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GIVING FEEDBACK: PASS OR FAIL
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Closeauthor=ShortStar
Making a checklist for everyone.
- Don't use RTP.
- Don't use default font (remember to make it readable)
- Use music on the title screen.
- Don't have a long introduction. A minute is too long in my opinion.
- Include shinny things when there is something to get somewhere. Hidden items.
- Tint screen WORKS BEST with the fade out... then tint... then fade in.
- Don't use default battle system.
- Random encounters are bad (and the backbone of RPGs).
- Too many villages defeat the purpose of an RPG.
u forgot 3-tile rule
~rpg maker guru
Zephyr
1241
author=CreationThanks for the effort and really nice to see the game passed. That shows that the taste is somewhat subjective.
Metal Gear Solid by Zephyr
Concerning the mapping, I think I placed details in fair amount considering it's a somewhat bare mountain range.
And about the locked door, one of the rats has the key. I guess that was made somewhat unclear...
And as you pointed out, the biggest issue might be the stealth gameplay. I did try different variations and this was the best approach in my sense.
And yeah, that bush was thorny, so you take damage(if just 1 HP).
author=NecrileThe intro points out that it's after Big Shell(MGS2) and Otacon is around so it shouldn't take much to figure it's Solid Snake. There's also the game page to point this out. Not to ruin anything, but the game is sorta tied into the plot in some way or another. It's just that it needs more than 15 minutes to tell that...
Zephyr, that looks really good! The only thing I can say after watching that video is that I'm a bit dissapointed you didn't bother to use existing corporations, or tie it in the timeline of metal gear solid. Is this supposed to be before big boss makes outer haven? Is the protagonist solid snake or big boss? Maybe I'm being to picky because I'm a fanboy, but shit like that irks me. Also once again Creation, a job well done.
author=Creation
@Max: Feel free to give your opinion although I reserve the right to disagree with you. If that's something you can handle, shoot away.
I'll be doing Zephyr's game next.
Well, let's see...besides the reasons other people have brought up, I don't think this kind of feedback encourages good games. I think it encourages good intros (note by intro I do not mean cutscene). This is an important distinction. Besides that, people, whether their first fifteen minutes are good or bad, need feedback on the parts of the game past that.
Basically, what you are doing is what most people are doing anyway, and it is already problematic. If people are making an effort to handle feedback in any special way, it should be focusing on everything PAST the first fifteen minutes.
LockeZ
I'd really like to get rid of LockeZ. His play style is way too unpredictable. He's always like this too. If he ran a country, he'd just kill and imprison people at random until crime stopped.
5958
My problem isn't simply that this kind of feedback isn't as useful as feedback about the whole game. I don't just think it's less useful, I actually think it's potentially harmful. I really think that this kind of thread encourages people to spend their effort on the superficial parts of their games.
Designers don't have an unlimited amount of time and energy to spend on their games. Let's try to give feedback in a way that encourages designers to spend their time and energy on the important parts. I don't want games that hook me and then drop the ball. Way too many RPG Maker games do that already.
What about other people, am I alone here in my experience with RM games? Do other people feel like games that have strong hooks and exciting superficial features but no depth and awful gameplay are way too common?
Designers don't have an unlimited amount of time and energy to spend on their games. Let's try to give feedback in a way that encourages designers to spend their time and energy on the important parts. I don't want games that hook me and then drop the ball. Way too many RPG Maker games do that already.
What about other people, am I alone here in my experience with RM games? Do other people feel like games that have strong hooks and exciting superficial features but no depth and awful gameplay are way too common?
To those negative nellys I just have to say, that this type of feedback was really helpful to me, even for it being so short.
It's REALLY nice to see your game as someone else is playing and vocalizing every thought.
I actually think this setup is better, because when someone does a Let's Try/Play and they dislike it from the beginning they are bound to quit trying, or just resent playing through the rest.
Ya'll need to realize this is just a different way of going about it.
Instead of playing hours on end to see every great aspect of the game, you play a small amount of time and see if this interests you or not.
All the while still receiving some sort of feedback.
And I'll say it again, I took away some helpful pointers from this.
Because this is the first time I've seen someone else play my game, every thing was fresh and new to him, and I got to hear his honest opinion on things.
More variety in enemies, cheesy dialogue, cutting short a unnecessary long walk, etc.
This is helpful. When I've gotten feedback in comments or however, you don't hear some of the little things.
You get a, "Great game man!" or "I liked it, but it needs alot of work" while these are still valid, it's awesome to hear it straight from the horses mouth so to speak.
