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NOMINATED "MOST PROMISING DEMO", 2010 MISAOS
NOMINATED "BEST INTERFACE", 2010 MISAOS


...::: What People Are Saying :::...

"Ever played an RPGMaker 2003 game where you almost forgot you were playing an RPGMaker 2003 game? Sore Losers: Riot Grrrl accomplishes just that!" - acknowledge101

"Notice how I'm saying unique a lot? That's probably because Sore Losers: Riot Grrrl isn't like any RPGMaker 2003 game I've ever played. It takes a lot of chances with most of the custom systems and the emphasis on gameplay (and minigames!) over story, but I feel that the game fares pretty well." - Xanedil

"It has it's own unique play style that is very well thought out and balanced and great in a survival/sandbox/exploration kind of way." - Orphansmith

...::: Storyline and Setting :::...

"When the troubles first started in "Central Ferusia", the complex where all of our nation's criminals are sent to serve their punishment, nobody batted an eyelid. We thought that the government had everything under control because the strength of our military had been demonstrated multiple times in the past. Even when the walls of the complex were breached and criminals started to escape into the streets, we believed that the riots caused by common criminals and anti-government rebels would be quickly put down, and that future generations would only remember their efforts as a ridiculous, treacherous ploy.

We believed the government when they told us that the military had full control of the riots, and sat happily in our homes as the curfews and blockades dragged on and on and on. We didn't think for a moment that the government could possibly be wrong. After all, we had the most powerful military in the world protecting us! The idea that these riots would ever cause us problems sounded like a tasteless joke.

The joke was on us.

The streets seem dead where I live, but each night I hear the riots getting closer as the military's blockades get pushed further away from the walls that were supposed to keep these criminals contained. What am I supposed to do? I'm trapped in an apartment full of gadgets I can't eat, paid for by credits I can't drink, with a panoramic view of the violence making its way towards me.

I don't care what the government tells us anymore. I'm not safe here. I have to get out!"

~ Diary of Cheska Frederick, Ferusian Citizen.

...::: Gameplay, Features and Comments :::...

Sore Losers: Riot Grrrl is a highly experimental game where nearly everything you do involves some kind of minigame; from searching areas for items to lockpicking doors; from hotwiring electrical equipment to dodging rioters; from arguing with NPCs to hacking into computer systems; from breaking through barriers to sneaking around enemies. Why? Because I wanted to make an RPG where character abilities aren't reliant on a lifeless table of stats, and are instead reliant on the skill of the player. Hopefully my excessive use of minigame sequences is going to achieve just that.

Battles are also going to be more interactive than in a standard RPG. In Sore Losers: Riot Grrrl you'll be able to knock weapons out of your opponent's hands, kick bookcases over onto people, throw your enemies into electric fences, and use human shields to stop enemies from being able to attack you; you'll basically be able to use multiple elements of the battle environment to get your own way. Why settle for just the weapon in your hand? Use everything to your advantage!

Additionally, most of the graphics will be custom-made for the project in a purposefully high-contrast manner that will give the game a drastically different look. The game will also feature vibrant, abrasive chiptune soundtrack. As such, there will be a strong, stylistic element to this game that may well end up being divisive, but I believe it will also lead to a very unique gameplay experience!

Latest Blog

Crawling Through Vents, Fighting With Words and Taking Stock

I haven't really done any work on this game since Fallout 4 came out back in November. Fallout 4 took up most of my free-time throughout November and December, with the rest being taken up by all the shopping and parties and dinners and general-get-togethers that Christmas brings with it. It's been a fun couple of months (some random bouts of nausea aside, but I'm taking medication for that now!) but it's really time that I start working on this project again. Not that I don't find working on this game fun, it's just that I've really saddled myself with a lot of tedious tasks to do. In any case, I really want to get this project finished by the end of this year. It's been going on for far too long now, it's actually kinda ridiculous!

