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WHAT DO YOU THINK ABOUT HAREM RPG'S?
Posts
emmych
817
emmych
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CloseGiven that most of them star bland dudes surrounded by squealing caricatures of women or girls surrounded by rapey as hell dudes, I can't say I'm really a fan. I've never really liked the idea of "gaming" relationships, either, especially when you're the one pursuing characters. It feels gross and it reminds me too much of some people's attitudes in real life, because, yes, I have met (and even dated!) people who think they can put enough kindness coins into someone and sex/love will fall out.
I'd much prefer a game like Fire Emblem where you have support convos between characters and they sort of pair up depending on whose relationships you nurture. It's still the characters who have the relationship, and really it's more like coaxing them along instead of aggressively pursuing one character. That element (the aggressive pursuing) has always sorta squicked me out.
E: RIGHT plus the whole dating sim game ignores the fact that these characters would have relationships with each other as well as the main character? Like, jeez, why not have endings where two of your prospects pair up (a la Tali and Garrus in Mass Effect 3) if you don't end up romancing them? The fact the romantic prospects don't exist outside of the protagonist's relationship with them bugs me.
I'd much prefer a game like Fire Emblem where you have support convos between characters and they sort of pair up depending on whose relationships you nurture. It's still the characters who have the relationship, and really it's more like coaxing them along instead of aggressively pursuing one character. That element (the aggressive pursuing) has always sorta squicked me out.
E: RIGHT plus the whole dating sim game ignores the fact that these characters would have relationships with each other as well as the main character? Like, jeez, why not have endings where two of your prospects pair up (a la Tali and Garrus in Mass Effect 3) if you don't end up romancing them? The fact the romantic prospects don't exist outside of the protagonist's relationship with them bugs me.
Desertopa
775
If we're talking harem genre, there are a lot of crappy ones and some good ones (RPG-wise, most of what's out there isn't available in English, as LockeZ said,) but there wouldn't be so many crappy ones if there weren't a lot of people into the premise, so if you do it well I don't think you'd want for an audience.
On the other hand, if you're mixing elements from genres that have limited audience overlap, you may end up narrowing the set of people interested in playing the game. For instance, some people who're interested in high stakes political drama based stories might not be interested in a high stakes political drama based story that's also a comedic harem romance.
Of course, since we're not putting any money on the line here, that doesn't necessarily mean you shouldn't make a comedic harem political drama.
On the other hand, if you're mixing elements from genres that have limited audience overlap, you may end up narrowing the set of people interested in playing the game. For instance, some people who're interested in high stakes political drama based stories might not be interested in a high stakes political drama based story that's also a comedic harem romance.
Of course, since we're not putting any money on the line here, that doesn't necessarily mean you shouldn't make a comedic harem political drama.
Corfaisus
"It's frustrating because - as much as Corf is otherwise an irredeemable person - his 2k/3 mapping is on point." ~ psy_wombats
7874
author=Ilan14
Yeah... A comedic harem political drama sounds like an AWFUL idea. :(
"Income tax is through the roof and still the governor won't listen to us, but damn gurl, why yo ass so fine?"
A harem RPG? That's a horrible idea. You can't write a good one because the very premise itself is an example of bad writing.
If you try to create one you'll just be making a lot of work for yourself that will amount to very little. You'd have to be one hell of a writer to make it into something legit entertaining or charming. I consider myself a decent writer and I don't think I could do it without being subversive. Which kind of defeats the purpose as I understand it.
If you try to create one you'll just be making a lot of work for yourself that will amount to very little. You'd have to be one hell of a writer to make it into something legit entertaining or charming. I consider myself a decent writer and I don't think I could do it without being subversive. Which kind of defeats the purpose as I understand it.
author=Corfaisusauthor=Ilan14"Income tax is through the roof and still the governor won't listen to us, but damn gurl, why yo ass so fine?"
Yeah... A comedic harem political drama sounds like an AWFUL idea. :(
Corfasius, that phrase is pure gold! d(^o^)b
Desertopa
775
Actually, it occurs to me that my favorite visual novel (warning, site contains NSFW images) could broadly be described as a comedic harem political drama.
On the other hand, nobody who wants to convey a sense of what the game is actually like would call it that. It's not as if you can't write a story which combines political drama, comedy, and romantic tension between a single lead and several characters, and have it be good. The typical genre conventions clash with each other, but none of the elements have to be conveyed typically.
On the other hand, nobody who wants to convey a sense of what the game is actually like would call it that. It's not as if you can't write a story which combines political drama, comedy, and romantic tension between a single lead and several characters, and have it be good. The typical genre conventions clash with each other, but none of the elements have to be conveyed typically.
Avee
5794
I think that Riviera did it right in its own way. Three out of four girls develop feelings for the hero yet these remain mostly undisclosed. If memory serves right, at the end of the game you get to pick who you trust most and she'll become your partner for future adventures. Romance/Love is hardly present at all.
