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Badasses for Hire
Solitayre- 07/15/2010 08:32 PM
- 25601 views
I love Tactics RPGs. One of my favorite games of all time is Final Fantasy Tactics, which I suspect this game drew some inspiration from. There is a difference though. To Arms is not a tactics RPG. One such reason is it is a traditional RPG, with a large party and an elaborate class system, but traditional nonetheless. The elements that make for a true tactical RPG, moving units, terrain, range, position, and other factors that make tactics RPGs different form other games are not present here.
Another reason is “Tactics” play little role in this game compared to luck. Allow me to explain.
To Arms finds you in the role of Janos Blackthorne, the honorable if somewhat ill-tempered captain of the guards to Duke Mandon Lychester of Rydony. Together with his brother Horace, the court mage, Janos is sent to dispatch an incursion of goblins who threaten the Duchy’s borders. However, they are unaware that while they are away, a sinister political plot is about to unfold. Chapter one of To Arms recounts the tale of how the Blackthrone Brothers fell from grace and became the leaders of Blackthorne Company, a group of mercenaries, in hopes of one day using their military might to restore their honor.
Balance 2/5
This game has an interesting approach to combat, but it is held back by some severe balancing problems.
You start the game with the Blackthorne brothers and three generic recruits (for some reason your badass captain and court wizard are the same level as three random squires, but whatever.) You are given a chance to outfit yourself before your mission, buying items and equipment to properly arm yourself. You can be somewhat creative with your equipment options, but for the first few battles there isn’t much to do but attack. Eventually your team is joined by a paladin and his squire, and the option to change classes opens up. Each class has its own equipment options and a tree of skills available to them, which can be purchased with job points earned in battle much like experience. Deciding to branch out and cover a range of classes, I picked a pikeman, a knight, an archer, and a war priest. My team was now varied with a variety of offense and defense while maintaining a safe level of available healing. We were ready to kick some goblin ass.
As mentioned, you command your entire army in battle at once. For most of the game, this is seven men, and you’re often up against similar numbers of enemies. This means combat can get very intense very quickly, but it can be fun to watch your entire team attack in a sequence, or for Janos to give orders (party buffs) and watch your entire team power-up. But this also leads to a lot of problems. Namely, it is very hard to keep track of exactly what is going on in combat. Enemies hit hard. Many hit more than once. As mentioned, there are often many enemies. If the enemy party gangs up on one or two characters they can be demolished quickly. You’ll often find yourself just taking scores and scores of hits with very little you can do about it. A few classes have status moves such as stun that can hamper enemies, but for the most part there are few ways to really control damage. Another problem is skills have a fairly high cost and it was hard to learn more than one skill per character over the course of demo, especially for the generics. My knight character learned a move that supposedly increased his threat, but it was hard to tell if this was actually doing anything. Enemies also have a lot of HP so even having your entire team gang up on a target doesn’t mean it is going to die. Notably though, there is almost no way to control individual turn order. One of the most critical elements of a tactics game, being able to react to threats or actions in real time by deciding what to do, is lost in the massive jumble of turns. This could be mitigated somewhat by assigning priority to some moves. Healing, for example, should probably have a very high priority. When you’re going to take upwards of fifteen attacks in the next round, you need to be able to heal immediately.
Overall, however, enemies suffer simply from poor balancing. One sequence had the Blackthorne Brothers fighting on their own against squads of enemies. Without allies for support, Horace, my battle mage, was quickly cut down by enemies that were clearly balanced to fight against my seven man army. A single critical hit could bring him down and there was nothing to be done about any of this, and there’s no way to grind in this game to get stronger. All you can do is buy piles of healing items and hope the RNG favors you. The abject unfairness and reliance on luck of this sequence wreaked havoc on this section's score.
But this isn’t the worst part. The worst part is the outrageously high dodge rate of enemies. Late in the demo, enemies dodged far more than any game I have ever seen. Not just some enemies either, but most of them. It was not uncommon for my seven man band to attack and for five of them to miss. You might remember I had a similar complaint in Blood Machine, but this is even worse! I was not missing because my men were blind, and I don’t feel like I was using the wrong types of attacks on them because they readily dodged magic spells as well as physical skills and regular attacks. And I felt like I had a pretty well-balanced party set-up so I don’t feel like my choice in character classes would account for a 70% miss rate. Basically, all I could do was issue orders and pray. There was nothing else I could do! I was completely at the mercy of the dice gods. This isn’t challenge. This isn’t difficulty. This isn’t balanced. This isn’t fair.
The evasion rates of enemies need to be seriously curtailed. It just isn’t fun to start losing a battle because your men can’t land a hit for the life of them. Meanwhile, my enemies rarely had such issues on their own and landed scores of hits on my hapless soldiers. There was only one way to settle this. Janos had access to a party buff that dramatically raised everyone’s agility. By unleashing this power, I was presented with the bizarre scenario in which neither side was able to land a hit. This went on for a while before sheer willpower, brute force, and loads of healing items finally tilted things in my favor. But this did not leave a feeling of elation at my victory. It simply felt sour. The player should feel in control of his or her destiny, not have to rely on sheer luck. I never felt in control. Many rounds went by where all I could do was watch as all my attacks missed while my men got spanked because of some fluke of the dice. Missing an attack is like losing a turn. If I miss there should be a reason, like I was blind or the enemy was flying or was under the influence of an evasion buff. I shouldn't be missing en masse for no reason.
The game tries to play this off as “high difficulty,” and suggests you save often in case you get stuck. (I never got stuck, for the record.) But in reality, this is classic fake difficulty. Your party can get savagely cut up for several rounds for things you have no control over. The game’s “Tips’ section even has the nerve to suggest that it is the player’s job to keep multiple saves and be willing to completely tailor my party to the upcoming battles in order to win certain fights, but as a player, this response doesn’t satisfy me. Don’t expect the player do extra work because you can’t balance your game, and don’t tell the player they’re playing it wrong if the army they built is statistically incapable of winning a battle. How about letting me make the party I want? As a general rule for any game with class systems or customizable parties, you should always be able to win with the party you have, and shouldn’t ever need to have psychically deduced exactly what equipment or skills you would need to win the up-coming battles. Setting up characters to specifically exploit enemy weaknesses should be helpful, but never necessary. Especially since you generally have only a vague idea of what enemies are capable of so, you really can’t prepare before a mission, and once you’re in the heat of battle, there’s no turning back. What I think I would suggest is, where applicable, have some character give some idea what enemies on your next mission are likely to fight like. Are goblins high strength brutes? Would bringing extra heavy armor classes help? Or are they all fast as hell and I need fast people who can actually hit them? Are they vulnerable to magic? Invulnerable? These are things to think about that might actually incorporate some level of strategy and planning into the game. I wouldn’t suggest ever making it necessary to completely rearrange your party, but if you know what’s coming you can make small adjustments. Unless I have made a hopelessly oblivious team formation of all unarmed healers, the answer to a broken, unbalanced battle isn’t to tell the player “you did it wrong.”
Unless you’re a Rogue-like.
All in all I feel like this system has merit, it is just held back by bad balance/design decisions. I do have concerns about the number of characters, however. I felt like keeping track of 7 characters during battle was challenging enough, but throwing 15 into a turn-based encounter system just sounds like trouble. I would suggest limiting the number to a more manageable 8 or so.
Level Design 2.5/5:
This game does not use traditional town/dungeon mechanics. In town you simply visit shops to buy equipment, and then its off on your mission. Once you begin a mission, there is no way out save victory, so make sure to prepare.
Dungeons (using the term loosely) forego exploration for the most part, instead focusing entirely on the encounters. Each battle is unique and occurs in a specific sequence, and generally you’ll need to clear out all the enemies to accomplish your goals. Occasionally, you’ll be given the choice of what order to defeat certain groups of enemy in, or occasionally seek out some optional side area with some extra items, but for the most part it’s fairly linear.
One thing that bothered me was a lack of items to be found, even in areas where there logically would be or are specifically stated to be (a storeroom in an enemy fort offered nothing in the way to be looted, for instance.) The entire first mission went by without a single treasure chest to be seen, which gives little incentive to go exploring. Moreover, the player has no idea going into this situation how much is an appropriate number of items to bring. I bought ten healing salves, what seemed like a reasonable number to me, but I went through these quite quickly and the only way to get more was to hope enemies dropped them. I would suggest making some healing items available to be found in areas so that the player is less easily screwed if they have a hard time with a battle. This is really early in the game after all, this is the time to wean the player into the game and give them a chance to experiment and learn from mistakes, not punish them right out of the gate for failing to make perfect choices. You have the entire rest of the game to make brutal.