The whole point of this is to NOT give feedback on anything past the intro.
We have the Let's trys and whatnot for that, and reviewers to go indepth on the game as a whole.
I think this is a unique way, and if ya'll don't like it, maybe you should consider your own video sessions.
I'm not trying to argue with anyone here, just stating I found it helpful. :]
It's REALLY nice to see your game as someone else is playing and vocalizing every thought.
I actually think this setup is better, because when someone does a Let's Try/Play and they dislike it from the beginning they are bound to quit trying, or just resent playing through the rest.
Ya'll need to realize this is just a different way of going about it.
Instead of playing hours on end to see every great aspect of the game, you play a small amount of time and see if this interests you or not.
All the while still receiving some sort of feedback.
And I'll say it again, I took away some helpful pointers from this.
Because this is the first time I've seen someone else play my game, every thing was fresh and new to him, and I got to hear his honest opinion on things.
More variety in enemies, cheesy dialogue, cutting short a unnecessary long walk, etc.
This is helpful. When I've gotten feedback in comments or however, you don't hear some of the little things.
You get a, "Great game man!" or "I liked it, but it needs alot of work" while these are still valid, it's awesome to hear it straight from the horses mouth so to speak.
The whole point of this is to NOT give feedback on anything past the intro.
We have the Let's trys and whatnot for that, and reviewers to go indepth on the game as a whole.
I think this is a unique way, and if ya'll don't like it, maybe you should consider your own video sessions.
I'm not trying to argue with anyone here, just stating I found it helpful. :]
eplipswich
2728
The thing I might want to add is that, Creation's way of giving feedback is all about first impression only. He's not making these videos to give feedback on the whole game, but rather just the "first impression" alone. So it is a totally different aspect of feedback. To those who are comparing Creation's videos to other Let's Try videos, please don't, because they are not the same.
author=LockeZ
My problem isn't simply that this kind of feedback isn't as useful as feedback about the whole game. I don't just think it's less useful, I actually think it's potentially harmful. I really think that this kind of thread encourages people to spend their effort on the superficial parts of their games.
I believe no kind of feedback can be bad not even when it comes with a pinch of rudeness, and it's because there is so little of it going around... It would be like turning down dirty water on a desert. (not that I think that's the case here). Now, if some "developers" feel encouraged to spend their effort on the superficial parts of their games like you say then it's their own fault and their own damn fault only, not the person taking as little or as much as fifteen minutes of its time trying to help them.
LockeZ
I'd really like to get rid of LockeZ. His play style is way too unpredictable. He's always like this too. If he ran a country, he'd just kill and imprison people at random until crime stopped.
5958
@alterego:
Yeah, that's probably fair. After thinking about it, I do not really want to stop a flow of accurate feedback of any type. I just don't like it being limited to this type.
I will probably start my own video feedback thread with more of an emphasis on the types of development issues that I think are important.
Yeah, that's probably fair. After thinking about it, I do not really want to stop a flow of accurate feedback of any type. I just don't like it being limited to this type.
I will probably start my own video feedback thread with more of an emphasis on the types of development issues that I think are important.
I will probably start my own video feedback thread with more of an emphasis on the types of development issues that I think are important.
By all means, do. I don't own the idea, go ahead and do your thing. The more feedback available the better. I'll be forward to watching your videos and see how much time you spend testing out each game (hours? how long are you planning?). I honestly have a lot of respect for your determination to test each game in depth. You'd be the only one who's doing it besides Craze and YDS (as far as I know).
I'll wait until someone else submits their game and I'll continue as long as people request me to do it as I enjoy it and it's a great way to play games I wouldn't have otherwise. I'm getting PM asking me to continue as well and if it helps people then that's even better.
My problem isn't simply that this kind of feedback isn't as useful as feedback about the whole game. I don't just think it's less useful, I actually think it's potentially harmful. I really think that this kind of thread encourages people to spend their effort on the superficial parts of their games.
I see why you might think that but I see things differently. I don't think that doing a good beginning for a game equals superficial parts.
I'm also thinking of giving games that passed another 15 mintues to see if they manage to keep my interest longer. that would be a step further into giving feedback.
Interesting method of feedback. While it certainly isn't the most thorough kind, it does give the player's immediate impression of the game, and the first fifteen minutes could well make or break the deal (depending on how far down the instant gratification scale you are).
I rather doubt PH4 would withstand this test well. Super Porygon 3D, on the other hand...care to take a crack at it, Creation?
