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This page is for discussion of the artistic side of content creation, such as writing and characterization, as well as for the posting of incomplete content for the purpose of receiving feedback from each other.

Feel free to discuss characters and stories you are working on.
The old Custom Content thread can be found here. The first archived artistic discussion thread can be found here.

Posts

Marrend
Guardian of the Description Thread
21781
Comments on Megumi, under hide-tag:


To be honest, I didn't really have strong feelings for the character until I hit the SOUL-check. I sorta knew it was coming, thanks to having the story-file on the side (Bad Marrend!). I was randomly pretty close to the target number anyway, but it seems like a slight case of "Guide Damn It"? As to her reaction to the fail-routes, they rub me the wrong way. Let me attempt to articulate my issues. We are told about her short fuse in respect to the story she relates about Kioshi (where she says that he has a big mouth, and got what he deserves), and the event with Sota, (which I didn't take very seriously). However, I didn't really understand how short a fuse it was until I hit a "landmine". For me, it was Such STORY 18's BRANCHes. I think players really need to know what the heck they are getting into. Being "told" might not be enough, as was my case. It has to be "shown" instead. This is a difference that would make this character shine more, I think. The scene in question may even have a "Gee, I better not piss this girl off" comment from <player> for good measure.

Ugh. I know Masako has a "landmine", because her tachie doesn't even appear unless you can pass her first check, and if you don't make that check, fat chance, buddy, she's gone. Though, I do provide a clue as to how to pass that check. I'm still more than a bit leery about portions of the above comment.

Anyway, speaking of "landmines", with the other event, I chose "Don't do anything reckless.", thinking that <player> would attempt to provide some kind of "If you beat them up, wouldn't that ultimately prove the rumors they are spreading?" line. Except that never happens, Megumi over-reacts, and <player> is not allowed to say any more, and, presumably, the route ends in a fail-boat. I feel like <player> is doing what I'd do in this situation by letting it go in this manner, and it comes off wrong/weird/out-of-character. I feel like <player> should, at least, attempt to get Megumi to understand his point, even if she doesn't immediately appreciate it. If you must, do a PERSONALITY (and SOUL?) check to see how well <player> articulates his argument. Though, players would appreciate some kind of warning that a check is coming, and avoid an(other?) instance of "Guide Damn It".



Saying all that...
...I really like her background! The best way to describe why is that it's like Shoko's, only with enough spirit (spine?) not only to recover from being ignored, but outright embracing the friendship of others.
author=Marrend
"Don't do anything reckless.", thinking that <player> would attempt to provide some kind of "If you beat them up, wouldn't that ultimately prove the rumors they are spreading?"


Actually that was a land mine where she overreacted but then understood the players point, so she stopped freaking out. I believe there's only one land mine in the choices there where you fail the route. It's not "Don't do anything reckless" or "That's not smart" but I don't remember the name of the choice.

And with the Sota event...
The event with Sota wasn't actually serious. Sota wasn't being serious either, which I think could be easily caught by the Neanderthal comment. But, later in the route it'll say something somewhere where Megumi finds out that they only do stuff like that because of her short temper.


Also; for the Soul Check I was thinking about putting it at 25, rather than 30 since 30 was bit high for it only being at Story 13.
Marrend
Guardian of the Description Thread
21781
Riiiight. "What will that achieve" was what I chose, and that is the landmine <player> trips over. I'm not sure why I thought it was the other one, especially since I had the freaking file right in front of me to reference.
Don't interpret a harsh post as a personal attack. I'm just serious like that^^ We can't afford humor or social niceties in these topics. What was important to get the warning across.
author=Dozen
Don't interpret a harsh post as a personal attack. I'm just serious like that^^ We can't afford humor or social niceties in these topics. What was important to get the warning across.


I would of taken it as just a normal warning and understood as it is, but saying that I needed to see a doctor is far from being constructive, especially since it was just about a route that didn't agree or disagree with something directly. Either or, it's not worth discussing at this point since I already said I was going to cut that scene out.
I would of taken it as just a normal warning and understood as it is, but saying that I needed to see a doctor is far from being constructive, especially since it was just about a route that didn't agree or disagree with something directly.

I didn't say anything of the sort...
Those who suffered enough brain damage to doubt this can be anything but gross and against the law, in a developed country, in the 21th century, read the hidden text below. Also see a doctor.