Another problem I had was once you’re on a mission, it’s live or die time. There’s no way to retreat from a mission if you find yourself in a bad situation. Not only is this annoying for the player but it’s not tactically sound from the characters’ perspective either. No sane commander is going to charge into a situation he’s totally unprepared for. I would suggest either giving an option to retreat, which either obliges the player to restart the entire mission and reset all the encounters, or perhaps in some cases force the player to eat the failure and forfeit any payment they might have acquired. This isn’t going to be applicable to every single mission but it is something to think about, and is almost certainly preferable to locking the player into an unwinnable situation.
Finally, the uniquely scripted nature of every single encounter give this game a fairly rare opportunity. I was somewhat disappointed to find that my soldiers simply walked into every single combat situation with no thought to tactics. In the future, I would give a forward thinking player some options in situations like this. Set traps, lay ambushes, anything to let the player gain an upper hand in combat. It’s more rewarding to just completely crush an enemy force because you were more clever than them then trade blows with them for twenty turns. If you want this to be a tactics game, let the player apply tactics.
Characters 3/5
Most of the characterization in this demo revolves around the Blackthorne Brothers. The most immediate and obvious characteristic of your protagonist, Janos, is that he is not the typical implausibly talented twenty year old white-haired pretty boy. He is a grizzled veteran who appears to be at least in his forties, a real soldier with years of real experience behind him. He serves as both a sympathetic and effective protagonist, a knight in service of his liege lord, bond by oaths of honor and friendship. His brother, Horace, provides badly needed comic relief; an element often missing from Max’s other games. I liked both of these characters a lot. They had a lot of chemistry and acted like, well, brothers. One thing I thought was odd, though, was that your badass captain of the guard starts at the same level as his recruits. I see no reason why he and the other “main” characters couldn’t start off with a higher experience level and a small pool of job points to spend to reflect their experience over their band of squires. This probably wouldn’t even disrupt the balance horribly, since having one or two higher level characters isn’t going to be a deal breaker in these types of combat situations; if anything it evens the score when you face enemy leaders who are themselves demigods compared to their men.
Most of the other characters received only scant attention. Though the demo contains a handful of minor villains, most aren’t given the chance to do anything but stand around and act fiendish. Lady Bethany, the only important female character to appear, is portrayed in a manner that borders on misogynistic. I can forgive some of this as being one of the realities of the setting, but I couldn’t help but think this would come off better if the writing were more subtle about it.
The dialogue is really quite decent and makes at least a good faith effort to adapt to the setting, a sort of pseudo-old English style that manages to stay understandable but at least give the world some depth. The writing is occasionally marred by Max’s patented “plethora of obscenities” that often not only sound forced and completely out of character for the people saying them, but are out of character for the game’s universe. Did you really need to break your campaign setting’s own rules to let yourself use the f-word? Consider excising these and finding more colorful in-period euphemisms. I assure you they’re out there and some of them are quite fun. They’ll sound better and more natural. This use of profanity does not make things darker and it does not make the characters seem more mature. It makes them seem like grade school students trying desperately to be outrageous.
Story 3/5
The game appears to be set in a fairly expansive fantasy world of political intrigue. It clearly borrows a great deal from Final Fantasy Tactics in regard to its systems and perhaps its world as well, but the mood and tone of the series seems to be inspired more by George R. R. Martin’s A Song of Ice and Fire series. If you liked either of these, there might be something here for you.
The main plot of the game appears to be centered on the Blackthorne Brothers and the missions they undertake, but behind the scenes is a web of deception and betrayal amongst the nobility and their power schemes, though this demo offers but a taste. It is hard to say at this point exactly how developed the world is, though the provincial system of the world map did leave me with questions. Are these provinces allied with each other? Do they in-fight? What other races are there and do they all hate each other? These are things to think about.
Music and Sound: Coming soon!
The music used in this demo is all appropriate and well-used (aside from an odd lyrical selection played during the credits) and I felt like the sound effects were relevant, but from my understanding, this project will soon have a number of custom musical tracks incorporated into the game. I always think custom music is a plus and will check out this sound track when it is released and update this review to reflect it.
Overall 2.5/5
I find myself feeling very much the same way about this project as I did about Wanderer. I feel it is a decent concept plagued by bad design decisions. This is an early demo and its state reflects this; it is still rough and unpolished. there were parts of this game I enjoyed, but they were undermined by the parts I thought were severely broken. However, if you clean up the combat problems (seriously just lowering their evasion alone would probably make this a 3) and consider implementing some of the other ideas I mentioned, and you could have a winner here.
Another reason is “Tactics” play little role in this game compared to luck. Allow me to explain.
To Arms finds you in the role of Janos Blackthorne, the honorable if somewhat ill-tempered captain of the guards to Duke Mandon Lychester of Rydony. Together with his brother Horace, the court mage, Janos is sent to dispatch an incursion of goblins who threaten the Duchy’s borders. However, they are unaware that while they are away, a sinister political plot is about to unfold. Chapter one of To Arms recounts the tale of how the Blackthrone Brothers fell from grace and became the leaders of Blackthorne Company, a group of mercenaries, in hopes of one day using their military might to restore their honor.
Balance 2/5
This game has an interesting approach to combat, but it is held back by some severe balancing problems.
You start the game with the Blackthorne brothers and three generic recruits (for some reason your badass captain and court wizard are the same level as three random squires, but whatever.) You are given a chance to outfit yourself before your mission, buying items and equipment to properly arm yourself. You can be somewhat creative with your equipment options, but for the first few battles there isn’t much to do but attack. Eventually your team is joined by a paladin and his squire, and the option to change classes opens up. Each class has its own equipment options and a tree of skills available to them, which can be purchased with job points earned in battle much like experience. Deciding to branch out and cover a range of classes, I picked a pikeman, a knight, an archer, and a war priest. My team was now varied with a variety of offense and defense while maintaining a safe level of available healing. We were ready to kick some goblin ass.
Armed and dangerous.
As mentioned, you command your entire army in battle at once. For most of the game, this is seven men, and you’re often up against similar numbers of enemies. This means combat can get very intense very quickly, but it can be fun to watch your entire team attack in a sequence, or for Janos to give orders (party buffs) and watch your entire team power-up. But this also leads to a lot of problems. Namely, it is very hard to keep track of exactly what is going on in combat. Enemies hit hard. Many hit more than once. As mentioned, there are often many enemies. If the enemy party gangs up on one or two characters they can be demolished quickly. You’ll often find yourself just taking scores and scores of hits with very little you can do about it. A few classes have status moves such as stun that can hamper enemies, but for the most part there are few ways to really control damage. Another problem is skills have a fairly high cost and it was hard to learn more than one skill per character over the course of demo, especially for the generics. My knight character learned a move that supposedly increased his threat, but it was hard to tell if this was actually doing anything. Enemies also have a lot of HP so even having your entire team gang up on a target doesn’t mean it is going to die. Notably though, there is almost no way to control individual turn order. One of the most critical elements of a tactics game, being able to react to threats or actions in real time by deciding what to do, is lost in the massive jumble of turns. This could be mitigated somewhat by assigning priority to some moves. Healing, for example, should probably have a very high priority. When you’re going to take upwards of fifteen attacks in the next round, you need to be able to heal immediately.
Overall, however, enemies suffer simply from poor balancing. One sequence had the Blackthorne Brothers fighting on their own against squads of enemies. Without allies for support, Horace, my battle mage, was quickly cut down by enemies that were clearly balanced to fight against my seven man army. A single critical hit could bring him down and there was nothing to be done about any of this, and there’s no way to grind in this game to get stronger. All you can do is buy piles of healing items and hope the RNG favors you. The abject unfairness and reliance on luck of this sequence wreaked havoc on this section's score.
