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Feldschlacht IV
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Closeauthor=Dy
I highly doubt there would be riots over this.
Oh yeah there would. There's already major activity with the Occupy stuff going down. You really don't think something like would MAJORLY fuel something like that? The Internet is something everyone can relate to.
People are getting tired of this shit, man.
Lack of mainstream media attention, people scoffing at the idea this bill will even come close to passing, and generally being distracted by other crap (OWS, Super Committee Budget Reduction, Penn State, etc.) means this bill can pass and most people simply wouldn't care or even have known such a thing existed (and consequently no riots).
The people who are currently players in passing or killing this bill are:
* The entertainment industry, which wields a disproportionate amount of influence in passing this bill thanks to the old saying that money talks.
* The US Chamber of Commerce which (I believe?) wants to use SOPA to more strictly enforce copyright laws.
* The IT industry, which stands to lose a lot from SOPA but simply can't match alone the behemoth that is the entertainment industry both financially and in sheer influence.
* Pirates and casual IP infringers, whose (valid) words of opposition are meaningless to the supporters and useless to opponents because of legality concerns.
* Suppliers of user-generated content, whose collective voice (even with support from the IT industry) is negligible when compared to that of the entertainment industry. Not to mention user-generated content is one of the things SOPA is trying to kill in the first place.
Everyone else at this point is either ignorant of the proceedings, indifferent to the point they simply don't give even half a damn, or simply too small a voice to be heard. Or as the House Judiciary Committee demonstrated, opposition groups may be in a state of being collectively ignored outright.
Personally I want SOPA killed with raging flames, but the odds are anything but. ;_;
If and once SOPA becomes law, Youtube would be the first to immediately disappear from the internet since I keep reading that streaming is basically outlawed in SOPA (that also means sites like Japan's NicoNico Douga would be blocked). If most people don't notice that (among other bullshit) I'm going to eat my hat.
The people who are currently players in passing or killing this bill are:
* The entertainment industry, which wields a disproportionate amount of influence in passing this bill thanks to the old saying that money talks.
* The US Chamber of Commerce which (I believe?) wants to use SOPA to more strictly enforce copyright laws.
* The IT industry, which stands to lose a lot from SOPA but simply can't match alone the behemoth that is the entertainment industry both financially and in sheer influence.
* Pirates and casual IP infringers, whose (valid) words of opposition are meaningless to the supporters and useless to opponents because of legality concerns.
* Suppliers of user-generated content, whose collective voice (even with support from the IT industry) is negligible when compared to that of the entertainment industry. Not to mention user-generated content is one of the things SOPA is trying to kill in the first place.
Everyone else at this point is either ignorant of the proceedings, indifferent to the point they simply don't give even half a damn, or simply too small a voice to be heard. Or as the House Judiciary Committee demonstrated, opposition groups may be in a state of being collectively ignored outright.
Personally I want SOPA killed with raging flames, but the odds are anything but. ;_;
application will be slow to unroll and we won't feel the effects for a decade or so.
If and once SOPA becomes law, Youtube would be the first to immediately disappear from the internet since I keep reading that streaming is basically outlawed in SOPA (that also means sites like Japan's NicoNico Douga would be blocked). If most people don't notice that (among other bullshit) I'm going to eat my hat.
ElectricalKat
254
"Riots" may be much too strong of a word to use in this instance. However, you can probably bet that even more people who are neutral in this whole situation vs. the 1% will begin to sympathize even more with the protestors, if this ever passes. At least, if the content industry really is dumb enough to try and shut down YouTube, Facebook, et al.
Also, let us not forget the fact that initial hearings pretty much amounted to a gang of pro-SOPA lobbyists bullying one lone anti-SOPA member. With that, and the alleged statement made saying the technology industry had little to no say in this bill at all, we can only hope that the judicial branch recognizes this bill for what it really is.
As usual, though, I've noticed nary a word from the American media about SOPA (or even its predecessor, "Protect IP"). It probably goes to show just how much of a joke our press has become, especially with something this serious and violating.
