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WHAT MAKES A GOOD ADVENTURE GAME?
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SnowOwl
5188
SnowOwl
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CloseAdventure games have been declared dead by critics far and near,
but as far as we're concerned, they're alive and well in our hearts.
So being a adventure game maker myself, I was wondering:
What makes a good adventure game?
I enjoy games in which the pace is slow and the reward is for thinking and figuring,
rather than quick reflexes.
Story and atmosphere also plays a big part for me.
To avoid confusion, the definition of an adventure game is: "An adventure game is a type of video game characterized by investigation, exploration, puzzle-solving, interaction with game characters, and a focus on narrative rather than reflex-based challenges."
but as far as we're concerned, they're alive and well in our hearts.
So being a adventure game maker myself, I was wondering:
What makes a good adventure game?
I enjoy games in which the pace is slow and the reward is for thinking and figuring,
rather than quick reflexes.
Story and atmosphere also plays a big part for me.
To avoid confusion, the definition of an adventure game is: "An adventure game is a type of video game characterized by investigation, exploration, puzzle-solving, interaction with game characters, and a focus on narrative rather than reflex-based challenges."
Worthwhile exploration and atmosphere for me, I think that's the essence of an adventure.
Character building too, of course. But the most important is making the exploration fun, which automatically ties in with atmosphere. You can't have fun exploring if the world around you is terribly laid out or mapped.
I label my main project an adventure, because action just doesn't make much sense to me. It doesn't have much puzzles(like 2? kinda) but the goal is to get from point A to point B without dying and scavenging what you can along the way, and that sounds like an adventure to me.
Do you think turn based battles would count as reflex-based? I think an adventure would be fraught with battles!
Character building too, of course. But the most important is making the exploration fun, which automatically ties in with atmosphere. You can't have fun exploring if the world around you is terribly laid out or mapped.
I label my main project an adventure, because action just doesn't make much sense to me. It doesn't have much puzzles(like 2? kinda) but the goal is to get from point A to point B without dying and scavenging what you can along the way, and that sounds like an adventure to me.
Do you think turn based battles would count as reflex-based? I think an adventure would be fraught with battles!
LockeZ
I'd really like to get rid of LockeZ. His play style is way too unpredictable. He's always like this too. If he ran a country, he'd just kill and imprison people at random until crime stopped.
5958
Oh yeah those games are so dead. No one liked the Phoenix Wright games for example. And then you have relics like Zelda and Metroid and Castlevania, no one has bought any of those games in fifteen years, I didn't even realize they were still making them. It's a good thing no one's tried to make any AAA adventure games recently - they'd probably come up with a bunch of stupid ideas like combining adventure-style exploration with a huge open world sandbox environment, and calling it something pretentious like L.A. Noire, or making some stupid Batman spinoff set in Arkham Asylum or Arkham City.
Oh wait all of those games are super popular adventure games, never mind
So yeah this genre isn't really my area of creative expertise but I felt really compelled to point out that adventure games are not only not dead but are super duper popular. They were pretty near dead about eight or ten years ago; perhaps your information is out of date? When they came back to life in the GBA/PS2 era, some dumbasses started calling a certain type of them "Metroidvanias" because it had been so long since anyone made any decent ones that they'd forgotten what the genre was actually called. Pro tip: Metroidvania games are a type of adventure game that allow you to unlock new paths as you gain powers, where platforming and combat are present but are vastly simplified and de-emphasised compared to exploration, which is the key focus.
Uh... no, the two terms are opposites. Being one specifically means not being the other.
But being an adventure game doesn't strictly mean NO REFLEXES EVER any more than being an RPG does. It just means that reflex-based challenges are generally not the emphasis of the game, compared to an action game.
Also keep in mind that pretty much every game is a mash-up of several genres, these days. But that doesn't mean that each game doesn't have a main genre that is the key emphasis of the game and the reason players pick it up. Final Fantasy 12 has a lot of exploration elements, but the gameplay is mostly about building up your characters' strength and using different tactics to win menu-driven battles - so we call it an RPG, and not an adventure game. But really, it's a mix. Every game these days is a mix, just about.
Oh wait all of those games are super popular adventure games, never mind
So yeah this genre isn't really my area of creative expertise but I felt really compelled to point out that adventure games are not only not dead but are super duper popular. They were pretty near dead about eight or ten years ago; perhaps your information is out of date? When they came back to life in the GBA/PS2 era, some dumbasses started calling a certain type of them "Metroidvanias" because it had been so long since anyone made any decent ones that they'd forgotten what the genre was actually called. Pro tip: Metroidvania games are a type of adventure game that allow you to unlock new paths as you gain powers, where platforming and combat are present but are vastly simplified and de-emphasised compared to exploration, which is the key focus.
Do you think turn based battles would count as reflex-based?
Uh... no, the two terms are opposites. Being one specifically means not being the other.