But this isn’t the worst part. The worst part is the outrageously high dodge rate of enemies. Late in the demo, enemies dodged far more than any game I have ever seen. Not just some enemies either, but most of them. It was not uncommon for my seven man band to attack and for five of them to miss. You might remember I had a similar complaint in Blood Machine, but this is even worse! I was not missing because my men were blind, and I don’t feel like I was using the wrong types of attacks on them because they readily dodged magic spells as well as physical skills and regular attacks. And I felt like I had a pretty well-balanced party set-up so I don’t feel like my choice in character classes would account for a 70% miss rate. Basically, all I could do was issue orders and pray. There was nothing else I could do! I was completely at the mercy of the dice gods. This isn’t challenge. This isn’t difficulty. This isn’t balanced. This isn’t fair.
The evasion rates of enemies need to be seriously curtailed. It just isn’t fun to start losing a battle because your men can’t land a hit for the life of them. Meanwhile, my enemies rarely had such issues on their own and landed scores of hits on my hapless soldiers. There was only one way to settle this. Janos had access to a party buff that dramatically raised everyone’s agility. By unleashing this power, I was presented with the bizarre scenario in which neither side was able to land a hit. This went on for a while before sheer willpower, brute force, and loads of healing items finally tilted things in my favor. But this did not leave a feeling of elation at my victory. It simply felt sour. The player should feel in control of his or her destiny, not have to rely on sheer luck. I never felt in control. Many rounds went by where all I could do was watch as all my attacks missed while my men got spanked because of some fluke of the dice. Missing an attack is like losing a turn. If I miss there should be a reason, like I was blind or the enemy was flying or was under the influence of an evasion buff. I shouldn't be missing en masse for no reason.
The game tries to play this off as “high difficulty,” and suggests you save often in case you get stuck. (I never got stuck, for the record.) But in reality, this is classic fake difficulty. Your party can get savagely cut up for several rounds for things you have no control over. The game’s “Tips’ section even has the nerve to suggest that it is the player’s job to keep multiple saves and be willing to completely tailor my party to the upcoming battles in order to win certain fights, but as a player, this response doesn’t satisfy me. Don’t expect the player do extra work because you can’t balance your game, and don’t tell the player they’re playing it wrong if the army they built is statistically incapable of winning a battle. How about letting me make the party I want? As a general rule for any game with class systems or customizable parties, you should always be able to win with the party you have, and shouldn’t ever need to have psychically deduced exactly what equipment or skills you would need to win the up-coming battles. Setting up characters to specifically exploit enemy weaknesses should be helpful, but never necessary. Especially since you generally have only a vague idea of what enemies are capable of so, you really can’t prepare before a mission, and once you’re in the heat of battle, there’s no turning back. What I think I would suggest is, where applicable, have some character give some idea what enemies on your next mission are likely to fight like. Are goblins high strength brutes? Would bringing extra heavy armor classes help? Or are they all fast as hell and I need fast people who can actually hit them? Are they vulnerable to magic? Invulnerable? These are things to think about that might actually incorporate some level of strategy and planning into the game. I wouldn’t suggest ever making it necessary to completely rearrange your party, but if you know what’s coming you can make small adjustments. Unless I have made a hopelessly oblivious team formation of all unarmed healers, the answer to a broken, unbalanced battle isn’t to tell the player “you did it wrong.”
Unless you’re a Rogue-like.
All in all I feel like this system has merit, it is just held back by bad balance/design decisions. I do have concerns about the number of characters, however. I felt like keeping track of 7 characters during battle was challenging enough, but throwing 15 into a turn-based encounter system just sounds like trouble. I would suggest limiting the number to a more manageable 8 or so.
Level Design 2.5/5:
This game does not use traditional town/dungeon mechanics. In town you simply visit shops to buy equipment, and then its off on your mission. Once you begin a mission, there is no way out save victory, so make sure to prepare.
Dungeons (using the term loosely) forego exploration for the most part, instead focusing entirely on the encounters. Each battle is unique and occurs in a specific sequence, and generally you’ll need to clear out all the enemies to accomplish your goals. Occasionally, you’ll be given the choice of what order to defeat certain groups of enemy in, or occasionally seek out some optional side area with some extra items, but for the most part it’s fairly linear.
One thing that bothered me was a lack of items to be found, even in areas where there logically would be or are specifically stated to be (a storeroom in an enemy fort offered nothing in the way to be looted, for instance.) The entire first mission went by without a single treasure chest to be seen, which gives little incentive to go exploring. Moreover, the player has no idea going into this situation how much is an appropriate number of items to bring. I bought ten healing salves, what seemed like a reasonable number to me, but I went through these quite quickly and the only way to get more was to hope enemies dropped them. I would suggest making some healing items available to be found in areas so that the player is less easily screwed if they have a hard time with a battle. This is really early in the game after all, this is the time to wean the player into the game and give them a chance to experiment and learn from mistakes, not punish them right out of the gate for failing to make perfect choices. You have the entire rest of the game to make brutal.
Another problem I had was once you’re on a mission, it’s live or die time. There’s no way to retreat from a mission if you find yourself in a bad situation. Not only is this annoying for the player but it’s not tactically sound from the characters’ perspective either. No sane commander is going to charge into a situation he’s totally unprepared for. I would suggest either giving an option to retreat, which either obliges the player to restart the entire mission and reset all the encounters, or perhaps in some cases force the player to eat the failure and forfeit any payment they might have acquired. This isn’t going to be applicable to every single mission but it is something to think about, and is almost certainly preferable to locking the player into an unwinnable situation.
Finally, the uniquely scripted nature of every single encounter give this game a fairly rare opportunity. I was somewhat disappointed to find that my soldiers simply walked into every single combat situation with no thought to tactics. In the future, I would give a forward thinking player some options in situations like this. Set traps, lay ambushes, anything to let the player gain an upper hand in combat. It’s more rewarding to just completely crush an enemy force because you were more clever than them then trade blows with them for twenty turns. If you want this to be a tactics game, let the player apply tactics.
Characters 3/5
Most of the characterization in this demo revolves around the Blackthorne Brothers. The most immediate and obvious characteristic of your protagonist, Janos, is that he is not the typical implausibly talented twenty year old white-haired pretty boy. He is a grizzled veteran who appears to be at least in his forties, a real soldier with years of real experience behind him. He serves as both a sympathetic and effective protagonist, a knight in service of his liege lord, bond by oaths of honor and friendship. His brother, Horace, provides badly needed comic relief; an element often missing from Max’s other games. I liked both of these characters a lot. They had a lot of chemistry and acted like, well, brothers. One thing I thought was odd, though, was that your badass captain of the guard starts at the same level as his recruits. I see no reason why he and the other “main” characters couldn’t start off with a higher experience level and a small pool of job points to spend to reflect their experience over their band of squires. This probably wouldn’t even disrupt the balance horribly, since having one or two higher level characters isn’t going to be a deal breaker in these types of combat situations; if anything it evens the score when you face enemy leaders who are themselves demigods compared to their men.
Most of the other characters received only scant attention. Though the demo contains a handful of minor villains, most aren’t given the chance to do anything but stand around and act fiendish. Lady Bethany, the only important female character to appear, is portrayed in a manner that borders on misogynistic. I can forgive some of this as being one of the realities of the setting, but I couldn’t help but think this would come off better if the writing were more subtle about it.
The dialogue is really quite decent and makes at least a good faith effort to adapt to the setting, a sort of pseudo-old English style that manages to stay understandable but at least give the world some depth. The writing is occasionally marred by Max’s patented “plethora of obscenities” that often not only sound forced and completely out of character for the people saying them, but are out of character for the game’s universe. Did you really need to break your campaign setting’s own rules to let yourself use the f-word? Consider excising these and finding more colorful in-period euphemisms. I assure you they’re out there and some of them are quite fun. They’ll sound better and more natural. This use of profanity does not make things darker and it does not make the characters seem more mature. It makes them seem like grade school students trying desperately to be outrageous.
Story 3/5
The game appears to be set in a fairly expansive fantasy world of political intrigue. It clearly borrows a great deal from Final Fantasy Tactics in regard to its systems and perhaps its world as well, but the mood and tone of the series seems to be inspired more by George R. R. Martin’s A Song of Ice and Fire series. If you liked either of these, there might be something here for you.
The main plot of the game appears to be centered on the Blackthorne Brothers and the missions they undertake, but behind the scenes is a web of deception and betrayal amongst the nobility and their power schemes, though this demo offers but a taste. It is hard to say at this point exactly how developed the world is, though the provincial system of the world map did leave me with questions. Are these provinces allied with each other? Do they in-fight? What other races are there and do they all hate each other? These are things to think about.