Crawling Through Vents

People who actively follow the "Whatchu Workin' On?" thread will remember that I was working on the vent-crawling minigame back at the start of November. These sections are handled in a style similar to the dungeons in the first Phantasy Star game, in that you're shown a first-person view of what's immediately in front of you and then get to choose which direction you want to travel in. It's really easy to get lost in these areas, so it's really up to the player to keep careful track of where they're going so that they don't end up going in circles, and that's where the challenge in these sections comes from. Hopefully people aren't too put-off by what is a fairly old-school approach to labyrinthine puzzle design, but I've always liked dungeons that are set up in this kind of manner.

What I've basically done is update the graphics for the vent-crawling minigame so that it has an overlay like all the other minigames do. This means that I don't need a message-box based tutorial, since those are kinda boring and also feel pretty damn cheap. I also needed to tweak how the images were displayed because the wait-time between them was far too long, and I've also updated how the vents look since they were pretty ugly previously. It was never going to be something that would take a long time but I'm happy that it's done. Here's are some images that I hope is self-explanatory, with the second image showing an example of a new sewer-tunnel minigame that works in exactly the same manner:


Fighting With Words

Another thing that I've been doing is bringing the "convobattles" (which are basically rock-paper-scissors in how they work) in line with the aesthetic applied to all the other minigames. This actually entailed a lot of work, more than I was originally expecting when I set out to make these improvements. When the "convobattles" were first implemented, only dialogue from the opponent that continued the "convobattle" was shown as an image. All other text was shown using a normal message box, including all instances of Cheska's speech during these "convobattles". This meant that each "convobattle" only needed 3-5 images producing. When I started updating the graphics, I quickly decided that all the dialogue should be shown in speech bubbles so that the same aesthetic was maintained throughout the course of the whole "convobattle", which meant that loads of new images needed to be created. It ended up being pretty tedious work, but I'm happy with the results!


I'm also happy to say that all the "convobattles" in the game have now been updated, which was something I only just finished doing on New Year's Day. The ability to avoid combat by getting these minigames right is going to play a big role in how different players end up experiencing this game, because many battles can be avoided if you get the associated "convobattle" right. I'm not currently planning to have your success rate in "convobattles" have an affect on the ending, but it's something that has come to mind in the past. Definitely something for me to think about as I come to implement the closing scenes of the game!

Taking Stock

All the blog posts I've made since starting to work on development of this game again have been about updating things that were already implemented. Whether that meant replacing minigames with whole new minigames, updating graphics or simply adding more instances of under-utilised minigames, I've essentially done a lot of work without getting any closer to finishing this game. But that's okay! Why? Because this game is a hell of a lot better now than it was when I came back to developing it!

I'm pretty happy with where the project stands at the moment, but my next target is probably my most important since my next target is the battle-system. Frankly, the "interaction" system I've implemented needs to work a hell of a lot smoother and I'm sure that it can. It seems a long time ago that I was updating all the battle-animations, but I'm pretty damn happy with them and there's definitely nothing wrong with how the battle-system works from a traditional RPG stand-point. It's just that the "interaction" mechanic is the one mechanic that's meant to differentiate Sore Losers: Riot Grrrl from other RPGs with turn-based battle-systems. It's supposed to reward you for being inquisitive a lot more than it currently does. The mechanic is severely under-utilised and, if I'm being perfectly honest, it's implemented in a very cheap manner. Simply put...

MUST. DO. BETTER.
  • Production
  • Sated
  • RPG Maker 2003
  • RPG
  • 05/20/2009 01:46 PM
  • 01/01/2017 04:30 PM
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Posts

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Sated
puking up frothing vitriolic sarcastic spittle
8002
Whoops, meant to blog this.

Edited out...
edchuy
You the practice of self-promotion
1624
I am downloading the the tech-demo and hopefully will be able to give you some feedback later. I know you mentioned it on the RS! X post. I was hoping to be able to add it to my list had it been released a lot earlier, but I am currently writing the wrap-up article. I'm still giving it a whirl.
Sated
puking up frothing vitriolic sarcastic spittle
8002
I did mean to get something ready by the Release Something! date but it didn't happen. I didn't want to force it since that would've just ended up making the game worse.

