely resist the urge to do this more than once.
unity
You're magical to me.
12540
Sgt M said it right. An imperfect completed project beats out a perfect project you never finish. And your skills are going to keep improving, so yeah, making everything before you go back and remake/redraw everything is super solid advice.

There are plenty of things I file away for future projects, too, rather than undoing hours of work to re-implement them in my current project, tho this may just be a "me" thing. For example, finding a slicker way to show when the player has found an item than just the standard text box. Instead of going back and redoing hundreds of item pickups, I just file it away for "this will be cool for my next project" and keep my current method consistent for the current game.
a powerful combination of apathy and narcissism - by not caring about your past works while simultaneously believing that everything you make is above reproach, you too can avoid reworking your old crappy stuff!
Sooz
They told me I was mad when I said I was going to create a spidertable. Who’s laughing now!!!
5354
Making the perfect the enemy of the good is a problem for creators of any kind of long-term project! In addition to the workflow advice others have given, it's a good idea to change your mindset.

Your first goal: get into the habit of just treating things as done when they're done. Yeah, you could probably do this part better, and this part over here looks pretty janky... but they're done. Maybe, if things look REALLY off, you can go back after you finished the project and tweak them. But 99% of the time, they're fine.

Your second goal: get a better grasp of what's "acceptable" in your particular creative niche. You're most likely comparing your product to the cream of the crop, the really, really good stuff. That's your aspiration. The actual goal isn't to meet their quality (mainly because you will never, ever think you've done that), it's to meet the quality of the mediocre, run-of-the-mill stuff that doesn't get paraded around, but gets played and enjoyed anyway. (In working on my comic, whenever I feel discouraged about my art not looking great, I remind myself that Rob Liefeld was extremely popular and still gets work. It's very motivating.)

Your third goal is more a long term thing, and that's to really analyze why you think you NEED to make everything perfect. You're always going to have that feeling, to some level, but in my experience, understanding the reasons behind your behaviors helps you fight the behaviors. (As an example, I eventually concluded that my own issues stemmed from a general low self esteemer assumption that I, uniquely of all people, am required to never fuck up. Which is very silly, but these foundational beliefs often are, since they usually form in childhood.) I say this is long term because it will probably take years-- even decades!-- to tease everything out thoroughly, but it's absolutely worth doing. If you have access, a therapist can absolutely help you out in this respect (and many others!).

Finally, here's some stuff you should bear in mind. Maybe write it down and stick it on your monitor to glance at when you're working, if any of it appeals to you.

"Adequate and finished beats perfect and unfinished every time."

"Close enough for government work!"

"Most of my audience will never notice the errors because they're too busy playing the game."

Let me know when you figure it out but I am still trying to figure it out. *eyes Legion Saga DX*
Marrend
Guardian of the Description Thread
21781
Major bugs/issues that cause the game to be outright unplayable are definitely worth going back to fix. Minor bugs/issues, or learning how to do something more efficiently aren't as important, but would still fall into a "nice to know" category. The really important thing, though, is to learn and grow as a game developer, and, frankly, to have fun doing it. Semi-related...

author=Marrend
Failure is it's own opportunity for growth and learning. Even if you've fallen flat on your face, you're still moving in the right direction: forward.

...this little ditty.
I really had to just tell myself to stop. I remade about half of Exile's Journey's dungeons prior to it coming out. While I don't regret doing so because I think it improved the game, I would probably still be remaking things in the game had I not drawn the line.

There's one dungeon in particular in that game currently that I hate, but it's an optional dungeon so it wasn't worth pushing the game back further. I'm glad I forced myself to stop remaking things so that I could get the game out and work on my next thing.

One thing to keep in mind is that your current game doesn't have to be your last. Release your completed game, and if there's something you wish you changed, then use what you learned to ensure that your next project is even better.
Well... Good game=huge work... Whose can do alone do toda standars?
Well, even Sid Meries "make" not so good games, but sells them...
LockeZ
I'd really like to get rid of LockeZ. His play style is way too unpredictable. He's always like this too. If he ran a country, he'd just kill and imprison people at random until crime stopped.
5958
"Art is never finished, only abandoned." -Leonardo da Vinci

Personally my main project is an online game that has been getting regular updates for 23 years, so... I just embrace it.
author=Sgt M
This is especially true for any "art evolution" that your game experiences during development if you're doing custom assets. No matter what, your game's early areas will look nothing like later ones. So I strongly recommend waiting until much later in the project to redo your graphics: tackle it all at once, so that art evolution becomes less of an issue. Absolutely resist the urge to do this more than once.


I wish I had thought of this a couple of years ago. It seems like a no-brainer now that you say it.


author=Sooz
"Close enough for government work!"


Lol as someone who has worked in the government I can tell you right now that this is not something you should strive for hahah. But I do feel all your other points, Sooz.

Give yourself 3 chances to go back and polish/fix major prior stuff. Once you run out of chances then you move on and only focus on finishing the game (obviously doesn't have to be 3 but treat your polish phases as limited resources is my point). There's also the idea of making the beginning of the game much later and making sure the middle of the part of the game is the most meh. Hard to do if you're working in a genre that's about A to B progression.

I'm honestly more worried about rushing the ending than anything else, players really care about the lasting impression of a game and 9/10 times the final boss/scenario in most games is the least tested for obvious reasons. Things typically need to be climatic/bombastic (lots of effort) and also be a culmination of all that you learned (brain hurting design), which I would argue is just as hard development-wise as easing the player into the beginning. Then you just want it over with because fuck it, a slapped together end screen technically makes the game complete-able right?
Sooz
They told me I was mad when I said I was going to create a spidertable. Who’s laughing now!!!
5354
author=Prinnyhero
author=Sooz
"Close enough for government work!"


Lol as someone who has worked in the government I can tell you right now that this is not something you should strive for hahah. But I do feel all your other points, Sooz.



Haha, it's less about aspiration and more about having a baseline level of "acceptable." Like, you don't need to be great in everything, you just need to meet minimum standards of "it functions and probably nobody will really care."

Like, aim for super great, but if you fall short... eh. Maybe polishing certain important parts is a good plan, but in the end, mediocre but finished beats perfect but unfinished every time.
author=Sooz
author=Prinnyhero
author=Sooz
"Close enough for government work!"


Lol as someone who has worked in the government I can tell you right now that this is not something you should strive for hahah. But I do feel all your other points, Sooz.

Haha, it's less about aspiration and more about having a baseline level of "acceptable." Like, you don't need to be great in everything, you just need to meet minimum standards of "it functions and probably nobody will really care."

Like, aim for super great, but if you fall short... eh. Maybe polishing certain important parts is a good plan, but in the end, mediocre but finished beats perfect but unfinished every time.

Well... i see your perfect points...thanks.
Pages: 1