Music and Sound: Coming soon!
The music used in this demo is all appropriate and well-used (aside from an odd lyrical selection played during the credits) and I felt like the sound effects were relevant, but from my understanding, this project will soon have a number of custom musical tracks incorporated into the game. I always think custom music is a plus and will check out this sound track when it is released and update this review to reflect it.
Overall 2.5/5
I find myself feeling very much the same way about this project as I did about Wanderer. I feel it is a decent concept plagued by bad design decisions. This is an early demo and its state reflects this; it is still rough and unpolished. there were parts of this game I enjoyed, but they were undermined by the parts I thought were severely broken. However, if you clean up the combat problems (seriously just lowering their evasion alone would probably make this a 3) and consider implementing some of the other ideas I mentioned, and you could have a winner here.

Posts 

I actually think the writing in this game is Max's best effort to date, and with some more attention paid to what we think are the weaknesses of this game, he can make it shine.
I am glad you are not flipping out about this review, Max. I think with a little more work this can be a much better project and there are a lot of people interested in it who are probably willing to give their opinions as well.
I have a few questions for you that I think if you answer it will help us figure out what you want to have happening in this game versus what is actually happening.
First, a lot of people feel like the difficulty fluctuates a lot depending on your class build, a few people have corroborated my feelings on the evasion and other issues while other people are having no problems. So I suppose I am asking ,what made you want to make the early game so challenging? I realize this isn't a game for "beginners" or anything but most people generally feel that a game should start off really easy, especially one with as much overhead as this. There's classes, class skills, equipment configurations, item management, and you have seven characters to juggle in short order. That's a lot to deal with right off the bat, and some of the design decisions punish you for making improper decisions. Combine this with the lack of optional encounters to improve your army and it's a recipe for disaster. I'm not saying every single fight should be a pushover (I felt like the Pendelgard mission wasn't perfect but was a lot better than the second mission) but one scenario finds you with your party split and fighting very dangerous enemies with only two characters. Why did this section need to be a meatgrinder? Your party isn't refined and developed yet, the party is still growing and the player is still finding his "groove" so to speak. Remember that there are seven characters and it's hard to balance that many. I would strongly reconsider your design decisions in this area, simply because it's still really early in the game. Later on, when the party has had a chance to experiment with what works and what doesn't, you can crank up the difficulty to your heart's contentment, and at that point the player will be ready to deal with it.
Second, what do you think it adds to the game to not be able to back out of a mission once you're in it? A hallmark of RPGs is that if you're getting pounded in an area, one option for dealing with it is to leave, go get stronger, learn new skills, buy more items, get new equipment, or possibly change your entire party if you really need to. To Arms doesn't let you do this. Once you're in a mission, you're stuck, and if you can't cut it, you don't have much recourse. That is why I feel it is important that you err on the side of making things too easy instead of too hard, at least this early. If you feel like doing this for your missions makes them more challenging, I think that is moving in the wrong direction, since it's the kind of challenge that alienates and frustrates your player. Generally, letting your player save in unwinnable states is frowned upon, but your entire game is a long series of these. There's no opportunities to practice or gain experience or try out new jobs or find items or make money. Any given encounter could end the player's game permanently because they just might not have the resources to overcome it.
Some games have interesting ways of dealing with this. If you don't want the player to grind endlessly (probably not a great design choice but I'll roll with it) there are some other options available. One such option was used in FFT. You could send your recruits off on random jobs at a tavern to let them gain experience or gold without having to fight a single creature. Other games have option side quests to accomplish, allowing you to make money and experience first before heading into the main plot. Sore Losers did this to great effect. This gives the player a bit of a buffer to work with. Make the boss of a chapter a level 12 encounter but give the player the opportunity to be higher level than that if they want to take the time to do it. Also, maybe reward experience and job points to your entire team after completing a mission. This helps keep characters who just can't stay alive form missing out on experience, and gives the player a nice bonus to work with. Plus, it's sort of gratifying in its own way.
In general, I would say give the player more to work with, give them more options. Right now, despite the huge array of skills available, you can feel pretty limited if you spend 700 JP on a skill that doesn't turn out to be helpful and you can't make those JP back.
I can accept this for Cutjack to an extent since he is clearly a thiefy-type character (I still think his evasion could stand to be halved) but Rhea is an Engineer and I was under the impression engineers were supposed to be slow and vulnerable. That said, I still missed a lot against enemies of all types.
I am glad you are not flipping out about this review, Max. I think with a little more work this can be a much better project and there are a lot of people interested in it who are probably willing to give their opinions as well.
I have a few questions for you that I think if you answer it will help us figure out what you want to have happening in this game versus what is actually happening.
First, a lot of people feel like the difficulty fluctuates a lot depending on your class build, a few people have corroborated my feelings on the evasion and other issues while other people are having no problems. So I suppose I am asking ,what made you want to make the early game so challenging? I realize this isn't a game for "beginners" or anything but most people generally feel that a game should start off really easy, especially one with as much overhead as this. There's classes, class skills, equipment configurations, item management, and you have seven characters to juggle in short order. That's a lot to deal with right off the bat, and some of the design decisions punish you for making improper decisions. Combine this with the lack of optional encounters to improve your army and it's a recipe for disaster. I'm not saying every single fight should be a pushover (I felt like the Pendelgard mission wasn't perfect but was a lot better than the second mission) but one scenario finds you with your party split and fighting very dangerous enemies with only two characters. Why did this section need to be a meatgrinder? Your party isn't refined and developed yet, the party is still growing and the player is still finding his "groove" so to speak. Remember that there are seven characters and it's hard to balance that many. I would strongly reconsider your design decisions in this area, simply because it's still really early in the game. Later on, when the party has had a chance to experiment with what works and what doesn't, you can crank up the difficulty to your heart's contentment, and at that point the player will be ready to deal with it.
Second, what do you think it adds to the game to not be able to back out of a mission once you're in it? A hallmark of RPGs is that if you're getting pounded in an area, one option for dealing with it is to leave, go get stronger, learn new skills, buy more items, get new equipment, or possibly change your entire party if you really need to. To Arms doesn't let you do this. Once you're in a mission, you're stuck, and if you can't cut it, you don't have much recourse. That is why I feel it is important that you err on the side of making things too easy instead of too hard, at least this early. If you feel like doing this for your missions makes them more challenging, I think that is moving in the wrong direction, since it's the kind of challenge that alienates and frustrates your player. Generally, letting your player save in unwinnable states is frowned upon, but your entire game is a long series of these. There's no opportunities to practice or gain experience or try out new jobs or find items or make money. Any given encounter could end the player's game permanently because they just might not have the resources to overcome it.
Some games have interesting ways of dealing with this. If you don't want the player to grind endlessly (probably not a great design choice but I'll roll with it) there are some other options available. One such option was used in FFT. You could send your recruits off on random jobs at a tavern to let them gain experience or gold without having to fight a single creature. Other games have option side quests to accomplish, allowing you to make money and experience first before heading into the main plot. Sore Losers did this to great effect. This gives the player a bit of a buffer to work with. Make the boss of a chapter a level 12 encounter but give the player the opportunity to be higher level than that if they want to take the time to do it. Also, maybe reward experience and job points to your entire team after completing a mission. This helps keep characters who just can't stay alive form missing out on experience, and gives the player a nice bonus to work with. Plus, it's sort of gratifying in its own way.
In general, I would say give the player more to work with, give them more options. Right now, despite the huge array of skills available, you can feel pretty limited if you spend 700 JP on a skill that doesn't turn out to be helpful and you can't make those JP back.
Also, enemy evasion is fairly low with three meaningful exceptions:
-Cutjack (a rogue type miniboss with low HP and defense by boss standards whose main defense is evasion)
-Rhea (ditto)
-Generic Enemy Archers (ditto)
I can accept this for Cutjack to an extent since he is clearly a thiefy-type character (I still think his evasion could stand to be halved) but Rhea is an Engineer and I was under the impression engineers were supposed to be slow and vulnerable. That said, I still missed a lot against enemies of all types.
Perhaps this is worthless coming from my mouth (far be it from me to actually defend Max for once), but I have played Iron Gaia and Backstage, and though I feel To Arms has its share of flaws, it is still far, far more enjoyable than that old stuff.