Taken at a literal value, you are not that person. Since you are clearly aware you aren't, you have no reason to believe it refers to you, or anyone in particular. I dislike your idea that I'd go out of my way for a childish insult for no constructive reason. Honestly, that's meaner than anything I've ever said. And Marrend knows, I've said things.

Taken as rhetoric, as it was intended, it's ridicule. Do well in the future to recognize it. You're a writer, and should have the skills of one.
Marrend
Guardian of the Description Thread
21781
author=Dozen
Honestly, that's meaner than anything I've ever said. And Marrend knows, I've said things. And Marrend knows, I've said things.

I recall thinking some of the things you said against my "review" of Joruri as a personal attack at the time. Or maybe it was the first "complete" release of Fran? Definitely the latter. I'm not too sure of the former, and I really don't want to look it up.

*Edit:
@Render: I can see how you might think that "Go see a doctor" was not connected to "Those who suffered enough brain damage (etc)". However, you took it as two separate thoughts, and reacted accordingly. Though, I guess that much is obvious, and, uh I guess I should just let it go. Rather than have it eat at me.
Wowwwww, okay then. I took that really out of context .-. I apologize to both of you since that was really ridiculous of me. Anyways, I probably should note that I'll be going on vacation soon and won't be able to write much for Megumi, but I'll make sure to keep up on the threads here.
Whoa, this quite a lot of buzz. xD

About the machine of discord, yep, that were unnecessary, but to be honest I saw the comments before the story, and I thought it were way worse... :p
You guys are too straight sometimes, I remeber of flowerthief calling dozen attention about it once, although this is kind of how a overseer need to be, ya?
Anyhow this thing is already settled.

I really like her dialogues, they're really natural and her theme fits great with them. *-*
As a suggestion, maybe the first story can use a bulit-in base music until Megumi appears, as the silence get's kinda odd after three lines, a "ambient" classroom sound would do the trick too, but I don't have any idea of where on could find one of these... :p
So, don't let the whole machine stuff (As a heads up, yep, I agree in cut it out) prevent you from keep it up, you're doing great. ^^


Ps. I shouldn't be reviving the discussion but... You have to agree that convenience is store IS lewd.
Studio-74 (where nearly all backgrounds came) is filled with R-18 material, and their backgrounds reflect that.
Flowerthief handpicked the usable ones, there's still things that shouldn't be there on the backgrounds... It's more noticeable on the store, but there's even a poster on the sick room. I thought about making a fix patch for them at least twice. :p

Edit: And... a wild post appears, seems that I'm taking to long to write as always...
So, it turns out that when I'm traveling and/or at night time, I'll be able to write and tweak things with Megumi's story.

I'll be posting the updated Megumi rar on here soon which will include...
- More "thoughts" for the player.
- More stories.
- Changed the Convenience Store scene.
- Added more to the "What Will That Achieve?" branch.
- Added a scene which you can get back on the route after blowing up the land mine. You can even fail the Soul Check and redeem yourself with a personality check.
- Made a scene which basically gives you hints for the upcoming Athletics Check.
- Made another scene Sota! (However, it's only accessible if you blow up the land mine, and don't attempt to talk to Megumi after.
- Made some tachie for Sota while using the generator Marrend linked. I'm debating if I should use them not though.


Also, to Dozen...
I read your post again and realized that I misunderstood it HEAVILY. That was childlish of me, and I can assure you that no such thing will happen again.


However, for the people who have tested Megumi, I DO have some questions for you...
1) Was the introduction event rocky? I feel like it could be more natural. 2) Does the player sound like Flowerthief's player? I'm trying to a for that. 3) What is your opinion of the Soul Check?
4) Where do you think the story is heading? (I'm just curious about this.)
5) Is there any other opinions that you'd like to share? Possibly things I could tweak or add.


Thanks in advance ^^
author=Render
Also, to Dozen...
I read your post again and realized that I misunderstood it HEAVILY. That was childlish of me, and I can assure you that no such thing will happen again.
^^~
Thank you for considering me:3

author=Render
However, for the people who have tested Megumi, I DO have some questions for you...
1) Was the introduction event rocky? I feel like it could be more natural.
It could be, I'd say; but it would make it worse, not better.

The event's 'rocky' nature as you'd put it stems from Megumi's characteristics. She's caught up in her own little business where other people's ills and expectations matter little to her in comparison. The event does a great job of portraying that!^^
Honestly, what would an alternative be? The girl runs into the player, and apologizes? We've seen that a thousand times, doesn't fit Megumi's personality, and, 'less it did so it would certainly not be an entertaining story.