Your effort to get all the releases reviewed is brilliant - can't wait for the round-up.
edchuy
You the practice of self-promotion
1624
I just finished the demo. Everything seems to work as intended and well explained, which I suspected it would be, since you probably spent a bit of extra time on it (that, I suspect, was the reason it wasn't ready for RS! X). Definitely a different type of gameplay than I'm used to. Kind of reminds me of some early adventure PC games. Did catch a spelling/typing mistake: "parliament".

Regarding the arguments (you need to update your corresponding screenshot to show your new options as well as your title screen), I was able to avoid the first one, but not the second. Regarding battles, I could have done better had I figured that you could bring you a menu to change fighting to passive ATB. A certain animal as well as a paranoid weapon wielding person almost had their way with me (I somehow avoided seeing the game over screen). Also, I like the idea of having environment dependent options both in and out of fights to make it interesting. Finally, nice choice of music and colors. All those things more than make up for not being able to move your character around ...

I'll eventually try out the original Sore Losers! In the meantime, I'm hoping to post my round-up by tomorrow.
Sated
puking up frothing vitriolic sarcastic spittle
8002
Sounds like you liked it, which is good! I'll sort out the spelling mistake, that is a pretty silly one to miss.

Kind of reminds me of some early adventure PC games.

GOOD!

I thought some of my dungeons in the original Sore Losers were too straight-forward and I hope I can make the player think a little more throughout the course of this game. I'm glad you noticed the influence from adventure games as those point-and-click style of games were one of my major inspirations when it came to the area-map gameplay. The other influences were games like Resident Evil and Fear Effect: I loved the way those games mixed puzzles with combat and I am trying to do the same here (albeit with RPG-style combat).

Regarding the arguments (you need to update your corresponding screenshot to show your new options as well as your title screen), I was able to avoid the first one, but not the second.

Yes, the screenshots do need updating, thanks for reminding me. It shouldn't take too long to get that sorted out. As for the arguments, they are basically there because too many arguments in too many games are simply scripted and I want the player to have more influence over them. In Sore Losers there is branched dialogue that lets you choose what the main character says in order to influence the dialogue (although not the outcome. It is faux decision making, really). I thought I would take that a step further in this game by turning it into a minigame.

Besides, everyone loved the rock-paper-scissors bosses in Alex Kidd in Miracle World , right? (I am slightly biased because I adore that game).

Regarding battles, I could have done better had I figured that you could bring you a menu to change fighting to passive ATB. A certain animal as well as a paranoid weapon wielding person almost had their way with me

Using the passive ATB does make things a little easier, but I think that is true of all games. Each battle is supposed to be challenging enough that it will threaten you as you get fully-healed between battles - it would be pointless having battles being too easy as then there'd be no challenge at all.

I'll eventually try out the original Sore Losers! In the meantime, I'm hoping to post my round-up by tomorrow.

I can't wait for the round-up. I didn't have time to play too many of the releases so hopefully I can use your round-up to see what I should really look to be playing out of all the releases. And you should definately play the first game - the contrast between that (a fairly traditional RPG) and this should be pretty obvious.
I don't like games that start with a long and hard-to-understand dialog, followed by an extremely difficult battle. But it looks great, it's worth another shot... and probably another, and another...

---edit---

Sorry, just found out that the first battle is actually easy. I didn't understand the isntructions the first time.

---edit after playing---
I like this a lot. I'm not big fan of this sort of setting, but I like what I see from this game... like the graphics, love the soundtrack, like the custom systems, like not having to wander around on maps. Only recommendations I'd make is making maps more busy, and having LESS text. I don't like having to confirm every movement action, and there's just too much instructions for everything. There should be a INSTRUCTIONS OFF option, because people might actually want to replay the game.

And please, don't import the entire RTP into your game's folders. :P

Also, this kind of game would do well with a save anywhere option.
Sated
puking up frothing vitriolic sarcastic spittle
8002
Sorry, just found out that the first battle is actually easy. I didn't understand the isntructions the first time.

Yep. You just have to use the "Interact" option the tutorial suggests. Glad you worked it out because you can't actually win that first battle any other way.

making maps more busy

Do you mean graphically? I know the interior maps need some more stuff put into them (like I said above). Or do you mean in terms of gameplay because I think they're quite busy as it is.