I felt like the game was quite enjoyable, despite some flaws, but I can definitely agree with Solitayre on the issue of evasion. Frankly, I never felt like Rhea and Cutjack (or the Archers) evaded more than others, because the enemies were constantly evading anyway. I don't think I ever went through a full round of battle without at least one or two misses.
Now, I get that the game is balanced with that in mind, but it drove me nuts and made me want to break things. I would definitely fix that.
Now, I get that the game is balanced with that in mind, but it drove me nuts and made me want to break things. I would definitely fix that.
Just beat the Goblin mission. I'll summarise my thoughts so far:
The Bad:
- Really had no idea I would be needing THAT many healing items, on the first mission no less! Unless I was informed on IRC, I would not have bought 20 soothing balms. If I had gone with my original plan and bought only 5 I'd be in deep shit. Thankfully after classes were introduced I was able to remedy this problem by using multiple War Priests, though, so it's not all bad. It's really just a question of choosing the right classes. Still, way too hard to begin with, I think.
- Didn't like the choice of music for the battle theme. The Trooper's a great tune and all but in a so-called tactical RPG where one is required to think (and think HARD at that, I mean, you're using 7 characters after all, and dealing with about as many enemies at a time, where thanks to the incredible damage output one wrong move can break you), heavy metal music isn't the best choice. I know there's a custom soundtrack or whatever in the making but I thought I should bring that up.
- Minor setback here but I couldn't see the logic in an inaccurate healing move (Janos').
- Profanity that didn't fit with the setting. "Dispense with all the fucking formalities?" Seriously?
The Good:
- Loved the class/spell system. Really well balanced, and loved the feeling I got whenever my more-or-less well thought-out party won a battle.
- The ''survival' aspect of the game - several battles at a time with no escape in sight - left me pretty satisfied whenever I reached a save point. I thought this was a great concept especially once I had a good idea of the amount of damage monsters could do.
- Horace is funny as.
Don't be discouraged by my elaborating more on the bad points than the good! This is a pretty fun game. I may be positive about it just because I haven't encountered the evasion problem yet, but hey, you never know.
The Bad:
- Really had no idea I would be needing THAT many healing items, on the first mission no less! Unless I was informed on IRC, I would not have bought 20 soothing balms. If I had gone with my original plan and bought only 5 I'd be in deep shit. Thankfully after classes were introduced I was able to remedy this problem by using multiple War Priests, though, so it's not all bad. It's really just a question of choosing the right classes. Still, way too hard to begin with, I think.
- Didn't like the choice of music for the battle theme. The Trooper's a great tune and all but in a so-called tactical RPG where one is required to think (and think HARD at that, I mean, you're using 7 characters after all, and dealing with about as many enemies at a time, where thanks to the incredible damage output one wrong move can break you), heavy metal music isn't the best choice. I know there's a custom soundtrack or whatever in the making but I thought I should bring that up.
- Minor setback here but I couldn't see the logic in an inaccurate healing move (Janos').
- Profanity that didn't fit with the setting. "Dispense with all the fucking formalities?" Seriously?
The Good:
- Loved the class/spell system. Really well balanced, and loved the feeling I got whenever my more-or-less well thought-out party won a battle.
- The ''survival' aspect of the game - several battles at a time with no escape in sight - left me pretty satisfied whenever I reached a save point. I thought this was a great concept especially once I had a good idea of the amount of damage monsters could do.
- Horace is funny as.
Don't be discouraged by my elaborating more on the bad points than the good! This is a pretty fun game. I may be positive about it just because I haven't encountered the evasion problem yet, but hey, you never know.
comment=36995
This game is fucking terrible, I'm actually surprised this got as many as 2,5 stars.
Witness the downfall of Legion - from excellent story-driven RPGs and adventure games to terrible gameplay-centric abominations based on awful game-design decisions. From Iron Gaia and Backstage to Mage Duel and To Arms!. Awesome progression, you're maturing as a developer, all right.
lol, it is called the "vx" effect bro. just churn out bad games for the sake of making something on a new maker. at least i can appreciate the direction of the iron gaia games, but these games are just so beyond unappealing.
comment=37024comment=36995lol, it is called the "vx" effect bro. just churn out bad games for the sake of making something on a new maker. at least i can appreciate the direction of the iron gaia games, but these games are just so beyond unappealing.
This game is fucking terrible, I'm actually surprised this got as many as 2,5 stars.
Witness the downfall of Legion - from excellent story-driven RPGs and adventure games to terrible gameplay-centric abominations based on awful game-design decisions. From Iron Gaia and Backstage to Mage Duel and To Arms!. Awesome progression, you're maturing as a developer, all right.
Wow, just wow. Max just can't catch a break no matter what he does.
I am glad you are not flipping out about this review, Max.
Who has the time or energy anymore, honestly? There are plenty of things I disagree with (a lot of the ones and F-G you said), and plenty of people I'd flat-out tell to fuck off (not you and F-G, in this case) but it just seems like a waste of breath.
So I suppose I am asking ,what made you want to make the early game so challenging?
I didn't. It is not meant to be hard, and my impression and more importantly most of my testers' impression was that it wasn't. Most of the testers and I feel that the first episode more or less hits the difficulty sweet spot of easy-but-gradually-getting harder that I think the first couple hours of an RPG should be at. I implore you personally to play-through the game with multiple different party builds to see if the game is in fact 'too difficult' or you just had unusually bad luck/made bad decisions. Actually, it seems to me that neither one on its own would be enough to make the game seem too hard. To clarify, I was not trying to make the game super hard. Edchuy was able to complete it with every possible party combination, including several that were severely handicapped. And as he did not mention having to restart a hundred times and/or ragequit in his beta report, I assume he was able to beat it in a reasonable number of attempts, and with no grinding, with all those different combinations and builds. One of his beta reports reads like a strategy guide for different parties. Perhaps I should post that here.
There are unique challenges involved in balancing a game for more than four party members, and one of the major differences is that in To Arms! the death of an individual unit is not necessarily a big deal. Just because two or three of your characters are down, does not necessarily mean you are losing the fight, and there are several efficient ways to revive them.
One of the last changes I made at the suggestion of one of my testers. was significantly reducing the modifier from critical attacks (from 300% damage to 200% damage I believe) which has significantly evened out the difficulty curve. There are far less one-hit-kills on both sides now.
There's classes, class skills, equipment configurations, item management, and you have seven characters to juggle in short order. That's a lot to deal with right off the bat, and some of the design decisions punish you for making improper decisions.
I won't deny that the game is complex but I thought the very easy early battles and the friendly and helpful tutorials would help ease players into managing all those different factors. That's why I gradually introduced the different choices available in stages, starting with just equipment choices, then skill choices, then class-changing, then combos, giving the player a chance to get used to each tier before moving on to the next.
Second, what do you think it adds to the game to not be able to back out of a mission once you're in it?
This was only a "design decision" in the sense that it was the only thing that made sense to me in the in-game universe. During all of the missions in the game, there was an urgent, story based objective. If a later mission was a challenge that the characters could tackle at THEIR leisure, then I'd give the players the same option. I guess I am waxing "simulationist" here (in the GNS sense).
Combine this with the lack of optional encounters to improve your army and it's a recipe for disaster.
Many people disagree with you about the "recipe for disaster component", including me, but what I don't disagree with is that random encounters would have been (will be?) a good addition.
I just need to put some thought into how to cap and/or limit them and how to prevent them from popping up unwanted. They were always intended to be a part of later episodes, but they were left out of Episode One because of the linear and short-term nature of the plot. It always bothered me in FFT (and many other games) when I, while I was supposed to be urgently trying to rescue someone who was kidnapped that I could spend literally in-game months wandering the wilderness and fighting monsters to grow stronger, with no in-game consequences. Again, I am being a simulationist here and my answer essentially is "because it makes sense in the in-game logic".
Likewise, future episodes will definitely include short, optional side missions.
I don't know if repeatable random encounters will be added to Part 1, but if people show enough interest/the game garners enough acclaim to warrant there being a Part 2, they will almost certainly be in that.
In general, I would say give the player more to work with, give them more options. Right now, despite the huge array of skills available, you can feel pretty limited if you spend 700 JP on a skill that doesn't turn out to be helpful and you can't make those JP back.
