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BREAKING UP: TEXT BOXES, LINE LENGTH, AND YOU
Posts
Craze
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CloseNote: This topic is a repost of a response I made to this topic/post. I feel like it's important enough to discuss as a forum.
Well, there's a time to use a single line and a time to break up the text. If you can break the line at a good breaking point (comma, period, semicolon, etc.), and the result would have the second line be the same length or slightly longer than the previous line, it'll look better than as one really long line. Etrian Odyssey and its sequels do this quite well.
Look at how even and/or easily-read all of these lines are:
Even if they're not broken at a punctuation mark, they're broken before a preposition ("to other healing skills," for example).
Compare these to the following examples of shitty linebreaking:
This doesn't give you enough information! It's a monk skill. Great. Fuck you, we know that (note: this is actually relatively important in-game due to multi-classing, but still).
This is even, yeah? Too bad an important phrase ("HP recovery") is broken up, making it harder to read at a glance. The best description is one that you don't have to actually read.
Ew ew ew oh my god this is disgusting, even if it hits the line length relatively well. This is not a book. Break up your text well.
What games do this well? Are you conscious of this when you play or design games? Does it bother you? Discuss!
***
Well, there's a time to use a single line and a time to break up the text. If you can break the line at a good breaking point (comma, period, semicolon, etc.), and the result would have the second line be the same length or slightly longer than the previous line, it'll look better than as one really long line. Etrian Odyssey and its sequels do this quite well.
Look at how even and/or easily-read all of these lines are:
Even if they're not broken at a punctuation mark, they're broken before a preposition ("to other healing skills," for example).
Compare these to the following examples of shitty linebreaking:
A monk skill that
adds HP recovery to other classes
This doesn't give you enough information! It's a monk skill. Great. Fuck you, we know that (note: this is actually relatively important in-game due to multi-classing, but still).
A monk skill that adds HP
recovery to other classes
This is even, yeah? Too bad an important phrase ("HP recovery") is broken up, making it harder to read at a glance. The best description is one that you don't have to actually read.
This is my father's shop. He makes
equipment in the back, and I sell it
in the front.
Ew ew ew oh my god this is disgusting, even if it hits the line length relatively well. This is not a book. Break up your text well.
***
What games do this well? Are you conscious of this when you play or design games? Does it bother you? Discuss!
It bothers me when an important unit of information is spread across multiple message boxes. Or when a sentence is broken up mid-messagebox. ALL SENTENCES MUST END IN THE MESSAGEBOX THEY START IN should be a rule somewhere.
I agree with kentona, because if you lose your train of though half-way through a sentence, you can't back up and review. If that entire thought is in one box, you can review it again before advancing the text.
However, I think line length is a silly thing to worry about and has zero impact on readability. Editorials use fixed widths because gaps make their content look more robust. We don't need this kind of trickery in a game, because our text boxes aren't aligned on a rack next to another game's text boxes.
However, I think line length is a silly thing to worry about and has zero impact on readability. Editorials use fixed widths because gaps make their content look more robust. We don't need this kind of trickery in a game, because our text boxes aren't aligned on a rack next to another game's text boxes.
Max McGeeThe comma in "... in the back, and I ..." and that the period in "This is my father's shop." should actually be a comma to join the two related sentences?
Can you spot the grammar error in this sentence?
JudeA line that is too wide or too narrow will be tiresome to read and lines that get broken up into odd segments (ie: Craze's "bad" examples) are just a nuisance.
However, I think line length is a silly thing to worry about and has zero impact on readability.
Personally, I think good writing also involves making the written text visually pleasing to look at.
author=CrazeThis is my father's shop. He makesEw ew ew oh my god this is disgusting, even if it hits the line length relatively well. This is not a book. Break up your text well.
equipment in the back, and I sell it
in the front.
I'm very conscious about this subject when I play and design videogames, but I strongly disagree with the above quote. Good graphic design is good graphic design anywhere, be either in a book or a videogame. You just don't adapt the rules to the medium, it is the other way around. Editorial design dictates you must make complete use of the "typographic box", so your job as a (game) designer is to find the perfect wording of things so you satisfy all of these criteria to the best of your abilities and the engine's limitations.
Bottom line is, yes, it is important to know where to break a line but that's not the only thing to look out for. And is not like using the entire length of a line is just something someone thought up in a whim and can fall out of use anytime.
author=Jude
Editorials use fixed widths because gaps make their content look more robust.
Yes and no, I mean, not always. The typographic box is designed to balance the white space of a page against the printed area, to avoid gaps in typesetting, to avoid widow lines, etc. Is a very meticulous process and a fundamental part of design; If it's done wrong it can ruin an entire book (Ugh, bad memories of my thesis) ...I agree that we don't need to worry about many of these things in videgames because they don't apply, but those that do apply are as important to follow as is color theory, or just good grammar.
author=Max McGee
Can you spot the grammar error in this sentence?
I believe it's the "them." And it should be "and I sell it up front." Maybe? I can't see anything else, except maybe commas for the prepositions.
I could be wrong, because me fail english is unpossible.
@Kentona -
It is a nightmare keeping messages all in that tiny box. I mean I consciously and meticulously try to do it, but it's unpossible for some messages. For me, especially displaying tutorials in a message box. Should probably use pictures, actually, now that I think about it.
author=KingArthur
Personally, I think good writing also involves making the written text visually pleasing to look at.
This is true for the experience, but do you mess with the spoken dialogue of a character to make the text more visually appealing?