Also, let us not forget the fact that initial hearings pretty much amounted to a gang of pro-SOPA lobbyists bullying one lone anti-SOPA member. With that, and the alleged statement made saying the technology industry had little to no say in this bill at all, we can only hope that the judicial branch recognizes this bill for what it really is.
As usual, though, I've noticed nary a word from the American media about SOPA (or even its predecessor, "Protect IP"). It probably goes to show just how much of a joke our press has become, especially with something this serious and violating.
KingArthur, if this bill does (unlikely) pass and scores of people start getting hauled off the jail for shit they didn't even know was illegal, shit will hit the fan. You can't judge a climate by your friends who watch Jersey Shore and you think are stupid/whatever. There are tons and tons of people who were and are instrumental from this bill being passed earlier, and like it was mentioned before, this bill isn't new.
I cannot see anyone dwarfing Google's voice. Literally no one ignores what Google has to say, whether they agree with it or not. Do you not understand how much money Google has? It's one of the riches entities on Earth.
author=KA
* Suppliers of user-generated content, whose collective voice (even with support from the IT industry) is negligible when compared to that of the entertainment industry. Not to mention user-generated content is one of the things SOPA is trying to kill in the first place.
I cannot see anyone dwarfing Google's voice. Literally no one ignores what Google has to say, whether they agree with it or not. Do you not understand how much money Google has? It's one of the riches entities on Earth.
Also this.
http://americancensorship.org/index.html#infographic
Come on dude. The internet is the greatest tool against tyranny the world has ever known, the spread of information is just too easy and you just can't get away with underhanded shady shit anymore. The golden rule of 'Don't fuck with our Internet' has stayed true ever since the 90s, and it's not going to change. This bill will die. Again.
http://americancensorship.org/index.html#infographic
Come on dude. The internet is the greatest tool against tyranny the world has ever known, the spread of information is just too easy and you just can't get away with underhanded shady shit anymore. The golden rule of 'Don't fuck with our Internet' has stayed true ever since the 90s, and it's not going to change. This bill will die. Again.
Dyhalto
7536
I'm not optimistic or pessimistic.
America is at a critical stage in her history where the politicians are totally out of touch with their constituency and "Let them eat cake" is abundant. It wouldn't surprise me to see them pass it in stealth, like on Christmas Eve when only a handful of informed representatives are present to vote, just like other harmful legislation in the past.
And like I mentioned, passing the bill and enforcing it are two different animals. Contrary to popular belief, you won't see Youtube disappear overnight (although you may see their regulatory standards become much more strict). If they get it passed, they can begin a slow roll out over the years to make sure public reaction isn't fierce and decisive.
Asserting my "conspiracy theory" babble, the first things to indiscriminately disappear would probably be alternative media sites and blogs/videos reporting police brutality. File sharing sites like torrentz.com would likely be given a softer approach and simply litigated out of existence.
America is at a critical stage in her history where the politicians are totally out of touch with their constituency and "Let them eat cake" is abundant. It wouldn't surprise me to see them pass it in stealth, like on Christmas Eve when only a handful of informed representatives are present to vote, just like other harmful legislation in the past.
And like I mentioned, passing the bill and enforcing it are two different animals. Contrary to popular belief, you won't see Youtube disappear overnight (although you may see their regulatory standards become much more strict). If they get it passed, they can begin a slow roll out over the years to make sure public reaction isn't fierce and decisive.
Asserting my "conspiracy theory" babble, the first things to indiscriminately disappear would probably be alternative media sites and blogs/videos reporting police brutality. File sharing sites like torrentz.com would likely be given a softer approach and simply litigated out of existence.
Bonehead11
170
It will happen one day, maybe not now, but they will eventually censor internet or just wipe it out with some "cooler" media that will be controlled from start. They will start shit like " Internet is full of child porn" " Internet is dangerous for kids" "Everyone can spy you trough internet" and I bet even "Internet is terrorist network" added with some TV brainwashing, some controlled "events" and bullshit psychological mindfuck propaganda. They just need to brainwash 51% of the america and dont forget that they have support of rednecks, hillbillies and "TV nation" wich is high %, if that doesnt help, they still can meddle with voting. Means even more money for corporates and less information means more stupidity...but the sad thing is that major part of the internet is monitored, for instance read terms of agreement on facebook.