Okay, I'll bite. With the exception of 1-3 individual skills every skill of every class is extremely useful when used correctly. In the interest of that, could you tell me which one didn't turn out to be helpful?
On an unrelated note--and one of my team members has written about this issue at length on the ghostlight forums--the word fuck originated in the 15th century and was used as profanity by Shakespeare in his writing. It is not a modern invention and it is incorrect to say it does not fit in with the time of swords and catapults. It is also used, relatively speaking, very sparingly in this game, by choice, to heighten the impact of each obscenity. It is also certainly not out of character for a band of professional soldiers.
comment=37029
It is best to take what TFT says with a grain of salt.
yeah i think i am more credible than random user with 0 games and 0 misaos.
comment=37024I actually agree with this 100%comment=36995lol, it is called the "vx" effect bro. just churn out bad games for the sake of making something on a new maker. at least i can appreciate the direction of the iron gaia games, but these games are just so beyond unappealing.
This game is fucking terrible, I'm actually surprised this got as many as 2,5 stars.
Witness the downfall of Legion - from excellent story-driven RPGs and adventure games to terrible gameplay-centric abominations based on awful game-design decisions. From Iron Gaia and Backstage to Mage Duel and To Arms!. Awesome progression, you're maturing as a developer, all right.
Alex in heaven is punishing you for your transgressions Legion...
I've never read any A Song of Ice & Fire books, but I was under the impression that they contain some pretty obscene profanity. So it seems a little strange to me that To Arms! would be recognized in the review as apparently drawing inspiration from that series, yet at the same time chastised for its occasional use of the word 'fuck'. Then again maybe Solitayre dislikes that about A Song of Ice & Fire too. If I'm wrong about the books, though, someone let me know--I'm just going off of hearsay with that.
I'm not sure I'd say the game started out easy but it was definitely reasonable. (My definition of easy is probably quite different from yours though, Max.) I used the same classes as Solitayre and I never ran into anything un-winnable, and I was only completely wiped out two or three times, IIRC, and it was just bad luck that could happen in any game. However, I did load older saves of my own accord a few times because I'm one of those people who can't stand characters dying! Once I came to terms with the fact that sometimes my guys were just going to get killed though, I never felt like the difficulty was overwhelming. I felt like I could have made the experience easier on myself with a different build or party setup, for sure, but never like I severely handicapped myself.
One thing that bugged me: I got two recruits named Malcolm. Is it possible you could remove the possibility of same-name recruits somehow? Granted, it's not exactly a game where I need to know which Malcolm is being struck each time it says so, since I can just find out at the start of the next round, but it would be nice. I'd recommend allowing players to name their own recruits, but I understand you're trying to keep up a certain atmosphere and "Dicklord takes 126 damage" kind of undermines that. (of course if someone names their guy Dicklord they probably don't care about the atmosphere anyway)
Also, this is just a thing from off the top of my head, but I think it would be nice if the Kryllor's Mending spell (I think that's what it was called) was very slow--perhaps even guaranteed to go at the end of a round--but Dazed the character 100% of the time; to counteract this, there could exist a reduced-effectiveness healing spell that doesn't Daze (or at least has a far lower chance of it) but goes at a normal or increased speed. I say this because I felt sometimes like I'd rather just not heal and take my chances so as to avoid the possibility of accidentally preventing one of my guys from attacking/using a skill that round. Then again, I'm obviously not as well-acquainted with the game as you are, so maybe there's some way this would upset the balance that I'm overlooking/unaware of.
I agree with Solitayre that it would be nice to get a flat XP/JP bonus at the end of a mission, even a relatively small one, because it adds a lot to the sense of satisfaction. You could even justify it in the game's logic by saying the bonus is a result of reflection on their experiences in the mission or something like that; even if they were KO'ed at the end of the mission, they still can look back on it and say "this is where I went right/wrong" or whatever and still get the bonus. I dunno. Along the same lines, maybe Janos could start with one of his orders, considering he's not really new to being Captain. Even a weakened version of one of the JP-costing skills if nothing else. (Also, again just off the top of my head; maybe an order that decreases both incoming and outgoing crit%? Not sure if you can do that with the scripts you're using or anything though. And again this could upset balance in some way I'm unaware of.)
Well I think that's about all I have to say right now! Wasn't expecting to type that much. I'm hoping this is all coherent because I'm not willing to read it over. Take my suggestions with a few dozen grains of salt, considering it is almost 1:30 AM and I'm not really double-checking anything I just said.
(and also because i have 0 games and 0 misaos and 0 makerscore)
I'm not sure I'd say the game started out easy but it was definitely reasonable. (My definition of easy is probably quite different from yours though, Max.) I used the same classes as Solitayre and I never ran into anything un-winnable, and I was only completely wiped out two or three times, IIRC, and it was just bad luck that could happen in any game. However, I did load older saves of my own accord a few times because I'm one of those people who can't stand characters dying! Once I came to terms with the fact that sometimes my guys were just going to get killed though, I never felt like the difficulty was overwhelming. I felt like I could have made the experience easier on myself with a different build or party setup, for sure, but never like I severely handicapped myself.
One thing that bugged me: I got two recruits named Malcolm. Is it possible you could remove the possibility of same-name recruits somehow? Granted, it's not exactly a game where I need to know which Malcolm is being struck each time it says so, since I can just find out at the start of the next round, but it would be nice. I'd recommend allowing players to name their own recruits, but I understand you're trying to keep up a certain atmosphere and "Dicklord takes 126 damage" kind of undermines that. (of course if someone names their guy Dicklord they probably don't care about the atmosphere anyway)
Also, this is just a thing from off the top of my head, but I think it would be nice if the Kryllor's Mending spell (I think that's what it was called) was very slow--perhaps even guaranteed to go at the end of a round--but Dazed the character 100% of the time; to counteract this, there could exist a reduced-effectiveness healing spell that doesn't Daze (or at least has a far lower chance of it) but goes at a normal or increased speed. I say this because I felt sometimes like I'd rather just not heal and take my chances so as to avoid the possibility of accidentally preventing one of my guys from attacking/using a skill that round. Then again, I'm obviously not as well-acquainted with the game as you are, so maybe there's some way this would upset the balance that I'm overlooking/unaware of.
I agree with Solitayre that it would be nice to get a flat XP/JP bonus at the end of a mission, even a relatively small one, because it adds a lot to the sense of satisfaction. You could even justify it in the game's logic by saying the bonus is a result of reflection on their experiences in the mission or something like that; even if they were KO'ed at the end of the mission, they still can look back on it and say "this is where I went right/wrong" or whatever and still get the bonus. I dunno. Along the same lines, maybe Janos could start with one of his orders, considering he's not really new to being Captain. Even a weakened version of one of the JP-costing skills if nothing else. (Also, again just off the top of my head; maybe an order that decreases both incoming and outgoing crit%? Not sure if you can do that with the scripts you're using or anything though. And again this could upset balance in some way I'm unaware of.)
Well I think that's about all I have to say right now! Wasn't expecting to type that much. I'm hoping this is all coherent because I'm not willing to read it over. Take my suggestions with a few dozen grains of salt, considering it is almost 1:30 AM and I'm not really double-checking anything I just said.
(and also because i have 0 games and 0 misaos and 0 makerscore)
I don't know about everyone else, but I certain preconceptions when going into any RPG.
The vast majority of RPGs, both commercial and amateur, take it easy on the player. I'm used to being able go though most of the game with minimal use of items. Being able to go back to town whenever you want is an idea so prevalent that I assume the game will let me do so. Thus when I first played this game I went into the first mission sorely unprepared. I had no idea how many battles I would be fighting or how much damage I would be taking so I had to restart.
Many games have a "this shit just got real" moment when you realize that the game is no longer pulling any punches and you have to give it your all in every fight in order to win. I felt this moment 10 minutes into To Arms and that is to early for my comfort. Most games start out with a "training area" to get them familiar with the mechanics of the game. For example, in Final Fantasy Tactics it was possible to beat the first few battles using only Squires with no abilities or items. That doesn't mean every player will be using that strategy, but the game provides a safety net nevertheless. Realizing you do not have that net is a very jarring experience.