I don't like having to confirm every movement action

I supose that could get annoying when you're back-tracking but I didn't really notice. I'll take a look into turning the options off and having it be a direct transition. Unless there actually are multiple choices, obviously!

There should be a INSTRUCTIONS OFF option

I'll put an option dialogue before each tutorial. No big deal.

And please, don't import the entire RTP into your game's folders. :P

It's for people who don't usually play RPGMaker games or who don't have the RM2K3 RTP installed natively. I prefer this over having to release two different downloads. If the filesize gets too big I'll make a non-RTP version as well but, as it is, I don't see the filesize being an issue.

Also, this kind of game would do well with a save anywhere option.

The way the overlays work makes save-anywhere a dangerous option, unfortunately. It took me a while to make it so the overlay reappeared after you load the game from the save room - where I get to choose whether you save or not - so not having control over where the player saves could bring up some interesting issues I don't want bringing up. Come to think of it, the first two save rooms might still be broken in this aspect! I think I forgot to check them!

Also, I want to discourage people from abusing save/load considering there are a lot of optional branches that affect the way you get AP, how many battles you fight, what items you get etc. I don't want people reloading the game over and over until they get the results they want. Having sporadic save-points instead of save-anywhere allows me to stop people doing this (to a degree).
-Yes, I mean busy graphically. System-wise it's fine. I like the search thing a lot.
-About the RTP, you can import just the files you use. I know it's somewhat annoying, and you run the risk of forgetting a file and breaking your game. But that saves you the trouble of having 20MB+ of useless files in your folders.
-I understand your problem with save anywhere. But at least consider having more savepoints. Cheating is more a question of ethics than possibility. It's an rm2k3 game, people might as well hack the game, so you shouldn't worry about constant reloading that much. I just hate it when I want to stop playing the game, but I'm far from a saving moment.
Sated
puking up frothing vitriolic sarcastic spittle
8002
About the RTP, you can import just the files you use.

I think there is a program I can use to do this for me. Should be fine. I'll do that next time.
comment=26605
About the RTP, you can import just the files you use.
I think there is a program I can use to do this for me. Should be fine. I'll do that next time.

You're right. There is such a program and you can get it here:
http://whoopanetwork.com/rmtool/
Sated
puking up frothing vitriolic sarcastic spittle
8002
Thanks for that!

Saves me a lot of time since I couldn't remember the name of the program (but I am sure a Google search would've brought it up).
I forgot to ask... is this a single-character game?
Max McGee
My name is Legion: for we are many.
8344
I am really fucking bored so I'm going to comment on this as I play it.

Comment #0: I fucking love the music. That's the good news. The bad news is, based on this, I assume most people won't like it. Also the reuse of tracks and looping of tracks is a little weird/jarring, but probably necessary for space reasons.

Comment #1 (NOT REALLY): Contractions. Please use contractions. People talk and think in contractions. The absence of contractions in the introductory dialogue was extremely offputting. This is an issue throughout the whole demo. Especially with dialogue like:

"I am not gonna gonna leave, I did nothing! I am not a criminal."

If you're going to use "gonna" than please use "I'm". Even "I'm not going to" is preferable to "I am not gonna". This might seem really arbitrary and nitpicky but...honestly, it isn't...

Comment #2: Early fights feel a little TOO close. One or two unlucky misses or criticals might lead to a frustrating early game over. I can talk about this more if you like.

Comment #3: You are really using rm2k3 in a way it does NOT want to be used. Don't worry, I love these kinds of "abuses" of the engine. And unlike making a tile-based ABS, it's not innately impossible to make this kind of game in rm2k3. Just very counterintuitive. I could talk about what a weird genre-mutt your game is for hours but for now, let me just say that some of the 'show text' commands seem a little bit extraneous. Your game has graphics (even if it has very little animation)...do I really need a text summary of every move I make? Also, I am thinking that maybe mapping building entrances to different numbers might be more efficient than having a second show-choice menu after hitting 3: Buildings.

Comment #4: You are really good at minigames. Could you help me with some?