I rather doubt PH4 would withstand this test well. Super Porygon 3D, on the other hand...care to take a crack at it, Creation?
Necrile
50
Interesting looking game..the idea sort of reminds me megaman battle network, but the gameplay reminds me of the original zelda in a way. Good job though, definately not same old same old. (although since you used pokemon sprites it might've been better to tie it into the pokemon universe more.
Yay, I'm glad you enjoyed it! Though I'm painfully reminded that the old version is still up. Others have had difficulty knowing there are doors on the left and right before; I've since added arrows to indicate their existence. I also dropped the intro entirely because I felt it didn't really add anything.
Just a note, though, it seems your computer has some strange sound issues. RM habitually alters the music in games from time to time, but yours had broken tracks almost the whole time. Just thought I'd mention it.
Thanks for trying it!
Just a note, though, it seems your computer has some strange sound issues. RM habitually alters the music in games from time to time, but yours had broken tracks almost the whole time. Just thought I'd mention it.
Thanks for trying it!
eplipswich
2728
author=Liberty
The music is because of your computer - I'm also not a fan of silence, so you might need to check your speakers or something. Definitely.
author=ShortStar
Strange though the soft music and no title screen music. I think it could be your computer.
author=InfectionFiles
Hey, I noticed that the sound effects is working for the games, but not the music.
Now, I can't tell you exactly what the problem is, but I know it's something silly.
You can fix this by for example, going into the Music folder of the game and playing one of the music files there in a media player.
This happens to me every now and then and I have a "battlend2" file from the 2k/3 RTP at the ready, and when I play it, it fixes the silent game music.
Like I said, I have NO IDEA what does this or how to explain it, just a fix for it.
It seems like it happens when I'm listening to music on a media player, it shuts off the RM game music.
This might not help, but it's always worth a try!
author=halibabica
Just a note, though, it seems your computer has some strange sound issues. RM habitually alters the music in games from time to time, but yours had broken tracks almost the whole time. Just thought I'd mention it.
Yeah, Creation, I too think there's something wrong with your computer in regards to sounds, particularly the music. You ought to fix this issue, 'cause music does play an important role in first impressions too.
Well I think so too but I have no idea as to what the problem is, especially the problem halibabica mentioned.
Update on the concept
I will be playing the games that passed for another 10-15 minutes and see if I still want to continue further. Everything is new 10 minutes into the game but will it keep being interesting as I play longer? I was under the impression that Infection might get repetitive if it only involves killing zombies and some puzzles in Metal Gear seemed a bit far fetched (the rat holding the key).
To put simply, games that pass round 1 will get a second round. It would assume that passing round 2 would be more difficult for certain games. Other games like Porygon might have an easier time since you can expand on the base principles fairly easily I think.
Update on the concept
I will be playing the games that passed for another 10-15 minutes and see if I still want to continue further. Everything is new 10 minutes into the game but will it keep being interesting as I play longer? I was under the impression that Infection might get repetitive if it only involves killing zombies and some puzzles in Metal Gear seemed a bit far fetched (the rat holding the key).
To put simply, games that pass round 1 will get a second round. It would assume that passing round 2 would be more difficult for certain games. Other games like Porygon might have an easier time since you can expand on the base principles fairly easily I think.
Alright, sounds good to me!
If you want to do the other games first, I'm going to compile all RTP and needed files into the rightful folders, so hopefully the crashing will stop.
So, I'll get to that when I can and give you the updated version! :]
If you want to do the other games first, I'm going to compile all RTP and needed files into the rightful folders, so hopefully the crashing will stop.
So, I'll get to that when I can and give you the updated version! :]
Zephyr
1241
author=Creation
Well I think so too but I have no idea as to what the problem is, especially the problem halibabica mentioned.
Update on the concept
I will be playing the games that passed for another 10-15 minutes and see if I still want to continue further. Everything is new 10 minutes into the game but will it keep being interesting as I play longer? I was under the impression that Infection might get repetitive if it only involves killing zombies and some puzzles in Metal Gear seemed a bit far fetched (the rat holding the key).
To put simply, games that pass round 1 will get a second round. It would assume that passing round 2 would be more difficult for certain games. Other games like Porygon might have an easier time since you can expand on the base principles fairly easily I think.
Will you be recording the second round as well? It'll be interesting to see how far the game keeps interest up.
I can agree on that the "rat holds the key"-thing is a bit silly. It's actually a reference to MGS(and Zelda too I guess), but still silly. Later enemies with keys even give of a sort of hint, so i should probably add that to the rats as well...