As for the language, again I think its a matter of expectations. Most commercial RPGs are rated for Teens or lower so the word fuck is rarely found. Since most of us grew up playing games with PG rated dialogue, most RPGMaker games follow the same standards. After many years of conditioning, seeing a sprite say the work fuck throws you off guard. When The Witcher was initially released many people complained about the R-rated dialogue stating that it just didn't feel right. Eventually much of the dialogue was rerecorded and the swearing was toned down. I not saying Max should conform to the standards but you have to realize what most people expect.
I personally like when a setting makes up its own curse words. This allows for strong language without making the characters sound like foul mouthed teenagers. It I told you to "Pike off, berk!" you would know what I meant. I feel this gives the dialog more flavor without sacrificing its intent.
By the way, I also ended up with two grunts named Malcolm. For a while I thought the game had given me two copies of the same character. This made combat needlessly confusing.
Well thats it for my rant. But I'm just a guy with no makerscore so what the fuck do I know.
The vast majority of RPGs, both commercial and amateur, take it easy on the player. I'm used to being able go though most of the game with minimal use of items. Being able to go back to town whenever you want is an idea so prevalent that I assume the game will let me do so. Thus when I first played this game I went into the first mission sorely unprepared. I had no idea how many battles I would be fighting or how much damage I would be taking so I had to restart.
Many games have a "this shit just got real" moment when you realize that the game is no longer pulling any punches and you have to give it your all in every fight in order to win. I felt this moment 10 minutes into To Arms and that is to early for my comfort. Most games start out with a "training area" to get them familiar with the mechanics of the game. For example, in Final Fantasy Tactics it was possible to beat the first few battles using only Squires with no abilities or items. That doesn't mean every player will be using that strategy, but the game provides a safety net nevertheless. Realizing you do not have that net is a very jarring experience.
As for the language, again I think its a matter of expectations. Most commercial RPGs are rated for Teens or lower so the word fuck is rarely found. Since most of us grew up playing games with PG rated dialogue, most RPGMaker games follow the same standards. After many years of conditioning, seeing a sprite say the work fuck throws you off guard. When The Witcher was initially released many people complained about the R-rated dialogue stating that it just didn't feel right. Eventually much of the dialogue was rerecorded and the swearing was toned down. I not saying Max should conform to the standards but you have to realize what most people expect.
I personally like when a setting makes up its own curse words. This allows for strong language without making the characters sound like foul mouthed teenagers. It I told you to "Pike off, berk!" you would know what I meant. I feel this gives the dialog more flavor without sacrificing its intent.
By the way, I also ended up with two grunts named Malcolm. For a while I thought the game had given me two copies of the same character. This made combat needlessly confusing.
Well thats it for my rant. But I'm just a guy with no makerscore so what the fuck do I know.
My thoughts on stuff that's been discussed (which are worth 38 makerscore more than you other guys).
First, about language. I'm a big fan of A Song of Ice and Fire. I eagerly await the fifth book in the series. The content of the books themselves are very adult, and this comes with its share of profanity, including "f--k." Though it doesn't occur incredibly often, I've seen it used primarily in context to the act of fornicating (thus, as a verb). Even that was a little jarring, but I'm well past that now.
Two things. One, I'm sure that it's been used for centuries, but I'm not quite convinced that it's been used to color sentences so much as it is today, i.e. "what the f--k" and "mind your f--king business." I'm not saying it hasn't, but it does pull me away from my suspension of belief. Which brings me to point two. It's unfair, but I think amateur writers, particularly for amateur games and even more so for writers of medieval fantasy games, are subjected to higher scrutiny for their choices. Language in particular, one who reads hard cursing from an amateur writer becomes critical, wondering if the writer just did it to make it edgy. When you read it in paperback, people aren't that critical, because hey, it's published and sitting in your hands, the guy had to know what he was doing.
It's a design choice, and a valid one. But people bring attention to it because it genuinely does bring them out of the narrative. Like said above, people are used to playing games and reading stories that make no use of this profanity, regardless of historical accuracy. That said, it's a design choice that should best befit the maker's intention, and I don't doubt that's what Max is doing.
Second, while I don't disagree with the concept of the "vx effect," I'm loathe to say it really applies here. I believe that Max is really using the strengths of the maker to produce the product he wants to make. Have what opinion you will about the quality of the games, I think it's more likely that with the much wider boundaries VX has placed on RPG creation, it's more difficult to clearly focus on the creative aspects of doing so.
And lastly, the debate about the gameplay itself. While reading more of Max's comments and his defense of how tight the balance is in the game, something occurred to me. As he asked dissenters to take some more time and try different party make-ups and skill builds and see if you get (un)lucky each time, I had to ask myself: why? It's not that I don't believe Max or think that such a high risk of death was his intent, or anything like that. In fact I'm willing to believe the game plays exactly as Max intended.
So, I'm not going to play it. I'm not going to spend the time to try different class combinations or different builds to see if I will succeed. If I did, then I would be spending x frustrating hours playing the game the way Max wanted it to be played. He would achieve what he sought to do, while I will have gained nothing, or at worst, felt like I had wasted my time. While I would have been willing to do this to offer feedback or a review like the dutiful Solitayre does all the time, I merely don't see the need. Any review I could possibly have to offer would be negative, and feedback would be dismissed (again, not because Max doesn't care, but because the gameplay experience I would have disliked so much is intentional).
First, about language. I'm a big fan of A Song of Ice and Fire. I eagerly await the fifth book in the series. The content of the books themselves are very adult, and this comes with its share of profanity, including "f--k." Though it doesn't occur incredibly often, I've seen it used primarily in context to the act of fornicating (thus, as a verb). Even that was a little jarring, but I'm well past that now.
Two things. One, I'm sure that it's been used for centuries, but I'm not quite convinced that it's been used to color sentences so much as it is today, i.e. "what the f--k" and "mind your f--king business." I'm not saying it hasn't, but it does pull me away from my suspension of belief. Which brings me to point two. It's unfair, but I think amateur writers, particularly for amateur games and even more so for writers of medieval fantasy games, are subjected to higher scrutiny for their choices. Language in particular, one who reads hard cursing from an amateur writer becomes critical, wondering if the writer just did it to make it edgy. When you read it in paperback, people aren't that critical, because hey, it's published and sitting in your hands, the guy had to know what he was doing.
It's a design choice, and a valid one. But people bring attention to it because it genuinely does bring them out of the narrative. Like said above, people are used to playing games and reading stories that make no use of this profanity, regardless of historical accuracy. That said, it's a design choice that should best befit the maker's intention, and I don't doubt that's what Max is doing.
Second, while I don't disagree with the concept of the "vx effect," I'm loathe to say it really applies here. I believe that Max is really using the strengths of the maker to produce the product he wants to make. Have what opinion you will about the quality of the games, I think it's more likely that with the much wider boundaries VX has placed on RPG creation, it's more difficult to clearly focus on the creative aspects of doing so.
And lastly, the debate about the gameplay itself. While reading more of Max's comments and his defense of how tight the balance is in the game, something occurred to me. As he asked dissenters to take some more time and try different party make-ups and skill builds and see if you get (un)lucky each time, I had to ask myself: why? It's not that I don't believe Max or think that such a high risk of death was his intent, or anything like that. In fact I'm willing to believe the game plays exactly as Max intended.
So, I'm not going to play it. I'm not going to spend the time to try different class combinations or different builds to see if I will succeed. If I did, then I would be spending x frustrating hours playing the game the way Max wanted it to be played. He would achieve what he sought to do, while I will have gained nothing, or at worst, felt like I had wasted my time. While I would have been willing to do this to offer feedback or a review like the dutiful Solitayre does all the time, I merely don't see the need. Any review I could possibly have to offer would be negative, and feedback would be dismissed (again, not because Max doesn't care, but because the gameplay experience I would have disliked so much is intentional).
cho
I've never read any A Song of Ice & Fire books, but I was under the impression that they contain some pretty obscene profanity. So it seems a little strange to me that To Arms! would be recognized in the review as apparently drawing inspiration from that series, yet at the same time chastised for its occasional use of the word 'fuck'.
I'm only passingly familiar with these books (enough to recognize influences) but it is not just the use of certain words that bothers me. I have enjoyed works that make profuse use of profanity before. There's just something about the way Max uses it that seems profoundly wrong. It's like the cadence is off, it interrupts the flow, and I never feel it adds anything to the dialogue. I don't know if I can really explain it more than that.
physhal
I personally like when a setting makes up its own curse words. This allows for strong language without making the characters sound like foul mouthed teenagers. It I told you to "Pike off, berk!" you would know what I meant. I feel this gives the dialog more flavor without sacrificing its intent.
