ISRIERI'S PROFILE

I already have some basic code to make fireballs shoot like they should traditionally, and there’s plenty of other cool NPCs and other nifty lua stuff coders have put up on the main smbx site.

Power ups are currently not one of those thing because they’re a lot of work. It’s totally possible to make them but they need to be coded in to the episode directly in order to make mario’s Sprite change correctly, and then ya gotta worry about the other characters (or don’t, and make it just Mario and Luigi). I dunno how to do that last thing but if someone figures it out it then it’s power up city.

If you guys want to start another game, do it! I can pitch in a stage or two.

I was a little concerned, because over on raocow's talkhaus someone had said "this is the most boring episode ever so strap in" but it seems they were referring it as boring to watch. They appear to like how chill and laid back it is as an episode, but his fans are pretty focused on La-Mulana 2 right now.

This is the last thing I ever expected to see so its pretty nifty. I've completely forgotten about this game so its a nice trip down memory lane.

author=Ratty524
Does anyone have any ideas?

Yes.

Take Fungal Forest. That first flower sucks. Its a koopa jump that I miss every single time because my instinct is to jump on him, and then miss the flower every time. Flowers like that suck when the game doesn't keep track of 'em.

Why not just have the koopa stationary underneath the flower? That would be an easy fix, but better yet, why not have it be hidden inside a brick structure that you need to toss a shell into to reveal, and depending on how you do it, maybe there's an easy way and a hard way to make your way down there.

Also Tall Tops Forest - that's the one with that first flower randomly hanging out in the air, right? There's already P-Switch shenanigans later on, why not make the P create some coin blocks you need to bonk your way up to get to a top platform? Or better yet, why not just stick a POW block in the pipe room just below it? You'd only have to carry the POW out and use it to get the second flower.

Little adjustments could go a long way. (admittedly there aren't a ton of P-Switch applications for getting these flowers since they also turn into bricks, which is dumb)

author=halibabica
I also think not every flower needs to be wow amazing, but having something special about one or two per stage could be reasonable and doable. Of course, that's case by case.

Then we're in agreement there! The big changes I was recommending before had mostly to do with 1-1 and and the first world. I'm only in the mood to change some of the flowers so they take a little more thought and player input. There's nothing wrong with levels and flowers where you just run straight into them and get them all effortlessly, but the ones that are way out of the way or a require a special trick that is too convoluted to execute take some of the fun out of it.

For instance there's that one in General Guy's Airforce at the end of Section 1. If you're quick, you can bounce off the turtle quickly and nab it, but that scrolling bit takes so long and is so dull that the prospect of dying there (and not being to go back after you go in the pipe) means most people will want to take their time. The ceiling's a bit low and the jump is easy to miss, nevermind the missiles that respawn and make the jump even more haphazard. Its clear that flower sucks, however I don't really know how you'd go improving it. If we weren't limited with layers I'd just tie it to a missile and you'd get the flower when you killed him.

I'm not trying to continually harp on this, Ratty brought it up so I thought I'd echo that the changes need not be severe. Every flower doesn't need a puzzle.

author=Animebryan
@Isrieri: You sound like you haven't gotten all the flowers on SMW2:YI. Because in that game getting all the flowers wasn't always fun. Some are ridiculously easy to get, some took a bit of effort to get & some were just downright difficult to get. This game isn't that much different.

This game could not be more different. Yoshi's Island was a completely different game form regular Mario, with different mechanics and goals. For one thing, you didn't only get two hits before you died. You had a timer that ticked down, and if you got mario back it would tick back up to at least 10. Thus, you basically had infinite hits. That affects gameplay a lot.

So, it would be to our benefit to put a lot of focus on these flowers if we're also going to put a lot of focus on collecting them.

author=Frogge

author=pyrodoom
how did you fit memes in a playtest with no commentary? .3.

Subtitles, dude.

WHAT

That's super un-intuitive. I guess that's just as good as annotations but still...
Isn't there a way to turn those on automatically when the video starts?

author=halibabica

from pyrodoom
I should feel rewarded for getting a bunch of Flowers. That's why I'm so annoyed - the levels are fine, I just don't know how I feel about the Flower situation

I don't know how I can make this more rewarding for you. The power-ups you earn have generously low costs and new bonus stages come along regularly as well. I can understand not being a multiple-playthroughs person, but that's the kinda game this is. Going into a new level and expecting to walk out at the end with all five flowers on your first try is unrealistic. It can be done, yes, but without having seen the level start to finish, you wouldn't know what's waiting and might have an accidental death or something that causes you to have to do it all again anyway.

I don't think pyrodoom's using the right words here. I kind of understand where he's coming from, but my complaints with the flowers have to do firstly with how they're arranged in individual stages, and with how ephemeral it is to collect them in general. The act of getting them all in a level provides you with very minimal feedback, positive or negative. The 1UP jingle might as well be background noise for how useless lives are in SMBX. Getting them is not their own reward if that makes sense: You did a fantastic job of providing rewards and incentives for getting the flowers (bonus levels being the biggest) but its the actual getting of the flowers where we have a problem.

For instance, did you ever play Donkey Kong Country? The K.O.N.G letters in each stage had a note play, rising in pitch for each letter, and once you got them all it played them together in a little arpeggio. Something simple like that would work wonders here (aside from just keeping track of the flowers per stage which would be the obvious fix). I don't think its possible to do that since most of our SMBX sound effects are probably all used up and because the flowers are all on the Default layer, so event scripting is out of the question. But, that's the kind of feeling that's missing here. The flowers don't feel good to collect. It lacks that physicality when you get one, or get them all.

I would say that in order to improve this all we have to do is just re-think some of the flowers in most of the stages. I've already talked about the first level, but a lot of them in the first world could make collecting them better by giving players things to do in the stage to get them, rather than hiding them or putting them out of reach. The flowers should be an event.

Now, that DOES NOT mean they need to all be big elaborate puzzles. Autumn Lake has a really great flower - its out of reach on a platform and there's a spring down the road. You have to bring the spring over and bounce on it, but while minding the Spear Guy who guards it, so you have to time the jump a little. That is the Ideal Flower. It has a very simple solution and isn't a huge hassle to go after, breaking the level pacing and holding everything up, but it requires that players concentrate a little bit and not just run through the stage either. Like take Deathtrap Industries - I thought the first flower there was a good example of that. All you need is a tail, you get one at the level start, and you just have to keep the tail through the first part of the stage. The last flower is also a good one beacause its clearly a big risk to get, but its also right there and if you have a flower its cake. A lot of the lesser flowers are hidden away in corners of the level and have convoluted ways of getting them. The goal should be making it fun to get the flowers and relatively simple to do so. To that end, even just throwing one or two on the main path as freebies would help.

The design of the levels (for the most part) is good enough. All that testing and revision did good on the majority. From what I can see, the final step is just fine-tuning the flowers. That's what I'm aim to focus my comments on as I go through the levels one more time. A lot of them don't need to be moved from their positions and could just use a more creative puzzle or player-based interaction to get them.