In any case, if you want to go down that road as a writer/designer I don't see why polygamy couldn't be acceptable in a fictional setting. Monogamy is but an arbitrary custom after all.
As emmych said, having the other characters develop their own relationships would be the better design decision. Active and/or passive pursuing are gameplay mechanics like any other, and whether you choose to implement one or the other or both depends on what the main goals of the game are.
In any case, if you want to go down that road as a writer/designer I don't see why polygamy couldn't be acceptable in a fictional setting. Monogamy is but an arbitrary custom after all.
As emmych said, having the other characters develop their own relationships would be the better design decision. Active and/or passive pursuing are gameplay mechanics like any other, and whether you choose to implement one or the other or both depends on what the main goals of the game are.
Corfaisus
"It's frustrating because - as much as Corf is otherwise an irredeemable person - his 2k/3 mapping is on point." ~ psy_wombats
7874
author=Avee
I think that Riviera did it right in its own way. Three out of four girls develop feelings for the hero yet these remain mostly undisclosed. If memory serves right, at the end of the game you get to pick who you trust most and she'll become your partner for future adventures. Romance/Love is hardly present at all.
So you get your "pick of the litter" as a reward for them throwing themselves at you? Hmm...
author=Avee
In any case, if you want to go down that road as a writer/designer I don't see why polygamy couldn't be acceptable in a fictional setting. Monogamy is but an arbitrary custom after all.
I mean, sure, if you feel like selling yourself short, I guess polygamy is fine. Maybe I just want for the other person to love and invest themselves in me as much as I do them, and maybe I feel like having to split this one person's love between a crowd of "lovers" kind of "waters down" the romance, for lack of a better term?
Corfaisus
"It's frustrating because - as much as Corf is otherwise an irredeemable person - his 2k/3 mapping is on point." ~ psy_wombats
7874
author=kentona
Are Pokemon games considered harem RPGs?
Squirtle is my waifu. <3
~uguu
author=Ilan14author=kentonaYeah... I REALLY think not... o_o
Are Pokemon games considered harem RPGs?
They could be, if one had the same... problem... That I do.
You KNOW what they were doing when they designed stuff like Gardevoir, Lopunny, etc. I'd find it hard to believe that they weren't trying to sneakily market shit to those people.
But hey, maybe I'm just a conspiracy nut.
In terms of the actual thread topic, I don't like harem RPGs. I think that they're sad to be honest. You could be spending your time making way better things than electronic dating simulators, which is what these games usually boil down to. Think about it: If I made a game where the entire point was to woo anthropomorphic rodent people what would it say about me as a designer? I certainly wouldn't want to have something so hollow and self indulgent attached to my name.
When it comes down to the wire I'd much rather see seriously well written romances being a part of the story in RPGs, as opposed to a game about objectified women throwing themselves at some Mary Sue character's feet for no reason.
Avee
5794
author=Corfaisus
So you get your "pick of the litter" as a reward for them throwing themselves at you? Hmm...
It's been years since I played but actually I think that the girl is automatically picked by the enemy depending on how caring and supporting you've been to her throughout the whole game (through event choices).
The girl is forced to fuse with a demon and you must fight her. But she is resurrected at the end of the game and becomes the hero's BFF
(sorry for spoilers).
When I say that the game did it right, it's precisely because the girls don't throw themselves at the hero. Relationships grow as they would between friends or comrades with only the slightest hints of romantic feelings involved.
In any case, the game is mostly memorable for its original gameplay design and item/skill management. The harem aspects of it are of lesser importance and not presented in an oversimplified, stereotypical way, hence why I believe they did it right.
Putting my two cents in:
No offense, Ilan, but I personally think the very concept of a "harem" (even the word itself just feels wrong) in a game is quite stupid. Not in the sense that I condemn group relationships or polygamy (I don't understand them, but that's not the point). No, what I mean is that it is just lame to pretend love or romance or whatever can be captured in a game where you get to "pick" your favourite and win them over by doing something they like. In a certain sense, it's pretty demeaning and reductionist.
It's not realistic either. Unless you're some kind of celebrity, there simply will never be a bunch of potential love interests following you around. Ninety-nine percent of all the people you meet in your life will never be interested in having a relationship with you. Why would that be different for a game's main character?
Although, now that I think about it, I would really like to see a "harem" game that utterly deconstructs the whole concept. For example, reviving that idea for a comedic harem political drama: The main character could be an influential political figure, and many potential partners would try to win him/her over all the time. But in the end, it is revealed they were all only interested in your power and money, and the main character ultimately winds up with none of them and is left all alone by himself. Hmm...
No offense, Ilan, but I personally think the very concept of a "harem" (even the word itself just feels wrong) in a game is quite stupid. Not in the sense that I condemn group relationships or polygamy (I don't understand them, but that's not the point). No, what I mean is that it is just lame to pretend love or romance or whatever can be captured in a game where you get to "pick" your favourite and win them over by doing something they like. In a certain sense, it's pretty demeaning and reductionist.
