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Cash, bones, dough, moolah, bucks, duckets, money.

Currency and its role in trading doesn't just have a place in RPGs, it's found its way to almost every video game genre you can imagine. Money management can be fun, whether you're buying weapons to slay a monster, cars for your next race, or clothes to pimp out your character. Whatever! Acquiring it is often built into the challenge of the gameplay, the allure of getting stuff you don't have, or even an element of the storyline. It's interesting to see how different games vary wildly in how important or unimportant getting money is, or how difficult it can be.

-The Final Fantasy series varies wildly in this, with FFVII making money easy to come by (and with Chocobo Breeding, easy to lose), and comparatively, FFXIII making cash extremely rare and everything is expensive as shit. FFXII, is also stingy with money, but with the best stuff being made in the Bazaar...

-Grand Theft Auto, for the most part, makes earning cash very easy, but having very little to spend it on (except for San Andreas)

-Mass Effect 2 makes its storebought stuff very attractive, but there's literally not enough money in the game to buy it all unless you're New Game plussing it.

And those are just some examples. So, my question and the topic of discussion for you is; how are you handling currency in your game? How easy or difficult is it going to be to earn? How ultimately useful is it going to be? While, um, unique ideas that developers seem to love because they think tried and true techniques suck or something and they feel compulsed with being oddly innovative ("I'M NOT HAVING CURRENCY IN MY GAME THE PLAYER HAS TO GROW SWORDS FROM THE GROUND") are certainly welcomed, this question is posed more for developers who have more traditional concepts of currency and such.
Craze
why would i heal when i could equip a morningstar
15150
I am going to say that I read the term "Fantasybucks" when somebody couldn't remember the name of Exit Fate's currency (Arn) on Something Awful. I proclaim that it be used as the universal term in this thread.

I will read/actually respond after I ingest food and attend the Landsmeet. This is a very interesting topic for me, and one that I think about a lot (and constantly tweak in my projects).
I always make fantasybucks rare as hell. I do this by making only enemies who could logically drop money drop money, but because of the logical ridiculousness of a rabbit dropping fifty gold coins but because I want to control carefully the amount of money the player earns and want to avoid the player being able to grind furiously to cash up.

There is a lot of money to be found off the beaten track, as it were, so exploration is the best way to earn cashola. It's a difficult balancing act, but I have it so that if you find all the cash lying around you'll have a pretty large surplus; I'm guessing not many people are going to find all the cash lying around.
post=138068
I'm not having currency in Riot Grrrl. Instead, I'm using the "currency" function in RPGMaker for character building instead of using experience. The "currency" has just been named AP to give the illusion that it isn't just a "currency".

because who needs currency in a riot ??
Three things I want to focus on;

-How hard is it to make money

-What the player can spend their money on, and if there are alternatives to buying things

-How much everything costs.

Those three have to be carefully balanced to make any system with any kind of currency work to the fullest. If even one of these is out of whack, the whole system gets fuzzed up.



Example; in the aforementioned GTA, and in GTA IV specifically, money is very easy to be had. Your monetary rewards increase exponentially as the game goes on (with the first mission giving you what, 50 bucks or something? Compare to near the end of the game, where another mission nets you a quarter million) However, there's almost nothing to spend it on. Sure, eating and pay and sprays are like what, a dollar and one hundred dollars, respectively?

Sure, weapons are expensive, but at a certain point of the game, you can get by on a bargain bin budget on guns, and by the end of the game, you have ALL THIS MONEY, and absolutely nothing to spend it on. Even buying lots and lots of guns is sort of 'eh' because there aren't any more missions. This is sort of fixed in Ballad of Gay Tony where you can repeat missions and Drug Wars are in infinite supply, giving you a reason to invest in weaponry, but still, the fundamental problem applies.



An RPG example where the opposite occurs is Final Fantasy XIII . Money is almost impossible to come by in any real abundance for 99% percent of the game. Monsters don't drop any, the stuff they do drop ain't worth shit (in money), and human enemies drop sellable goods, but you fight those every once in a while. This is the game's attempt to prod you into the Item Crafting system as opposed to buying stuff in stores, but the problem with this is, utilizing the crafting system costs a shitload of the same money the game is actively discouraging you from getting. In order to make new items, you have to add item components to your weapons and accessories.

The thing is though, while enemies drop these components, they're usually relatively worthless (a fang that adds 5 EXP to a weapon that needs 1000 EXP to level up YEAH), so the game offers you the option to buy them from stores. Stores have lots and lots of item components for sale, but there's a problem with that too; while varying wildly in price, item components are fundamentally the same, only giving out more/less EXP/EXP multipliers for your buck. So while the game literally has pages and pages of shit to buy, there's really only ever a need to just get 3 or 4 items ever. Guess what; those 3-4 items are obscenely expensive.
in my game, monsters don't drop money per se, but there's a tagging system in place maintained by each country's central government in which certain monsters are tagged and others are untagged as a means of population control.