Leave her role in it as it is for the most part.^^

author=Render
2) Does the player sound like Flowerthief's player? I'm trying to a for that.
Not up with my standards, it fits into the requirements neat(the requirements are not based on my standards cuz my standards are impossible). He does sound like him decently. ... but he isn't. For one reason: He doesn't think to himself.
An important characteristic of the Player early on is a diminished ability to express himself well. He has thoughts and ideas grounded in common sense, a pleasantly slow nature, and a pinch of perversion, but he doesn't have the know-how to say any of that out loud at the beginning of the game without sounding like a creep.

This lends itself to story-telling devices, by the way~ The Player's inner monologues are often(In fact, should be) used to lampshade something odd that happened during, or after an event in question. In the first event, he would comment on how she takes an entire class consisting of morons for granted based on hearsay, definitely. Lacking this particular addition to assure those in front of the screen that 'Yes, we are aware this is ridiculous. It's part of the story, and we are not idiots.' we and our game would be seen in the perception of the audience we wouldn't want to.

Also, it's amazing to portray tension(see Akari's or Shoko's route) or a lead to something silly(see pretty much everything, starting with the prologue).

author=Render
3) What is your opinion of the Soul Check?
*reads*
Uuuuu O_o
This is awful>.<
Not in a storytelling sense, of course, but geez.

That said. The player would never be that big of an ass. And it doesn't take a Soul score of 30 to have the mere sympathy, let alone empathy, to let people you want to like you tell you a story without criticising it before you've heard it, after you agreed to hear the story. That'd be a Soul check of around 5, and no one lets it fall so low.
author=Render
4) Where do you think the story is heading? (I'm just curious about this.)
All over the place. Just like it should be!^^ Long as the lines end at the place they're supposed to:3

author=Render
5) Is there any other opinions that you'd like to share? Possibly things I could tweak or add.
There's always something~ You can polish each and every line close to perfection! No such thing as no room for improvement. Just don't forget, it's rare thing the improvement will be significant enough to delay the release, once you felt it's up to it.

Ironically, the only thing the player thinks to himself, the 'She left' comments, are boring and redundant, like you felt the conversation beforehand needs some closure, but ended the thought process right there instead of giving it the closure. Look more closely for times when there is a comment needed, and when there is, write in more length and meaning. When there's nothing to reflect on, leave it out altogether. They can see she's gone. The screen fades away.

Oh, do something with the panty machine event. That thing shouldn't be taken so naturally, despite the (hopefully?o.o) fresh panties. Kyouki works there every Wednesday(Of course she does! That's where the porn mags right next to the counter come from!~^^). I'll work it into whatever you come up with~

As always, devs, I'm yours. Overseer off.

author=Dozen
That said. The player would never be that big of an ass. And it doesn't take a Soul score of 30 to have the mere sympathy, let alone empathy, to let people you want to like you tell you a story without criticising it before you've heard it, after you agreed to hear the story. That'd be a Soul check of around 5, and no one lets it fall so low.

Thanks for the response^^
I was actually thinking something very similar to that. And I know just how to fix it! Megumi's final Soul Check is something personal to her, and I think the whole "silence" fear would be a bit more personal to her too. So to fix this, I'm going to have Megumi be somewhat conflicted to tell the player or not. He can either assure her it'll be fine or it just won't be enough "assurance". I'm going to remove the land mine on this scene also.

For the machine part, thanks to my naivety, I seriously thought the machines were just to buy used underwear. Not for people that have weird hmm, how should I put this? Weird fetishes with underwear. That'll work. I'm still having a total "wtf" moment since I figured out these
machines were for people to smell fracking underwear in the daytime. *heavy sigh*


For the thoughts, I edited most of the scenes to put more thoughts to make it seem more like Flowerthief's player. I'll probably edit it a bit more...
author=Render
For the machine part, thanks to my naivety, I seriously thought the machines were just to buy used underwear. Not for people that have weird hmm, how should I put this? Weird fetishes with underwear.

That's not fetishes, really. It's more of a cultural thing.

Before the end of WW2, it was not customary to wear underwear down there for Japanese women.(Man. Hitler ruins everything.) Post-war, as they had to open up to the outside world's market more to survive, panties entered the fray.

Now, the Japanese of the fifties weren't much for xenophobia as much as they were for childlike wonder for everything from overseas they had no chance to see before, so they really liked the idea. But, given their losses in the, U.S. presence giving them a hard time, and all the costs it took to extablish new trade routes(two trading hubs were bombed, mind), their economy was in all kinds of messy(hee~). Thus were panties expensive, and considered really high-class, something along the lines of jewelry.

