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CRAZE'S DIRTY LITTLE SECRET
Posts
Zeph
39
Zeph
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CloseI don't have anything wrong with "hidden" stats and such, so long as the player can tell when something strange is happening or they get a nice boost.
This could actually make for a very nice passive skill. Just a thought.
post=141566
The player thinks this is his last turn - but I coded evasion to stealthily rise as HP dwindles.
This could actually make for a very nice passive skill. Just a thought.
Neok
3602
I like this. Pretend to change your mind and stop doing this to sooth all the naysayers, but in actuality, keep doing this without telling anyone.
I like hidden mechanics like evasion scaling with HP dropping.
I do not like lying to players about numbers in the game. You might as well put "Increases critical chance by 9001%" because it's just as worthless.
I do not like lying to players about numbers in the game. You might as well put "Increases critical chance by 9001%" because it's just as worthless.
Neophyte
155
If you used words rather than numbers, this wouldn't be a problem! Actually, I really hate numbers in a skill description, but that's just my preference.
But I am down for the concept. Valve's Left 4 Dead series does a very similar thing with scaling the amount of items and enemies depending on how bad or good you are doing (Director AI). It's not a hidden mechanic (it's actually their main one), but you never know how it actually works. It makes the game what it is. An RPG doing this would be cool if there isn't one yet.
But I am down for the concept. Valve's Left 4 Dead series does a very similar thing with scaling the amount of items and enemies depending on how bad or good you are doing (Director AI). It's not a hidden mechanic (it's actually their main one), but you never know how it actually works. It makes the game what it is. An RPG doing this would be cool if there isn't one yet.
post=141821
If you used words rather than numbers, this wouldn't be a problem! Actually, I really hate numbers in a skill description, but that's just my preference.
But I am down for the concept. Valve's Left 4 Dead series does a very similar thing with scaling the amount of items and enemies depending on how bad or good you are doing (Director AI). It's not a hidden mechanic (it's actually their main one), but you never know how it actually works. It makes the game what it is. An RPG doing this would be cool if there isn't one yet.
I know that Dragon Age gives out more poultices if you don't have many. That's... all I can think of off the top of my head, though.
I'm a serious control freak when it comes to games, so hidden mechanics tend to piss me off. If it's part of the game's normal functionality, the least you can do is let the player know about it.
It's one thing to pull through in a lucky moment, and another to have the game rig itself to make those moments happen.
It's one thing to pull through in a lucky moment, and another to have the game rig itself to make those moments happen.
post=141830
I'm a serious control freak when it comes to games, so hidden mechanics tend to piss me off. If it's part of the game's normal functionality, the least you can do is let the player know about it.
It's one thing to pull through in a lucky moment, and another to have the game rig itself to make those moments happen.
I guess you hate all games, then?
EDIT: Not to say I support LYING to the player, Craze.
post=141832
I guess you hate all games, then?
EDIT: Not to say I support LYING to the player, Craze.
I think you're overreacting a bit, Mog. =/
Why would we even BE HERE if we hated games...?
I honestly don't comprehend this argument. This is all stuff happening behind the scenes so that there is no way you'd ever notice this was happening unless you hacked the game. Not to mention Craze said he never cheats against the player, only in favor, so its not like he's screwing you behind your back.
Don't worry about numbers so much and just enjoy the game.
Don't worry about numbers so much and just enjoy the game.
post=141836post=141832I think you're overreacting a bit, Mog. =/
I guess you hate all games, then?
EDIT: Not to say I support LYING to the player, Craze.
Why would we even BE HERE if we hated games...?
No, you missed the point. Hali said he hates it when games have hidden mechanics. In my experience, that's pretty much in every game ever, from RPGs (hidden stats, hidden armor properties, hidden effects) to fighting games (frames of certain super moves that decrease your defense to nothing (which is why Akuma can be beaten in one hit in a certain frame when he's doing Kongou Kokuretsu Zan)), to adventure games.
Pretty much every game ever has hidden shit the player will never see unless he hacks the game. Which people do!
Tonfa
150
post=141838
Not to mention Craze never said he cheats against the player, only in favor, so its not like he's screwing you behind your back.
Don't worry about numbers so much and just enjoy the game.
If I play a RPG for the battle system (hello, Crazegames, would you like to be my highly convenient example today), the numbers to an extent are the game. This "cheating in favor" in fact does make me feel like I'm screwed out of the experience of overcoming the battles on my own.
