RPG MAKER GAMES OBSCURITY ICEBERG

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For anyone wondering what some of these games are where I found them:

- Moon Whistle: Wikipedia. Classic RM game from the 90s. No English translation that I know of, although eplipswich has worked on translating the XP remake.
- KonoSuba! in the life!: Bundled with the official Blu-rays of season 1 of the KonoSuba anime. Made by tachi who also created
Hello? Hell...o? and Hero and Daughter. Has fan translations in English, Spanish, and Russian.

- Flood: The Prequel: Steam. 0 reviews, but it's on Steam so that disqualifies it from the bottom tier.
- Palette: Wikipedia. Probably should've switched it with Moon Whistle because this one actually has an English translation by vgperson.
- FILAMENT: Googled "best RPG Tkool games" in Japanese and found it here. English fan translation available here.
- iLL nATURED: OLD/LOST RPGMAKER GAMES topic. Apparently there's a second game as well.
- Chaotix of Tomorrow: RPG Maker Wiki
- InflationQuest: Freem. AKA "InfureKuesto" or "InflaQuest" or インフレクエスト in Japanese. Humorous RPG where you inflate your character's stats to extreme levels. Pretty well-known in Japan, but no English translation yet.
- Super Haunted Insomniac Tower: Nominated for a Misao in 2006. Can't find anything on this game besides that, so probably should've been bottom.

- Aaron's Revenge: Won a Misao in 2005. There are a few mentions of it in other places, but the game seems to be lost forever.
- Dark Necklofar: niconico. Known as ダークネクロフィア in Japanese. No English translation. Has a small following among Japanese players. More info here if you can understand Japanese.
- Red moss: itch.io. No English translation yet, but the developer is open to offers.
- Touhou Aya Gensou: niconico. It's actually "Saigensou". Touhou fan game made in VX. More info here (in Japanese)
- Alex Anomaly: RMN. 2 downloads as of writing this post, pretty self-explanatory.
- Designer's Sin: RMRK. Just searched the forums for the oldest games with fewest comments, and this was one of them. Donwload link is broken, so it's probably lost forever.

Other stuff you probably already know, or you can easily find on Steam or by googling the names.

The Way
It's low for the same reason as ABL and Hero's Realm

Corpse Party
A lot of people question this one, but as far as I can tell all of the newer games (the ones that went mainstream) weren't made in RM. Not that many people know about the original.
Okay, in my opinion there a lot of things that just don't add up.

-How is Blurred Line at Level 5 of obscure? Bluerred Line is known even in Non-English communities and, even if you count how known it is only here in RMN, it has 26k downloads. How is that obscure?
-How do you create a list like this where there is no Phylomortis?
-How The Way is level 6?

I believe the list could have been made for the perspective of someone new to RPGMaker or just missed out some things. I think it was a really cool idea but really forgot/missed some important games, some that we even talk about in the Segnin's Old RPGMaker Games Thread.

EDIT: Okay, so this list is made for the mainstream that is outside any community of RPGMaker, but my point still stands in regards to The Blurred Line and The Way. If they are 'almost unknown' at least they should be in the same level. And Ara Fell had a remake recently so it should be a little more than the current level imho.

EDIT 2: Also, you added InflamationQuest which is japanese right? Why is there no Seraphic Blue?
-How is Blurred Line at Level 5 of obscure? Bluerred Line is known even in Non-English communities and, even if you count how known it is only here in RMN, it has 26k downloads. How is that obscure?

sorry friend but this is the era of Pom, which has 200k downloads and likely the single most viewed youtube video of an RM game ever (though Yume Nikki's collective videos probably take it over). For the youtuber: it was tuesday. The internet was really small pond back during ABL's time, so ABL felt like a big fish to most of us. Though idk it being lower than something like Ara Fell is weird.

Though there are measurements beyond downloads like cultural influence and long lasting appeal (lore wikis, fangames) Which stuff like Yume Nikki, LISA or OFF probably still dominates. Most people who played Pom probably don't know what RM even is and it'll be the only RM game they've played.

Another thing about this list is that merely being Japanese language only kinda shifts things a bit. I mean some of these games aren't as obscure to a Japanese player. Of course it's going to be obscure if it isn't translated or you're going out of your way to find something with 0 downloads.

The craft is I guess finding something notable that someone long enough in the scene can appreciate. Though an interesting hypothetical to consider are games only experienced RM users can enjoy. Like how SMW romhack players (probably) have a highly regarded hack that's way less popular but more advanced than Kaizo.
author=Darken
-How is Blurred Line at Level 5 of obscure? Bluerred Line is known even in Non-English communities and, even if you count how known it is only here in RMN, it has 26k downloads. How is that obscure?
sorry friend but this is the era of Pom, which has 200k downloads and likely the single most viewed youtube video of an RM game ever (though Yume Nikki's collective videos probably take it over). For the youtuber: it was tuesday. The internet was really small pond back during ABL's time, so ABL felt like a big fish to most of us.

