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POLITICS
Posts
demondestiny
889
demondestiny
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CloseActually, my parents told me that raising a family and getting a bonus off the government was the only good thing they did. lol.
maoville
0
To me, politics is a boring topic and doesn't interest me as long as it doesn't affect me in any way.
I know, i must sound terrible. ;D
I know, i must sound terrible. ;D
Mewd
1501
It takes a strong, noble human being to participate in an idealist political system.
Unfortunately, humans are much more prone to being selfish, petty, manipulative, deceitful, lazy, greedy and antipathetic. Simply because those are much easier ways to get ahead in life.
Until such an unlikely day that humanity has advanced enough that we would all be selfless, there's a need for politics to anticipate the worst in humanity. I gladly dream of such a day myself, but humanity has a daunting journey ahead of itself to mature.
Of course, a little strife is still good. Spice of life.
Unfortunately, humans are much more prone to being selfish, petty, manipulative, deceitful, lazy, greedy and antipathetic. Simply because those are much easier ways to get ahead in life.
Until such an unlikely day that humanity has advanced enough that we would all be selfless, there's a need for politics to anticipate the worst in humanity. I gladly dream of such a day myself, but humanity has a daunting journey ahead of itself to mature.
Of course, a little strife is still good. Spice of life.
maoville
0
A very strong and bold statement there. Most of the stuff you've said there i believe in too. One day that dream might come true. ;)
author=WIP link=topic=368.msg4761#msg4761 date=1194242452
The problem with anarchy is that it cannot and never will work. The perfect political system would be some flavor of socialism, but then you enter the real problem with politics: people. People are dumb, manipulative, deceitful, and will do whatever they can to save themselves.
bingo! people ruin everything :D
Anarchy is a farce. The strong will always rule over the weak. That is how the world works.
now only if this were Star Trek....
demondestiny
889
author=ankylo link=topic=368.msg4768#msg4768 date=1194262998author=WIP link=topic=368.msg4761#msg4761 date=1194242452
The problem with anarchy is that it cannot and never will work. The perfect political system would be some flavor of socialism, but then you enter the real problem with politics: people. People are dumb, manipulative, deceitful, and will do whatever they can to save themselves.
bingo! people ruin everything :D
Anarchy is a farce. The strong will always rule over the weak. That is how the world works.
now only if this were Star Trek....
I respect you Ankylo. ;D
Euphorian
80
author=rcholbert link=topic=368.msg4755#msg4755 date=1194240442
You're aware that in anarchy the only thing there would be is survival of the fittest? Everything you're begging for can only be protected by a rational government. Without one, there is no one stopping the neighborhood bully from kicking your ass and shutting up the expressions you hold so dear.
The problem with anarchy is that it cannot and never will work. The perfect political system would be some flavor of socialism, but then you enter the real problem with politics: people. People are dumb, manipulative, deceitful, and will do whatever they can to save themselves. That's why anarchy won't work and is just a fart in the wind for those who understand how people work.I know, and I completely agree, it'll never work.
Which is why I openly called myself a fool.
There are certain people among us that probably could live that way peacefully, but kids brought up in that world, would likely not, so the biggest it could be is some informal grouping of communes..
By the way, anyone here ever seen the movie "The Ballad of Jack and Rose?" (it is relevant, but if no one's seen it, forget it)
Melch
0
author=Mewd link=topic=368.msg4766#msg4766 date=1194255106
It takes a strong, noble human being to participate in an idealist political system.
Unfortunately, humans are much more prone to being selfish, petty, manipulative, deceitful, lazy, greedy and antipathetic. Simply because those are much easier ways to get ahead in life.
Until such an unlikely day that humanity has advanced enough that we would all be selfless, there's a need for politics to anticipate the worst in humanity. I gladly dream of such a day myself, but humanity has a daunting journey ahead of itself to mature.
Of course, a little strife is still good. Spice of life.
I don't foresee this "dream" coming true for a long time. And I don't mean we have a ways to go to realize our way out of trouble, but that we are working at this point in time to actually increase these aspects within our communities. We are creating ways to help us be more manipulative, lazy, greedy, etc.
We are working on being a more efficient civilization, but what does that lead to? Efficiency gives us more product in less time. Greed? Less time means less work. Laziness? Robots to do the work, but then mad that all the jobs are being done by robots. Petty? If that "dream" is to ever come true, it will get a lot worse before it ever gets better.
Someone mentioned Star Trek. Well, in Star Trek they have no monetary system. The only way I see that we will no longer have a need for money is if we have everything done for us, and given to us. IE, robots do all the farming, processing, building, etc, leaving us to do nothing but reap the rewards of our hard earned laziness. To get there, robots and computers will have to slowly take over all of our jobs, but there will be a tough spot where we are still using money, but robots are taking over half our jobs, meaning only a select few would actually still be "making" money, while the rest live in "slums" supported by robots. Even at that point, there will obviously be social status' that dictate how things are run, and that will be controlled by those with money, who will not want to give up their social status so easily.