LockeZ
I'd really like to get rid of LockeZ. His play style is way too unpredictable. He's always like this too. If he ran a country, he'd just kill and imprison people at random until crime stopped.
5958
Any argument for censorship of the internet which also would apply to TV or movies has exactly a 0% chance of ever convincing anyone who matters.
Fortunately, every argument for censorship of the internet also would apply to TV or movies.
Fortunately, every argument for censorship of the internet also would apply to TV or movies.
author=Feldschlacht IVhttp://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/news/2011/11/at-web-censorship-hearing-congress-guns-for-pro-pirate-google.ars
I cannot see anyone dwarfing Google's voice. Literally no one ignores what Google has to say, whether they agree with it or not. Do you not understand how much money Google has? It's one of the riches entities on Earth.
Right from the start, the knives were out for Google. Committee Chairman Lamar Smith (R-TX) made it only halfway through his opening statement before asserting that "one of the companies represented here today has sought to obstruct the Committee’s consideration of bipartisan legislation. Perhaps this should come as no surprise given that Google just settled a federal criminal investigation into the company’s active promotion of rogue websites that pushed illegal prescription and counterfeit drugs on American consumers."
Google didn't want to stop piracy because it made so much money from it.
Google didn't want to stop piracy because it made so much money from it.
Google didn't want to stop piracy because it made so much money from it.EDIT:
I dunno man... NO ONE is safe from these baseless accusations. But I am sure has hell glad that all of the major internet players are like "WTF NO. This is retarded."
Downloading music illegally is killing music. So is only buying the hit song. $1 for a hit song isn't $14 for the whole shitty album now is it? Its actually killing music labels. The artists make more money doing concerts depending on what their contract is. Some bands make 100% of tour profit. Some bands are contracted by their record label to perform X number of dates. Some get a cut. I used to work for Interscope and Roadrunner Records for a few years. My sister still works for Roadrunner as talent management.
America is the land of the casual pirates: http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/news/2011/11/its-official-america-a-land-of-young-casual-pirates.ars
So it turns out (as expected) that generally people would rather do things legally. And now that, after over a decade, the music industry is beginning to innovate and adapt to the new medium things are getting better. Go figure.
EDIT:
"No, what the studios really oppose isn't piracy. They oppose anyone being able to skirt their control mechanisms and succeed without them."
So it turns out (as expected) that generally people would rather do things legally. And now that, after over a decade, the music industry is beginning to innovate and adapt to the new medium things are getting better. Go figure.
EDIT:
"No, what the studios really oppose isn't piracy. They oppose anyone being able to skirt their control mechanisms and succeed without them."
Dyhalto
7536
author=Bonehead11
I bet even "Internet is terrorist network"
They already tried "Terrorist Chat Room". Remember Jihad Jane?
*SBomber72 has joined #mujahideen*
Bonehead11
170
Guys, but still you wouldn't steal a car.
author=DyhaltoI bet terrorists use facebook to organise and like evil plans.author=Bonehead11They already tried "Terrorist Chat Room". Remember Jihad Jane?
I bet even "Internet is terrorist network"
*SBomber72 has joined #mujahideen*
Is anyone willing to pay the Anonymous to screw up this Internet blacklist shit so we don't have to worry about it?
ElectricalKat
254
author=ShortStar
Downloading music illegally is killing music. So is only buying the hit song. $1 for a hit song isn't $14 for the whole shitty album now is it? Its actually killing music labels.
Not to sound all that snarky, and this isn't wholely directed at you -- but -- perhaps artists should concentrate on making better songs along with their "hits", then?
I can't remember who exactly said it ... but there is a quote from the times when audio recording was first being conceived. A guy basically stated that recorded music would be the "death of human memory" and "mass performances would die out in favor of people listening in their homes", or something to these effects. Well, fast forward one century later, and we haven't actually seen the deaths of either our memories, or live performances yet!