Though there are measurements beyond downloads like cultural influence and long lasting appeal (lore wikis, fangames) Which stuff like Yume Nikki, LISA or OFF probably still dominates. Most people who played Pom probably don't know what RM even is and it'll be the only RM game they've played.

Another thing about this list is that merely being Japanese language only kinda shifts things a bit. I mean some of these games aren't as obscure to a Japanese player. Of course it's going to be obscure if it isn't translated or you're going out of your way to find something with 0 downloads.

The craft is I guess finding something notable that someone long enough in the scene can appreciate. Though an interesting hypothetical to consider are games only experienced RM users can enjoy. Like how SMW romhack players (probably) have a highly regarded hack that's way less popular but more advanced than Kaizo.


I see Darken, I agree that ABL maybe looked like a bigger fish and all that. I just wanted to understand if there was any criteria in dividing ABL and The Way into 2 different levels like I said.

I understood that too about the japanese game, not saying it should be in the same level, just saying that it could have been added, even it was even lower 'obscure' level.

Also, I'm not complaining whenever these old games will be added or not, or if there is a need to use 'precise criteria' to determine these levels. I really liked the idea nevertheless.
author=Darken
Another thing about this list is that merely being Japanese language only kinda shifts things a bit. I mean some of these games aren't as obscure to a Japanese player. Of course it's going to be obscure if it isn't translated or you're going out of your way to find something with 0 downloads.

Yeah I had to decide between including only games that are available in English and including mostly good and/or interesting-looking games so that the bottom tiers aren't filled with garbage, so I went with the latter.

I tried to make the list from the viewpoint of the average gamer who isn't necessarily super into RPG Maker games specifically. It's definitely hard as a former RMN regular who's probably heard more discussion for games like Hero's Realm and The Way than for mainstream stuff.
author=TungerManU
author=Darken
Another thing about this list is that merely being Japanese language only kinda shifts things a bit. I mean some of these games aren't as obscure to a Japanese player. Of course it's going to be obscure if it isn't translated or you're going out of your way to find something with 0 downloads.
Yeah I had to decide between including only games that are available in English and including mostly good and/or interesting-looking games so that the bottom tiers aren't filled with garbage, so I went with the latter.

I tried to make the list from the viewpoint of the average gamer who isn't necessarily super into RPG Maker games specifically. It's definitely hard as a former RMN regular who's probably heard more discussion for games like Hero's Realm and The Way than for mainstream stuff.
author=TungerManU
author=Darken
Another thing about this list is that merely being Japanese language only kinda shifts things a bit. I mean some of these games aren't as obscure to a Japanese player. Of course it's going to be obscure if it isn't translated or you're going out of your way to find something with 0 downloads.
Yeah I had to decide between including only games that are available in English and including mostly good and/or interesting-looking games so that the bottom tiers aren't filled with garbage, so I went with the latter.

I tried to make the list from the viewpoint of the average gamer who isn't necessarily super into RPG Maker games specifically. It's definitely hard as a former RMN regular who's probably heard more discussion for games like Hero's Realm and The Way than for mainstream stuff.

Yeah but for the game "Designer's Sin" for example you said you basicly searched RMRK's oldest game and with fewer comments. If you are going to use popular criteria this is a bit flawed way to select a game (since it could have been downloaded from other places for example).

Again, do your thing man, just a meme after all. But from my point of view, I have seen people recently playing Seraphic Blue and Phylomortis. Did they make a Let's Play of it? No. Did they stream or record? No. But they are kinda known and played too. Just sayin'.

EDIT: Another game that I didn't see and could be added for example would be Mad Father, although you already added most of the 'creepy RPGMaker games package'.
I knew the middle ones better... I haven't played any of the top two tiers. Although I think I left To The Moon on it's title screen for a few minutes once.

author=anyon175
Again, do your thing man, just a meme after all. But from my point of view, I have seen people recently playing Seraphic Blue and Phylomortis. Did they make a Let's Play of it? No. Did they stream or record? No. But they are kinda known and played too. Just sayin'.


I did let's play Phylomortis: Avante Garde back in 2018 if that counts:
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLtEWOQQDHwBx0_J7i9fMMS0KLjtTX0liA
author=Fomar0153
I knew the middle ones better... I haven't played any of the top two tiers. Although I think I left To The Moon on it's title screen for a few minutes once.

Oh I see. Well that may actually be true too, although people from outside any RPGMaker Community may know mostly those games close to the top of the Iceberg, the opposite that some people inside the Community may also never played those mainstream ones makes sense too.