you can get a tag by either killing the monster, or you can steal the tag off the monster and leave it alive. the tag is usually worth more if the monster is left alive (which doesn't make much sense realistically, but hey, oddities at the expense of your game's theme, etc). you take these tags into town, where you can exchange them for money, items, or services.

the other two ways you can get money are by selling stuff you've accumulated over the course of your journey (naturally) or by drawing a paycheck. two characters draw paychecks semi-frequently throughout the course of the game; this serves to compare those characters at different income levels. i'm not sure how, yet. do i make them equal or do i make one character's income drastically higher than the other? both of these characters have wildly different occupations, and one of the jobs is perceived (at least by the person holding it) to be way more important than the other. if the pay is equal, it could serve to make a statement that the job isn't nearly as important as she thinks it is. if it's way high, it could illustrate, especially when comparing incomes of other people holding the same job, that the character in question is being paid a large sum of money to not question her immediate superiors.

as far as money and economy, i originally wanted to do an exchange rate system between the three main countries in my game, but i don't really want to put forth the effort. something like that could be fun, though, if the exchange rate fluctuated at certain, predictable points and you could sort of "game the system" and make loads of cash. it's not realistic, but it's a fun gameplay mechanic that doesn't really hurt anyone, since it's all made up. you could also set into motion certain economic events that cause a country's exchange rate to drop, then buy up a shitload of that country's currency, and wait for it to recover, inflating your purchasing power and making money that way.

also i never really liked making up fantasynames for money so the currency, at least in dialogue, is never explicitly referenced. every time people talk about money, they want "500,000" or "3 million" and they never say what the currency is called.
Max McGee
with sorrow down past the fence
9159
You know what I think is interesting from both the OP and my own gaming experience is that I have never played any game commercial or otherwise that balances this issue PERFECTLY. I always feel like I have either too much currency or not enough and items either feel too easy or too hard to get and there are not many or too much buyable things.
Secret of Evermore had a very, very good currency system. It wasn't until the absolute tail-end of the game that you had a tonne of money, but even then the final few stores cleaned you completely out. There was a bit of grinding to generate cashola (by a bit I mean quite a bit) but the combat was pretty fun so who cares? Keeping people buying ingredients also meant that you didn't just generate endless currency.

I love that game. Love it!

edit: It also had a currency exchange system that gave diminishing returns, so having a lot of money in Fire Eyes world didn't mean much when you got to Antiqua and so on. Until the end, of course, when you are swimming in a boatload of cash that is pretty much worthless. What a great game!
Max McGee
with sorrow down past the fence
9159
In terms of RM Games, the currency system(S)! in Three the Hard Way were very interesting, although flawed in several ways and tipped in the favor of too stingy.
Think Outside the Box rewards you with Points whenever you find an exit, with the amount you get being based on the difficulty of finding the exit. You can spend the points on hints, which in turn can help you get more points. There are more points in the game than hints, so if you finish the game you will always have money left over. It isn't very well balanced, but I feel it's better than a stingy system in this instance.
Wow, some of you guys have some really esoteric ideas. I hope this shit is playable.
Max McGee
with sorrow down past the fence
9159
I just wanted to say...duckets.
Puddor
if squallbutts was a misao category i'd win every damn year
5702
I tend to make sure the player can't totally raid all stores when I set up the currency rate. In DS:R all enemies drop money but if you're determined to by the best equipment you're going to spend a lot of time grinding for cash. Soldiers only carry so much money, after all.
In contrast CC has a system where cash is treated as a 'real' thing and attempts to emulate real-world prices. In the game, you start out with $30 and use $10 on train tickets. You can buy little items like coffee and cappuccinos which cost about the same they would in real life, too. CC's cash is a rare commodity, just like the real world. I find cash shouldn't be given to a player willy-nilly because IT JUST DOESN'T HAPPEN IN REAL LIFE, UNLESS YOU WIN LOTTO.
Max McGee
with sorrow down past the fence
9159
Speaking of raiding the stores.

I wish more RPGs let you STEAL SHIT in a meaningful way.
post=138255
I tend to make sure the player can't totally raid all stores when I set up the currency rate. In DS:R all enemies drop money but if you're determined to by the best equipment you're going to spend a lot of time grinding for cash. Soldiers only carry so much money, after all.
In contrast CC has a system where cash is treated as a 'real' thing and attempts to emulate real-world prices. In the game, you start out with $30 and use $10 on train tickets. You can buy little items like coffee and cappuccinos which cost about the same they would in real life, too. CC's cash is a rare commodity, just like the real world. I find cash shouldn't be given to a player willy-nilly because IT JUST DOESN'T HAPPEN IN REAL LIFE, UNLESS YOU WIN LOTTO.

There's a reason we play games instead of going outside.
post=138068
I'm not having currency in Riot Grrrl. Instead, I'm using the "currency" function in RPGMaker for character building instead of using experience. The "currency" has just been named AP to give the illusion that it isn't just a "currency".
...