It's not realistic either. Unless you're some kind of celebrity, there simply will never be a bunch of potential love interests following you around. Ninety-nine percent of all the people you meet in your life will never be interested in having a relationship with you. Why would that be different for a game's main character?
Although, now that I think about it, I would really like to see a "harem" game that utterly deconstructs the whole concept. For example, reviving that idea for a comedic harem political drama: The main character could be an influential political figure, and many potential partners would try to win him/her over all the time. But in the end, it is revealed they were all only interested in your power and money, and the main character ultimately winds up with none of them and is left all alone by himself. Hmm...
Avee
5794
Taken on TVTropes:
"Why not make your story set around a literal harem? Powerful Kings, Khans and Emperors across the centuries have been noted in keeping several (or more) concubines or wives, spawning a massive dynasty. Take a break from the Strictly Formula setting of modern day High School and have yourserlf a story set in such a historical (or High Fantasy inspired) empire, and your protagonist is/was the Spare To The Throne who has suddenly found himself an only child, and needs to pick a bride from one of the families in court, or at least spawn an heir or three. Suddenly, you have a justified reason for the Protagonist to have been unlucky-in-love before now and suddenly have to deal with all these women, and suddenly, instead of the heroines being somewhat bratty teenagers who start of Tug Lover War at the drop of a hat, the heroines are darker, more schemy-er versions of the typical Harem Genre Archetypes, with a reason to be so fixated on the same man. Comedy may (or may not) still be apart of the feel of the story, but the audience suddenly finds it balanced with court politics and nasty schemes and temporary alliances."
I would support this game.
"Why not make your story set around a literal harem? Powerful Kings, Khans and Emperors across the centuries have been noted in keeping several (or more) concubines or wives, spawning a massive dynasty. Take a break from the Strictly Formula setting of modern day High School and have yourserlf a story set in such a historical (or High Fantasy inspired) empire, and your protagonist is/was the Spare To The Throne who has suddenly found himself an only child, and needs to pick a bride from one of the families in court, or at least spawn an heir or three. Suddenly, you have a justified reason for the Protagonist to have been unlucky-in-love before now and suddenly have to deal with all these women, and suddenly, instead of the heroines being somewhat bratty teenagers who start of Tug Lover War at the drop of a hat, the heroines are darker, more schemy-er versions of the typical Harem Genre Archetypes, with a reason to be so fixated on the same man. Comedy may (or may not) still be apart of the feel of the story, but the audience suddenly finds it balanced with court politics and nasty schemes and temporary alliances."
I would support this game.
I looked at your opinions and I can say that I completely understand them. I see that Harem RPG isn't the most popular genre... :(
I just want to clarify something about the game I'm planning, because I may have used wrong the term "harem" when reffering to the project:
- The female party members aren't automatically attract to the MC since the beggining.
- The only way to get in a relationship with another character is by increasing her affection, and you can only do that during certain points in the plot and during "date events". And these are completely optional.
- The Harem(or dating sim or whatever) element isn't the main element of the game, there's a main plot not oriented towards romance or dating. And getting in a relationship only affects certain events in the game, and adds an extra scene in the ending.
I don't know if that makes it better, but I just wanted to let that clear.
P.S. : And the game is in a Fantasy setting, for those who misinterpreted what the project was going to be about. There is a school, but it's not that central to the plot.
I just want to clarify something about the game I'm planning, because I may have used wrong the term "harem" when reffering to the project:
- The female party members aren't automatically attract to the MC since the beggining.
- The only way to get in a relationship with another character is by increasing her affection, and you can only do that during certain points in the plot and during "date events". And these are completely optional.
- The Harem(or dating sim or whatever) element isn't the main element of the game, there's a main plot not oriented towards romance or dating. And getting in a relationship only affects certain events in the game, and adds an extra scene in the ending.
I don't know if that makes it better, but I just wanted to let that clear.
P.S. : And the game is in a Fantasy setting, for those who misinterpreted what the project was going to be about. There is a school, but it's not that central to the plot.
author=Avee
Taken on TVTropes:
"Why not make your story set around a literal harem? Powerful Kings, Khans and Emperors across the centuries have been noted in keeping several (or more) concubines or wives, spawning a massive dynasty. Take a break from the Strictly Formula setting of modern day High School and have yourserlf a story set in such a historical (or High Fantasy inspired) empire, and your protagonist is/was the Spare To The Throne who has suddenly found himself an only child, and needs to pick a bride from one of the families in court, or at least spawn an heir or three. Suddenly, you have a justified reason for the Protagonist to have been unlucky-in-love before now and suddenly have to deal with all these women, and suddenly, instead of the heroines being somewhat bratty teenagers who start of Tug Lover War at the drop of a hat, the heroines are darker, more schemy-er versions of the typical Harem Genre Archetypes, with a reason to be so fixated on the same man. Comedy may (or may not) still be apart of the feel of the story, but the audience suddenly finds it balanced with court politics and nasty schemes and temporary alliances."
I would support this game.
This...is an awesome idea.