Although of course, this Iceberg Meme (which is made from a certain mainstream perspective from what I understood) is still kinda strange beyond Level 4/5 in obscurity in my opinion.

Even considering Pom Gets Wifi case, because in this case the criteria was, quoting TungerManU, "Pom has a lot of downloads here but I feel it's completely forgotten..." which is not very measurable.

Some games beyond level 6 obscurity being games of strange choice (I would say almost arbitrary), since well, some games were neither played by the mainstream public nor even RPGMaker Community members seem to have played it (could have been downloaded/played by people from other websites, but then how do you really prove that more people played that recently and not other games without any comparison?).

So what was the real criteria in these cases and how did the one responsible compare it with the ones that some people in RPGMaker Communities actually play today? Maybe because it still lacks a bit of information? Because I really don't know if or how anything beyond level 6 was really compared.

But this of course would be if it was like some real serious statistics of popularity, it would need a way better sample of data from lots of websites (not only Let's Plays/Streams from big Streamers/Websites on Youtube/Twitch or Downloads from the few websites that were presented) and polls to really measure these levels (which would be an herculean task), or else it all becomes kinda biased. So whatever works in this case is perfectly fine.

Actually it is quite encouraging for others to make another Iceberg Meme and see what other interesting results may be shown.

author=Fomar0153
I did let's play Phylomortis: Avante Garde back in 2018 if that counts:
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLtEWOQQDHwBx0_J7i9fMMS0KLjtTX0liA

But yeah, a bit off-topic but sounds really cool man, I'll take a look at that later too. I still haven't made a Let's Play of both Phylomortis and Seraphic Blue but hopefully this year I'll play a bit of it too.
I would say I fit like in the category of Romancing Walker, in the game I heard, in the games I play, which is very few even not RPG Maker ones, it would more surface level really. There is a decent quantity of weird and obscure games, I should say, but really there is a lot of weird and obscure made on RPG Maker, like Detectivus Scitus, the RPG Maker game in latin, and also the lists of obscure games could be really filled with the Dante RPG Maker 98 Japanese games, that really havent left the Japanese language like Nuigles. Sorry for the terrible and very late reply.
kory_toombs
It’s your actions.. not your strength, that would lead you to victory.
13365

Interestingly enough you ignore a whole category of games that could be at the top end of the iceberg. There's a whole slew of adult only games on Steam, and while not all of them have high numbers, there are quite a few that are really famous.
This chart is pretty arbitrary and their ranking does not jibe at all with my own equally arbitrary experience. (And if you cross reference this with the years the games I have heard of were released/played, I guess I'm kind of showing my age.)

RALPH TIER:
Heard of 3/6, played 2/6, played LISA and reviewed it before it was (in)famous so yes unironically playing the "I liked it before it was cool" card there.
ERIC TIER:
Heard of 1/6, played 0/6.
KIRKLAND BRAND SEPHIROTH TIER:
I've heard of, played, and reviewed Space Funeral. And that's it for this tier.
EVIL1 (MAGE) TIER:
Played 2/5 of these (Dungeoneer & Ara Fell) and I've heard of that Jimmy & The Pulsating Mass game but not played it--it's not a title one forgets!!
EVIL1 (ASSASSIN) TIER:
I've heard of and played the top three, not the bottom three. In my mind ABL will always be the most famous--er, not famous, let's go with noteworthy--RM game and yep, showin' my age all right.
EVIL1 (blackface but not THAT kind of blackface) TIER:
I've played the games on a diagonal line from top left to bottom right--The Way, Middens, and Imdahl--and never even heard of any of the others. Middens is...just some game I played, I get it confused with Space Funeral a lot honestly and sometimes slightly confuse both of those with LISA, but The Way and Sunset are two of my favorite video games, period, of all time, made in anything, with anything, for anything.
MONSTER1 TIER:
I have heard of none of these games.
BOTTOM TIER:
I am positive I have not remotely heard of any of these games even once. But I guess I shouldn't be surprised because they're at the bottom.

Surprised not to see things like Three The Hard Way, Visions & Voices, and Love And War anywhere on the list. Or Laxius Power for that matter. If we're talking purely about notoriety, Super Columbine Massacre RPG definitely achieved a fair bit of that.

I clicked this thread because I thought it contained advice on how to move "up" the iceberg. I'm somewhere below the bottom and I'm not happy about it but I don't feel even slightly comfortable seeking attention/promoting myself...but I also feel really uncomfortable having worked, working, and planning to continue working really hard on my games if literally no one is going to play them so uh...yeah. (It'd probably help if I lurked a bit less or could commit to one username for more than a year or so before getting bored or more accurately distracted, wandering away, and then wandering back with a new name and a new game and ugh. Rinse and repeat ad nauseum.)
I feel like Hero's Realm should be one level higher
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