E: Not to mention my other, more objective argument on page 1 that went completely ignored for some reason.
I didn't say I hate games with hidden mechanics. I said I hate hidden mechanics. I'm not going to let player_Bailout_Script stop me from playing a game I enjoy. I'd just rather succeed by, y'know, being GOOD at it. Don't put words in my mouth!
Pulling from my old D&D 3.5 experience, everybody enjoyed obstacles built around the capabilities of the party while hating that look on the DM of "oh fuck, uh.... let's change that natural twenty to something less deadly". My favorite D&D crew did most of the rolls in the open, even the DM. If the dice decided it was time for something bad to happen, it happened. If characters died, it was because the players were nine times out of ten doing something stupid. Model obstacles as something the players are capable of handling instead of making encounters tougher and fudging rolls so the players succeed.
Semi-related D&D Anecdote:
One night we were down our rogue (as in he couldn't show) in the middle of the dungeon which so far has had a lot of traps and things rogues are great at handling. The DM tossed the dungeon (we weren't very capable of handling it without the rogue) and put us in a new one for the night. It had almost no locks, traps, or secrets and a much higher amount of undead (which are immune to Rogue's main damage dealing attack: Sneak attacks) than what the party's used to fighting but all balanced to our three (+ a follower) man party.
The highlight came when an encounter of (gnoll? some trash enemy type) archers on the other side of a ravine showed up. The fighter found a rock which he pushed across the stone bridge as mobile cover, the bard's follower stuck with the fighter, and the wizard turned the Bard invisible so he could use a rope and cross the ravine using that without issue. Then the enemy's actions came and with the fighter+follower behind cover and the bard invisible, there was only one character who forgot to cover himself: The wizard. I'm pretty sure he died that turn thanks to being the only target and some unfavorable rolls. We laughed (so that's why the DM had that evil smirk all this time!), Wizard took direct control of the Bard's follower, finished the session. Blew 5k to revive the Wizard. No handouts, Wizard died due to party incompetence, the dungeon was modified to reflect the current party.
Of course it's much easier to do this in D&D than when designing+programming a game.
(it was also devoid of hidden mechanics)
People (well, people I know) hate handouts. If you're going to use them, hide them well! (I like the 'turn off handouts' difficulty modifier too)
Semi-related D&D Anecdote:
One night we were down our rogue (as in he couldn't show) in the middle of the dungeon which so far has had a lot of traps and things rogues are great at handling. The DM tossed the dungeon (we weren't very capable of handling it without the rogue) and put us in a new one for the night. It had almost no locks, traps, or secrets and a much higher amount of undead (which are immune to Rogue's main damage dealing attack: Sneak attacks) than what the party's used to fighting but all balanced to our three (+ a follower) man party.
The highlight came when an encounter of (gnoll? some trash enemy type) archers on the other side of a ravine showed up. The fighter found a rock which he pushed across the stone bridge as mobile cover, the bard's follower stuck with the fighter, and the wizard turned the Bard invisible so he could use a rope and cross the ravine using that without issue. Then the enemy's actions came and with the fighter+follower behind cover and the bard invisible, there was only one character who forgot to cover himself: The wizard. I'm pretty sure he died that turn thanks to being the only target and some unfavorable rolls. We laughed (so that's why the DM had that evil smirk all this time!), Wizard took direct control of the Bard's follower, finished the session. Blew 5k to revive the Wizard. No handouts, Wizard died due to party incompetence, the dungeon was modified to reflect the current party.
Of course it's much easier to do this in D&D than when designing+programming a game.
(it was also devoid of hidden mechanics)
People (well, people I know) hate handouts. If you're going to use them, hide them well! (I like the 'turn off handouts' difficulty modifier too)
post=141856
Just make it so there is a hard mode that disables these mechanics. Problem solved.
This is exactly what I did after tonfa's similar suggestion.
You know, I think saying "you might have a chance to cheat death at desperate HP" might be the best solution for this.
Maybe I should add a "if you're at full HP, enemies have a 50% chance to kill you in one hit" mechanic.
Tonfa
150
For the record Craze is cool for being honest about this!
If I had found it while mechanics diving in scripts I probably would have gone all WHAT THE FUCK HAVE YOU BEEN DOING CRAZE
If I had found it while mechanics diving in scripts I probably would have gone all WHAT THE FUCK HAVE YOU BEEN DOING CRAZE