Comment #5: Continuing comment #2 I did everything "right" and still died during the fight with the drunk in the tavern. Conclusion: I think that defending should restore health too. Also the '99999' to everything at the end of a fight is a bit jarring, but I guess there's no workaround for it.

Comment #6: Oh no, a Rock Paper Scissors based CBS. I am flashing back to The Way. BTW: comments can be "Vicious" but only oil can be "Viscous". And I don't think this is a King's English vs. American English thing, either. The difference here of course from the way is that this isn't a pure guess...but you're going to have to be VERY CONSISTENT with your dialogue to make it possible for the player to guess which dialogue lines are what. In other words, you've created a battle system that requires you to be a good writer.

Comment #7: Shouldn't there be some incentive for succeeding a search on the first try? Perhaps a better item? Because there's no disincentive for failing.

Comment #8: In spite of what it says in the tutorial, the "Previous" command doesn't seem to let you enter the leftmost building.

Comment #9: Fight with dog takes too long. If I can kill a human with one hit with a bottle, I should be able to one-hit a dog with a sledgehammer. Sledgehammer should cost more SP to use than the bottle but do significantly more damage. They were way too comparable. Also, last time I checked, dogs weren't venomous.

Comment #10: Nice of the rioters not to destroy the computer. : )

Comment #11: Emphasizing Comment #0. I am really starting to hate this Brand New song. And this is one of my favorite bands. Time for a change, please!

Comment #12: Hotwiring minigame is the first out of...five? That I have found annoying, rather than fun. Too much guesswork.

Comment #13: Continuing Comment #6....Viscious beats Timid, right? Isn't someone who is stuttering being TIMID? So how come when I respond to game clerk's second stutter with "Viscious", I lose? This is exactly the kind of thing I was talking about.

Comment #14: Level of RMN references/second is overloading my delight meter.

Comment #15: Want to take a break. Where is the damn save point.

Comment #16: Oh, there it is. Good timing. Need a break from this fucking Brand New song.

Sated
puking up frothing vitriolic sarcastic spittle
8002
I forgot to ask... is this a single-character game?

There will be temporary party-members you can obtain for a set-amount of time later in the game, but for the most part Cheska will be the only character - this is why she spends so much time talking to herself.

@Max: That is a lot of comments. Right, lemme see here:

Comment #1 (NOT REALLY): Contractions. Please use contractions. People talk and think in contractions. The absence of contractions in the introductory dialogue was extremely offputting. This is an issue throughout the whole demo. Especially with dialogue like:

Cheska is supposed to speak without any contractions so I will have to go and change that "gonna" to "going to". I keep slipping into the way I would say things rather than the way I want her to say things and the same can probably be said for a couple of the NPCs you meet. I'll go back through and see what needs changing.

Comment #2: Early fights feel a little TOO close. One or two unlucky misses or criticals might lead to a frustrating early game over. I can talk about this more if you like.

Every fight is supposed to be challenging. I'm going to be adding another save-point earlier into the game to try and make any deaths less jarring. The second tutorial fight could do with a little bit of a change because two misses will lead to you dying and that could probably put people off. I'll look into it.

let me just say that some of the 'show text' commands seem a little bit extraneous. Your game has graphics (even if it has very little animation)...do I really need a text summary of every move I make?

This has already been (partially) worked out. I have added doors to the inside of buildings so you know when you are entering/exiting so there is no longer any need to confirm everything all the time. I am also going to take a little bit of your advice and change the "3: Buildings" command to "3: Tavern" etc. if there is only one building you can enter on a specific map. However, I am afraid the dialogue options are going to be sticking around for the cases when you have more than one building you can enter.

Comment #6: Oh no, a Rock Paper Scissors based CBS. I am flashing back to The Way. BTW: comments can be "Vicious" but only oil can be "Viscous". And I don't think this is a King's English vs. American English thing, either.

Eep. Bad spelling is bad. I write "viscous" a lot as a chemist so I shouldn't be making a mistake like that.

The difference here of course from the way is that this isn't a pure guess...but you're going to have to be VERY CONSISTENT with your dialogue to make it possible for the player to guess which dialogue lines are what. In other words, you've created a battle system that requires you to be a good writer.