That made them a status symbol in itself. Moreso... who are the women who have a reason to spend on fancy underwear after an economic crash, in a country where modesty is expected from the women in the family?

Why, that would be women who don't live with their family, are unmarried, yet have, or involved with someone who has the sort of money, and... opportunity to - nay, outright benefit from - showing off those new, exotic money sinks...

That's right. You get me.

40 years forward, and the now cheap panties are embedded in their culture as a direct hint at kinky sex. Hence all the panty shots we're getting.
Marrend
Guardian of the Description Thread
21781
Anybody 'round these parts want to take advantage of the Idea Bounce with me?

*Edit: I presume this is a way to get more people to RMN's IRC channel (I bet you didn't even know it had one!) more than anything else. Not that this is a bad thing, but, Liberty's more recent post about rooms sort of solidifies this theory.
Er, what I was talking about was a little different.

I'm talking about how people would buy underwear just to smell it throughout the day. I wrote underwear fetishes because I felt like it was a bit raunchy to post.


author=Render
However, for the people who have tested Megumi, I DO have some questions for you...


When I tested Megumi (and the WolfyPack), I was mainly trying to get a feeling for the character and look for any obvious errors. Now that I know what the character's about, I'll need a second playthrough to pick out that sort of thing, so maybe I'll wait for the next beta version before doing that :) . I think Dozen said most of what I'd have said anyway.

author=Marrend
Anybody 'round these parts want to take advantage of the Idea Bounce with me?


I haven't used IRC in years. That said, the time you picked pretty much eliminates any possibility of my presence, since that's freakin' 5 AM to 9 AM local time on a Saturday :P .
author=Dozen
author=Render
For the machine part, thanks to my naivety, I seriously thought the machines were just to buy used underwear. Not for people that have weird hmm, how should I put this? Weird fetishes with underwear.
That's not fetishes, really.
(...)
...Hence all the panty shots we're getting.

Riiight... Guess that the "plain nonsense" idea I had about them, was a little naive.
I spent a lot of time wondering why on earth a girl would want a new one on the hurry, but this is heavier than anything I could came up with, I understand the situation and how that could happen with any country, and probably happened with rather, mundane, stuff. But still... holy V8.
Guess that half of our girls would break up that machine on sight... (and the store owner afterwards) :p

author=Marrend
Anybody 'round these parts want to take advantage of the Idea Bounce with me?

It's something I'd like to check out, but I usually leave work 3am at friday/saturtday and on my time line it will be at 6am to 10am... Maybe I can still appear at the end ^^

On my usual picture no-one-asked-for tradition, I've played around with the store background. :3
Marrend
Guardian of the Description Thread
21781
author=Kevincalanor
On my usual picture no-one-asked-for tradition, I've played around with the store background. :3


Is that a Heartache tachie on the magazine cover in the lower-left? That's... kinda both brilliant and hilarious simultaneously.

*Edit: In respect to the Idea Bounce, I have a funny feeling I'm not going to stay for the entire period that I signed up for. I dunno. I guess it ultimately depends on what is discussed, but, I'm pretty sure what I really need is, like, a huge morale boost.
author=Render
I'm talking about how people would buy underwear just to smell it throughout the day. I wrote underwear fetishes because I felt like it was a bit raunchy to post.


So was I!:3
The majority of them are into that^^' It's like, say, how we're into masturbation. There are some people who don't enjoy it, prolly. There are also some shmucks who have so little regard for the rest of us they'd do it in daylight. But having the thing for it is the standard, not the exception. You can buy that underwear, hide it throughout the day, and... use when no one can see it, like a picture of a model you really like. Standard teenage girls and boys.

author=Kevincalator
Guess that half of our girls would break up that machine on sight... (and the store owner afterwards) :p
Mhm^^
That's the right attitude to have:3
author=Dozen
author=Render
I'm talking about how people would buy underwear just to smell it throughout the day. I wrote underwear fetishes because I felt like it was a bit raunchy to post.


So was I!:3

The majority of them are into that^^'

I... I just don't know how to respond to this... XD
I guess it doesn't surprise me too much since a lot of countries have their own little things their into.

Also that Convenience Store touch-up looks good ^^
I did remember reading a comment on some Heartache 101 page from someone saying that their younger brother and/or sister couldn't play it due to the explicit images.