I try to reconcile the too, but it's hard, especially when I put a high emphasis on characterization through speech.
author=Sauceauthor=Max McGeeI believe it's the "them." And it should be "and I sell it up front." Maybe?
Can you spot the grammar error in this sentence?
I could be wrong, because me fail english is unpossible.
"Equipment" is plural here, so "them" being a plural word is appropriate I believe.
author=Sauceauthor=KingArthurThis is true for the experience, but do you mess with the spoken dialogue of a character to make the text more visually appealing?
Personally, I think good writing also involves making the written text visually pleasing to look at.
I try to reconcile the too, but it's hard, especially when I put a high emphasis on characterization through speech.
I'd say content of dialogue takes precedence over visual appearance of the text, I believe the real test here as a writer is whether you can make a given piece of dialogue look great within a given space without altering the dialogue. If you can do this, you're golden.
author=KingArthur
"Equipment" is plural here, so "them" being a plural word is appropriate I believe.
Actually, "equipment" is singular as it is uncountable.
The comma placement is a bit dodgy too.
Racheal
7238
author=Yellow Magicauthor=KingArthurActually, "equipment" is singular as it is uncountable.
"Equipment" is plural here, so "them" being a plural word is appropriate I believe.
The comma placement is a bit dodgy too.
Actually, it is
IC. IC, coordinating conjunction IC
so the comma placement is fine.
More on topic, I agree completely. I cringe whenever I see a sentence broken over two boxes when it could have easily been split nicely.
author=Jude
However, I think line length is a silly thing to worry about and has zero impact on readability. Editorials use fixed widths because gaps make their content look more robust. We don't need this kind of trickery in a game, because our text boxes aren't aligned on a rack next to another game's text boxes.
I disagree with this-ish since I get insane over this one game that has line breaks but so many spaces left for the text to fit in. Here's an actual example:
And the whole game is like that. It's driving me nuts. I like my smooth, not-broken sentences. orz
author=Darken
imagine if
we all made
posts
like this
it would be
like I am
back in the
shmup irc channel
kentonaDarkenit would be
imagine if
we all made
posts
like this
like I am
back in the
shmup irc channel
l
o
l
author=Archeia_Nessiahauthor=JudeI disagree with this-ish since I get insane over this one game that has line breaks but so many spaces left for the text to fit in. Here's an actual example:
However, I think line length is a silly thing to worry about and has zero impact on readability. Editorials use fixed widths because gaps make their content look more robust. We don't need this kind of trickery in a game, because our text boxes aren't aligned on a rack next to another game's text boxes.
And the whole game is like that. It's driving me nuts. I like my smooth, not-broken sentences. orz
We're on the same side. I am uncertain why you disagree with me, because that screenshot is an example of trying to apply uniform line lengths, which is what I am saying is a silly thing to worry about. Use the width of the message box is my position for RPG Maker.
author=Jude
I agree with kentona, because if you lose your train of though half-way through a sentence, you can't back up and review. If that entire thought is in one box, you can review it again before advancing the text.
However, I think line length is a silly thing to worry about and has zero impact on readability. Editorials use fixed widths because gaps make their content look more robust. We don't need this kind of trickery in a game, because our text boxes aren't aligned on a rack next to another game's text boxes.
These are my feelings as well. I definitely take the line length and message box length into consideration in my writing, but if I absolutely have to use two text boxes to finish a thought, I will. It should be the exception, not the rule. 90-95% of my text boxes contain a single sentence or two or dialogue.
LockeZ
I'd really like to get rid of LockeZ. His play style is way too unpredictable. He's always like this too. If he ran a country, he'd just kill and imprison people at random until crime stopped.
5958
author=kentonaauthor=Darkenit would be
imagine if
we all made
posts
like this
like I am
back in the
shmup irc channel
This would be pretty terrible, but when you extend every line to completely or almost-completely fill the width of the text box, it makes it look nice, I think. Or at least nice in most cases. It makes it into a paragraph, instead of a series of sentences. If that makes sense.
I mean, I only say this because I just tried doing it the way craze suggested and it looked terrible. But maybe it only looked terrible to me because I expect it to be the other way? I think part of it is also that my text boxes have 4 lines while EO's have 2-3. It looks ugly to me when you have text boxes like this, with different line lengths:
Well, there's a time to use a single line and a time to break up the text.
If you can break the line at a good breaking point (comma, period, semicolon, etc.),
and the result would have the second line be the same length or slightly longer than the previous line,
it'll look better than as one really long line. Etrian Odyssey and its sequels do this quite well.
Well, in my games (mostly unfinished ones, though I am working hard on changing that) I keep following format:
Character's/NPC's Name
(empty line)
line 1
line 2
It does not only look robust and nice, but it is also easy to read (even thought the only thing I use line breaks is when it doesn't fit message box's width, ie. text is cut at right side of message box).
In case of commentary text boxes/boxes of "You got X" type, I usually try to use whole message box space.
Character's/NPC's Name
(empty line)
line 1
line 2
It does not only look robust and nice, but it is also easy to read (even thought the only thing I use line breaks is when it doesn't fit message box's width, ie. text is cut at right side of message box).
In case of commentary text boxes/boxes of "You got X" type, I usually try to use whole message box space.
LockeZ
I'd really like to get rid of LockeZ. His play style is way too unpredictable. He's always like this too. If he ran a country, he'd just kill and imprison people at random until crime stopped.
5958
Man, if I had only two lines to write text, every sentence in the game would be split across multiple text boxes, because I am too wordy and none of them would fit.