Yep, which as you point out later probably hasn't quite worked out for the best! I'd like to think that I can write consistent responses for a battle-system that is relatively simple, though. I don't think I am that bad a writer.

Comment #7: Shouldn't there be some incentive for succeeding a search on the first try? Perhaps a better item? Because there's no disincentive for failing.

Hmmm. Perhaps. I'll have a think about it, but there aren't really that many items in the database to work with. Perhaps an AP-bonus for getting it right the first time around?

Comment #8: In spite of what it says in the tutorial, the "Previous" command doesn't seem to let you enter the leftmost building.

I simply forgot to change the dialogue in the tutorial. I'll sort that out.

Comment #9: Fight with dog takes too long. If I can kill a human with one hit with a bottle, I should be able to one-hit a dog with a sledgehammer. Sledgehammer should cost more SP to use than the bottle but do significantly more damage. They were way too comparable. Also, last time I checked, dogs weren't venomous.

Every time I have fought that thing it has taken me a handful of turns. I will look into reducing the dogs HP. Dogs may not be venomous but... *shrug*

Comment #10: Nice of the rioters not to destroy the computer. : )

Convenient, isn't it.

Comment #11: Emphasizing Comment #0. I am really starting to hate this Brand New song. And this is one of my favorite bands. Time for a change, please!

The next area has a change in music (both area-map and battle music). The demo only shows you the very first area of the game (the end of the demo is the end of the first area - the very next map has new music).

Comment #12: Hotwiring minigame is the first out of...five? That I have found annoying, rather than fun. Too much guesswork.

There is a logical way to go about it, but the early exchanges are pure guess-work. I'll cut-back on my use of that minigame in the future since that is the second time someone has said it is tedious.

Comment #13: Continuing Comment #6....Viscious beats Timid, right? Isn't someone who is stuttering being TIMID? So how come when I respond to game clerk's second stutter with "Viscious", I lose? This is exactly the kind of thing I was talking about.

I took a while deciding whether or not to leave the stutter in, I guess I made the wrong decision. I will take it out.

Comment #14: Level of RMN references/second is overloading my delight meter.

:)
Max McGee
My name is Legion: for we are many.
8344
Cheska is supposed to speak without any contractions

Then please make sure EVERYONE ELSE uses contractions normally so as to indicate this is characterization. (The soldiers/punks/drunks/rioters also didn't seem to be using any !!)

Perhaps an AP-bonus for getting it right the first time around?

That'd be about perfect.

Also: Do you lose the talking minigame for "tying" the other person? I was unclear on that. (i.e. rock v. rock, scissors v. scissors, paper v. paper).

Final Also: I have some music suggestions.
Sated
puking up frothing vitriolic sarcastic spittle
8002
Then please make sure EVERYONE ELSE uses contractions normally so as to indicate this is characterization. (The soldiers/punks/drunks/rioters also didn't seem to be using any !!)

I'll check. I think most of the other characters do use them, although other characters who work for the Government (like Cheska) will most likely speak the same way she does.

Also: Do you lose the talking minigame for "tying" the other person? I was unclear on that. (i.e. rock v. rock, scissors v. scissors, paper v. paper).

It currently depends who you are against - I need to either explain this or standardise it. In the two fights in the demo, tying in the alley ConvoBattle will cause you to lose but tying against the Clerk will spawn more dialogue. The Clerk was originally going to be an optional, temporary party member but I decided to introduce those on the second level.

Final Also: I have some music suggestions.

Go ahead. I already have music planned for the next couple of areas but I don't have anything chosen musically after those.
Max McGee
My name is Legion: for we are many.
8344
Well for starters, failure to include this song (not a great recording or whatever, but I couldn't find a really good-version on you-tube) will cause me to be a sad panda, and murder your unborn children, in that order.

In other words, a sad panda will be devouring your unborn children.

(Seriously, this song is your game.)
Sated
puking up frothing vitriolic sarcastic spittle
8002
Jumping..?

There is no area-map movement as such. It plays more like a point-and-click game/DOS game.
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