I did this my maxing out the EXP curves to high values to combine a numerical value to someone's power (the level of a character shown) with AP, but it meant the amount of points they accumulated to spend into character build up for that really (almost a year old) RPG Maker game I had. You didn't fight enemies to level up even though you eventually could level up, it was for the points.
Craze
why would i heal when i could equip a morningstar
15150
post=138082
I am going to say that I read the term "Fantasybucks" when somebody couldn't remember the name of Exit Fate's currency (Arn) on Something Awful. I proclaim that it be used as the universal term in this thread.

I will read/actually respond after I ingest food and attend the Landsmeet. This is a very interesting topic for me, and one that I think about a lot (and constantly tweak in my projects).

Turns out that the Landsmeet has about 50000000 more quests before it. As such:

FFXII dealt with fantasybucks pretty well. I always felt like I had something cool to buy/conjure up in the bazaar. I wish you could buy Holy before the final dungeon, but meh. =\

I have a few different strategies for money usage that I use in my projects.

***

1) The Diablocide Method Items are pretty low-key in Diablocide; the emphasis is on character synergy in battles, after all. They're there so you don't find yourself totally dead if all of your Healers unconscious. So, money is more of an upgrade option - near the end of each tier ("dungeon," ignoring that the game is just one giant dungeon), Zetha sells you the basic restoration items, as well as part of the equipment from that tier's random drop table. This lets you shore up weaknesses or what-have-you. I price them so that you can get 3-4 for your favorite dudes and then not care.

Summary: Fantasybucks exist, but they're not for restoration; they're for a few pieces of equipment (which is just minor customization tweaks on your characters, anyway).

***

2) The In Praise of Peace Method This is inspired by Persona 4, kind of. In P4, you get a "lot" of money since it's in yen. What would be 50 Gil in FF games is 500 yen; that's just how the Japanese currency works! As such, I get to use big, malleable numbers for money drops. The difference is that P4 equipment is very important, whereas IPoP uses equipment FFX-style: it's little passive boosts, like a whip is "+15% Speed, -10% Brawn" and an off-hand dagger is "+6% Toxify rate" (normal attack state infliction). As such, you have the ability to purchase lots of these little armaments at Item Crystals, as well as Gems (which are fairly cheap; their investment is that you glean skills from them as you keep them equipped in battle). There are important restoration items, too (healing skills are powerful but expensive) - but I like to hand those out often in unlocked, easily-accessible chests so that you have them if you don't bother to buy them regularly.

Summary: Fantasybucks are handed out in gobs tha lets you buy a bunch of situational equipment, and stock up on HP/SP restoration items if you use up the supply handed out in chests. Later in the game, you'll occasionally be able to purchase powerful state-infliction attack items as well

***

3) The Visions & Voices Method Spending your money can be a trial in and of itself in V&V! While Alphonse carries some essential supplies (better stuff if he joins the party and you use his Feat, which summons a super-store anywhere in the game), the shopkeeps with the sexy items and powerful weapons are hidden around the nooks and crannies of the Montfort village; one even requires you to conquer a small dungeon and then unlock a top-tier chest to let him out! Equipment is essential, though, since it is your means of progression in the game. With no leveling system, pimping out your characters is absolutely necessary on the harder difficulty levels (and still important on Normal; maybe on Easy, I'm not sure. Ask Ark if he needed to on his Easy solo run). Money, therefore, becomes something you want to fight for and spend. Annnnd then you come to the idea of health restoration.

V&V is a survival game with a time limit. Every time you get a full heal at the Ogre's Mug Tavern, a day passes. Out-of-battle healing items are weak and strong in-battle healing items are rare (although easier to forage for with Ox and Dison's Feats; Ox can pick cool herbs and Dison can cook items enemies drop if he's in the party). Reviving a fallen ally is ONLY possible by spending a night at the Ogre's Mug, praying at a shrine using Lyla's Feat, or through rare items gained via Ox/Dison's Feats. Add in that the weak oob healing items are limited in your inventory (only 15 of each item) and you have tons of carrots/grapes/onions/etc. to stock up on. Did I mention that each character has two MP bars that different skills use up fairly quickly? You need your equipment, but you also need to not die.

Believe it or not, money is a bitch in V&V and took a lot of testing to get right.

Summary: Fantasybucks are tight and necessary. You earn them by killing things and selling your old equipment, but it goes fast as you stock up on meals to keep you going as you search for more fantasybucks to NOT DIE.


***

BIG OVERALL SUMMARY: I like the player to spend all their money before moving on, and I usually don't care about realism when unicorns and baby elephants drop fantasybucks.


Why yes, they all drop Fantasybucks. Why not?
If there's one thing that needs to change about money balance in RPGs, it's that items that restore your MP and items that revive dead party members need to be MUCH cheaper than they typically are. It's one of the major reasons mages are much less useful than melee fighters, especially in FF games.

I like having more to spend my money on than items/weapons/inn. I like being able to buy a drink, get a book, etc. As long as it isn't just a wasted spot in my inventory, I like it when games include lots of little knick-knacks for me to buy.

I think games should always err on the side of too free with money. That way, you can either buy spare items or save for the next town. Too stingy makes me worry that I haven't been fighting enough battles and usually leads to lots of grinding.
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