But being an adventure game doesn't strictly mean NO REFLEXES EVER any more than being an RPG does. It just means that reflex-based challenges are generally not the emphasis of the game, compared to an action game.
Also keep in mind that pretty much every game is a mash-up of several genres, these days. But that doesn't mean that each game doesn't have a main genre that is the key emphasis of the game and the reason players pick it up. Final Fantasy 12 has a lot of exploration elements, but the gameplay is mostly about building up your characters' strength and using different tactics to win menu-driven battles - so we call it an RPG, and not an adventure game. But really, it's a mix. Every game these days is a mix, just about.
The first step is to take the Cat Hair Mustache and do the exact opposite of it in every way. The second step is far less important and not worth discussing in the same post as the first step.
SnowOwl
5188
@LockeZ: My knowledge may indeed be outdated, I don't play a lot of new games. That wasn't really the point of the thread though, so whatever.
It's true that most adventure games isn't only an adventure game these days. I guess it's a good thing the glory days of text-based (aka interactive fiction) games are over.
@GreatRedSpirit: Indeed.
It's true that most adventure games isn't only an adventure game these days. I guess it's a good thing the glory days of text-based (aka interactive fiction) games are over.
@GreatRedSpirit: Indeed.
Shinan
4314
Point and click adventure games (the ones that maybe were what the original post was referring to) were dead a couple of years ago. They're still kinda dead and most of their DNA is in all kinds of other genres these days. But also with all those kickstarters we're getting the Doublefine adventure and new Broken Sword and some Leisure Suit Larry remake. Oh and a bunch of others.
I like it when the puzzles are at least somewhat logical without being too obvious (that's sort of impossible to do). Alternatively there could always be multiple solutions to problems with a kind of branching quality (the Blade Runner adventure game I think did really good with this). Or it can just be really funny (Like Day of the Tentacle!). One classic way to get rid of the "what the fuck am I doing" problem in adventure game tends to have simultaneous goals. So if you get stuck on one you can always do another to let your brain rest on the other for a while.
And don't make timing-based puzzles. Jesus christ, running away from boulders or jumping to reach a platform in time. Those things are the most evil things in the world.
I like it when the puzzles are at least somewhat logical without being too obvious (that's sort of impossible to do). Alternatively there could always be multiple solutions to problems with a kind of branching quality (the Blade Runner adventure game I think did really good with this). Or it can just be really funny (Like Day of the Tentacle!). One classic way to get rid of the "what the fuck am I doing" problem in adventure game tends to have simultaneous goals. So if you get stuck on one you can always do another to let your brain rest on the other for a while.
And don't make timing-based puzzles. Jesus christ, running away from boulders or jumping to reach a platform in time. Those things are the most evil things in the world.
Jeroen_Sol
Nothing reveals Humanity so well as the games it plays. A game of betrayal, where the most suspicious person is brutally murdered? How savage.
3885
Phoenix Wright is text-based. So going by how much I love Phoenix Wright I guess what makes an adventure game is:
-Slow breadcrumbing of plot to stimulate active imagination
-Heavy penalties for being wrong to stimulate careful reasoning
That's my view, but others probably think very differently.
-Slow breadcrumbing of plot to stimulate active imagination
-Heavy penalties for being wrong to stimulate careful reasoning
That's my view, but others probably think very differently.
One of the genres I grew up on were Sierra Adventure games on the ol' 286. Quest for Glory, Space Quest 3, King's Quest 4+5, Gold Rush, Leisure Suit Larry 2 (I was too young to really know what was going on besides "has puzzles will solve do shit and randomly progress in the game"), and maybe a few more. Even now I like to go try some once in a while. No doubt part of my judgment is clouded by nostalgia.
Puzzles can be fun. Not Cat Hair Mustache puzzles or using the rat to get your wallet from under the 40 pound sofa or something that can be summed up as "cake if your character wasn't retarded". Legit obstacles that even a real person would take effort to solve.
I know there's more but I can't convey it without saying "man those adventures games sure were cool". Gabriel Knight, Quest for Glory 4, and Curse of Monkey Island are the kings of the genre. Hell GK even did an acceptable job at a FMV game! I just wish I could convey why better :(
(This reminds me I should resume the Tales of Monkey Island game I started)
Puzzles can be fun. Not Cat Hair Mustache puzzles or using the rat to get your wallet from under the 40 pound sofa or something that can be summed up as "cake if your character wasn't retarded". Legit obstacles that even a real person would take effort to solve.
I know there's more but I can't convey it without saying "man those adventures games sure were cool". Gabriel Knight, Quest for Glory 4, and Curse of Monkey Island are the kings of the genre. Hell GK even did an acceptable job at a FMV game! I just wish I could convey why better :(
(This reminds me I should resume the Tales of Monkey Island game I started)
Dying. I loved dying in Sierra games. I have no idea why unless it was something dumb like "follow this path you find by dying lots". Fuck you Gold Rush.
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