If music labels' profits are being hurt, then it is the fault of their current business model. They will need to realize that their customers, not them, dictate what is proper for today's world. And while they can throw as much money as they wish to the courts, no amount of litigation actually changes this fact.
Well, I was reading the Wikipedia article about this and the whole thing doesn't sound too bad to me... at least on paper.
From my understanding, the main target of this bill is to block foreign websites that stream whole movies and whatnot, which sounds fine to me, really. If Hollywood movies suck as much as people often say they do, then why do they need to watch them on some Russian site anyway? - The only problem here is that in order to block such sites effectively they want to tamper with the "integrity of the web" which does sound like dick move, but I wonder how much of that concern is just Google et al trying to protect their own pockets.
Domestic, legitimate sites wouldn't be blocked because they have all the means to demonstrate they don't have the primary intent to distribute copyrighted material... Until now, they would only take down stuff brought to their attention by the copyright holder, but we all know how well that goes, as soon as one video is taken down two more are up. Now they'd be expected to clean up their act and strictly moderate their user's submitted content. At the end some legal stuff may get pulled by mistake, but that's not a fault of the bill per se.
Let's face it. "Freedom of expression" doesn't mean people have the right to post or watch TV shows, Movies, or Videogame footage(?) on the internet. Nor that websites can turn a blind eye on it out of convenience. The people who hold the right of that stuff can lose money because of it and that is a bad thing too, as much as we may not like them. Their ways are often exaggerated, insightful and just plain ineffective, but I wouldn't be so fast to describe them as oppressive or anything like that as people make them out to be.
I really hope the bill doesn't pass, mainly because one much less shady already did, and it hasn't even been put into practice yet. I also hope the 'Entertainment' industry hears the plead of the IT industry and work together to find better solutions for this problem.... But more than anything I wish the internet didn't freak out about this kind of bills every three months and would learn more about copyright laws instead.
Edit: Of course, this applies to me too. That goes without saying, but just in case...
From my understanding, the main target of this bill is to block foreign websites that stream whole movies and whatnot, which sounds fine to me, really. If Hollywood movies suck as much as people often say they do, then why do they need to watch them on some Russian site anyway? - The only problem here is that in order to block such sites effectively they want to tamper with the "integrity of the web" which does sound like dick move, but I wonder how much of that concern is just Google et al trying to protect their own pockets.
Domestic, legitimate sites wouldn't be blocked because they have all the means to demonstrate they don't have the primary intent to distribute copyrighted material... Until now, they would only take down stuff brought to their attention by the copyright holder, but we all know how well that goes, as soon as one video is taken down two more are up. Now they'd be expected to clean up their act and strictly moderate their user's submitted content. At the end some legal stuff may get pulled by mistake, but that's not a fault of the bill per se.
Let's face it. "Freedom of expression" doesn't mean people have the right to post or watch TV shows, Movies, or Videogame footage(?) on the internet. Nor that websites can turn a blind eye on it out of convenience. The people who hold the right of that stuff can lose money because of it and that is a bad thing too, as much as we may not like them. Their ways are often exaggerated, insightful and just plain ineffective, but I wouldn't be so fast to describe them as oppressive or anything like that as people make them out to be.
I really hope the bill doesn't pass, mainly because one much less shady already did, and it hasn't even been put into practice yet. I also hope the 'Entertainment' industry hears the plead of the IT industry and work together to find better solutions for this problem.... But more than anything I wish the internet didn't freak out about this kind of bills every three months and would learn more about copyright laws instead.
Edit: Of course, this applies to me too. That goes without saying, but just in case...
I dunno man, the power that this bill gives to copyright holders is wayyy out of line with what they are attempting to accomplish. Let's imagine (and I know this will be hard but bear with me) that someone on RMN uploaded a game with a song from a Final Fantasy game. Square Enix could then theoretically get a court injunction to stop our revenue stream from advertising, and blacklist the entire site, without given me any due process or warning.
That's pretty draconian.
That's pretty draconian.
http://www.theglobalipcenter.com/sites/default/files/pressreleases/letter-359.pdf
For those who didn't know, Nintendo is a primary sponsor of this act.
For those who didn't know, Nintendo is a primary sponsor of this act.