We have a long way to go before we reach that "perfect" society.
And, btw, I'm a realist.
Mewd
1501
I also speculate that humanity might not be able to ever achieve a perfect society because we may very well NEED strife.
One thing that is oddly beautiful about life is that the things that trouble us have a tendency to temper us and make us stronger. The mistakes we make and the dead ends we run into have the potential to be a blessing. The more we learn from our mistakes the faster we grow as individuals.
Any ideal that is not challenged in some way runs the risk of eventually falling into decadence.
The world is still full of suffering, though I imagine that there will always be a need for some, it would be wonderful if we could mature enough as a race to minimize it. Only time would tell if we can manage.
I salute those who sincerely live after their ideals, though. The world needs such people for it to mature at all. The human race is a long, long way from Utopia. But then, as is often the case, the journey is its own reward too.
One thing that is oddly beautiful about life is that the things that trouble us have a tendency to temper us and make us stronger. The mistakes we make and the dead ends we run into have the potential to be a blessing. The more we learn from our mistakes the faster we grow as individuals.
Any ideal that is not challenged in some way runs the risk of eventually falling into decadence.
The world is still full of suffering, though I imagine that there will always be a need for some, it would be wonderful if we could mature enough as a race to minimize it. Only time would tell if we can manage.
I salute those who sincerely live after their ideals, though. The world needs such people for it to mature at all. The human race is a long, long way from Utopia. But then, as is often the case, the journey is its own reward too.
yamata no orochi
184
People work in hierarchies. It's how life is, and I doubt anything will change that. I mean, take a step back and reread this topic--you're arguing with each other, trying to prove who's better and who isn't, and you're all doing it subconsciously.
Therefore, any government that isn't organized in hierarchies probably wouldn't work in the long run. Therefore anarchy doesn't work, as well as, say, communism. It's an interesting idea, but hampered by the fact that anyone within the system who has enough power and is clever enough to hide what he's doing can easily subjugate the system with ease. Then again, I'm sort of naive about politics and government and all of that, so everything I just said could be completely bogus.
kentona: ouch.
Therefore, any government that isn't organized in hierarchies probably wouldn't work in the long run. Therefore anarchy doesn't work, as well as, say, communism. It's an interesting idea, but hampered by the fact that anyone within the system who has enough power and is clever enough to hide what he's doing can easily subjugate the system with ease. Then again, I'm sort of naive about politics and government and all of that, so everything I just said could be completely bogus.
kentona: ouch.
Maladroit: To be fair, I support abortions in the cases of rape or when the pregnancy threatens the life of the mother. By life I do not mean social life, however. Also, unlike many others who are also against abortion, you would be very hard pressed to classify me as a religious nutjob. This has nothing to do with God, for me.
yamato no orochi: Never heard of Oedipus?
yamato no orochi: Never heard of Oedipus?
demondestiny
889
author=yamata no orochi link=topic=368.msg4798#msg4798 date=1194398588
People work in hierarchies. It's how life is, and I doubt anything will change that. I mean, take a step back and reread this topic--you're arguing with each other, trying to prove who's better and who isn't, and you're all doing it subconsciously.
Therefore, any government that isn't organized in hierarchies probably wouldn't work in the long run. Therefore anarchy doesn't work, as well as, say, communism. It's an interesting idea, but hampered by the fact that anyone within the system who has enough power and is clever enough to hide what he's doing can easily subjugate the system with ease. Then again, I'm sort of naive about politics and government and all of that, so everything I just said could be completely bogus.
kentona: ouch.
I agree. There really isn't a wrong answer in the world of politics. Everyone has there own views and will stick to them.
maoville
0
author=rcholbert link=topic=368.msg4799#msg4799 date=1194399501
yamato no orochi: Never heard of Oedipus?
Wasn't Oedipus a Greek King or something. I know that he was in Thebes and he became king after he killed his father. That's about all i know.
yamata no orochi
184
author=maoville link=topic=368.msg4810#msg4810 date=1194418329
Wasn't Oedipus a Greek King or something. I know that he was in Thebes and he became king after he killed his father. That's about all i know.
The version of the story I know is that Oedipus was sent away from home by his father at birth, after his father heard a prophecy stating that his son would kill him and marry his wife. Some time later, Oedipus runs into a fellow traveler while roaming Greece. They get into a fight, and Oedipus kills the man, only to discover that he was his father. By killing his father, Oedipus takes on all of his father's estate...including his wife, Oedipus's mother.
Strangely enough, Oedipus is also the guy who defeats the Sphinx, which is another story in its own right.