I like this idea. It not only adds a lot of character and uniqueness to the setting, but it lets the player "fill in the blanks" with whatever word choice they want. I like using my imagination.
Max
Okay, I'll bite. With the exception of 1-3 individual skills every skill of every class is extremely useful when used correctly. In the interest of that, could you tell me which one didn't turn out to be helpful?
Guess it depends on your definition of "useful." As I mentioned, I wasn't sure my knight's Honorguard was actually doing anything, but since it is changing things behind the scenes I am willing to chalk this up to me just not noticing a big difference. I felt like Horace's Miasma spell wasn't worth both the enormous PP cost and the multiple turn cooldown. Janos' Let Them have It!" buff turned out to be not terribly useful either since the game seems geared more towards using skills to your reduce your incoming damage, and I never noticed a substantial damage increase when I used it anyway. My Pikeman's "Steel Blur" skill sure sounded useful since it hits twice with a short cooldown, but since enemies dodge so much it wasn't uncommon for both of his attacks to miss.
I don't think this is a matter of skills being inherently bad, just the enemies being poorly balanced. You seem to be elevating your play testers' experience above that of your actual players. So far around seven people in this thread (several of whom are definitely fans of your earlier work) have played the game and expressed the opinion that the combat leaves a lot to be desired. Are you really just going to continue to insist that we all just aren't playing the game right?
So far around seven people in this thread (several of whom are definitely fans of your earlier work) have played the game and expressed the opinion that the combat leaves a lot to be desired. Are you really just going to continue to insist that we all just aren't playing the game right?
Refer to the last two paragraphs in my post above for my opinion on this.
I personally like when a setting makes up its own curse words. This allows for strong language without making the characters sound like foul mouthed teenagers. It I told you to "Pike off, berk!" you would know what I meant.
Just to note, this is not actually made up slang. It was used by the working class in 19th century England. I'm assuming you saw this in Planescape since it's a commonly used phrase (most of the other slang in that game is also based off of this, minus the terms they created to tie in with the game's lore).
Anyway that aside I also like when a setting makes up its own lingo, the effect is even stronger if it extends beyond curse words (and using obscure slang from history works just as well). Tabletop games make use of this quite frequently to great effect.
So yeah these responses will not be in ANY order. Sorry:
@physhal:
So for some reason I thought that was going to be a defense, but yeah...was there anything you LIKED about the game? And about the "safety net", well, I tried to build one, and all my testers confirmed it was there. I guess I didn't experience the same blistering "boy you're fucked now" early game difficulty that so many other people did. But you are right that To Arms! is not a game where you can afford not to use skills and items. But I mean, I kind of assumed everyone would use skills and items even from the beginning. If they're not...then what the hell are they doing playing the game?
Oh, thanks YM! I almost missed this because it was posted as a comment on Solitayre's review (which is not my game) instead of directly as a comment or review on my game. (Hint.) Anyway I appreciate that the game you played seems to resemble the game I made and my testers tested, more than the one that Solitayre played.
Other thoughts:
If this distinction is really that important, well then it's a good thing I'm not an amateur writer (see PM). At first I was going to be obnoxious and put the link right in the words "well then it's a good thing I'm not an amateur writer" but then I realized some of the downsides of that.
I don't think the word fuck is used as much as a "punctuation" mark here as it is in say, Iron Gaia: Virus. Martin's honest use of realistic profanity was one of the reasons I loved Song of Ice and Fire. But I mean, I think I just on a whole other planet from your hypothetical reader because the presence or absence of cursing has never caused me to to view any work in a positive or negative light. The truth is, profanity is just another tool in any writer's toolbox. I am made deeply uncomfortable by anyone who assigns any further importance or absolute value to it, it seems like a deeply puritanical, reactionary, anal retentive kind of attitude.
Um, are people from the 1950s for some reason? Or have they just missed the last thirty or so years of American culture and the entire body of work of David Mamet, Quentin Tarantino, et al. and all of their many imitators? I hope no one misinterprets this and comes out with an irrelevant argument about me imitating anyone or me saying that this is okay because they are doing it. That's not the point. The point is how can you be shocked by cursing?
At this point I feel it is jarring when a work DOESN'T have profanity. Like reading Starship Troopers by Heinlein for the first time (I later read it was supposed to be a children's book) I was like, this is about soldiers, where's all the fucking cursing? Since soldiers, like sailors, have a well deserved reputation for that. When I encountered alternatives (Heinlein likes the phrase "Shucks, and other comments") they were decidedly lame.
Your interpretation of my intentions is ass backwards, sir. I'm saying play the game however you like it and I trust you will enjoy it and have a great time. I'm saying this to everyone. I very much doubt that Solitayre's experience with the game will be the norm, because it is not what anyone else reported. Solitayre was the first person to tell me that the game was too hard. (DE made beta comments, but then I addressed all those comments so I assumed those issues were addressed.)
Considering part of my writing process is checking every line of dialogue for how it reads out loud, including rhythm, emphasis, and flow , to say nothing of characterization, I am surprised to see you mentioning cadence. Take the first instance of profanity, for instance. Mandon is so drunk and henpecked that he is swearing at his best friend and that he is swearing AT COURT. COURT, like the medieval sense. It is the first hint you get that Mandon may be a little bit out of control. It is confirmed much more clearly when he berates his wife and then Kevan.
I hate this bullshit. "Frag", "Drek", and "Slitch" were my least favorite part of the first three editions of Shadowrun which is otherwise my favorite game. I grew to love them because I love all things Shadowrun, but I was relieved in fourth edition when they were done away with and we were encouraged to course like grownups again. This is the kind of thing that is not done as an artistic choice, guys. It is done to bypass censors. Censors I thought we didn't have here (lol).
Honorguard is easily the cornerstone of most Knight-based strategies.
Miasma damages and poisons EVERY SINGLE ENEMY. All of them! It is great when combined with a defensive strategy of any kind as poison inflicts DoT!
Let Them Have It!!!!'s effectiveness depends entirely on how your party is made up. If you have a very high physical direct-damage party (Archers & Berserkers) or one that can shrug-off the debuff (Knights & War Priests) it can be one of the best skills in the game.
Steel blur...well enemies don't dodge that much. The vast majority of enemies in the game have an evasion rate of less than 10%, with the only outliers being bosses who have that evasion rate instead of (not in addition to) boss hp.
I've never said this once. What I'm really going to do, in all likelihood, is just stop making games anymore. No one should interpret this as "take my ball and go home"-ism, really it's more like a lab rat who has repeatedly been shocked by a cupcake finally learning to leave the cupcake alone. In fact, maybe I could have replaced this whole post with:
Okay, I get it.
Because I can spend hundreds of man hours and test to the nth degree to produce a game that has the perfect difficulty balance and then have people tell me it is wildly too hard and then have other people refuse to play it because of scathing reviews. This diminishing returns shit isn't cutting it. If this is how the effort of making a game at the level of To Arms! is rewarded than the cognitive dissonance is too great between the product I think I've made and the one people are playing. It is time to get out while the getting's good, before I get involved in any other project or get re-involved in this one. I had pulled a deep fade from the community since the start of June, but I forced myself to come back and finish this so I wouldn't have any loose ends. Well, no loose ends now.
@physhal:
So for some reason I thought that was going to be a defense, but yeah...was there anything you LIKED about the game? And about the "safety net", well, I tried to build one, and all my testers confirmed it was there. I guess I didn't experience the same blistering "boy you're fucked now" early game difficulty that so many other people did. But you are right that To Arms! is not a game where you can afford not to use skills and items. But I mean, I kind of assumed everyone would use skills and items even from the beginning. If they're not...then what the hell are they doing playing the game?
Just beat the Goblin mission. I'll summarise my thoughts so far:
The Bad:
- Really had no idea I would be needing THAT many healing items, on the first mission no less! Unless I was informed on IRC, I would not have bought 20 soothing balms. If I had gone with my original plan and bought only 5 I'd be in deep shit. Thankfully after classes were introduced I was able to remedy this problem by using multiple War Priests, though, so it's not all bad. It's really just a question of choosing the right classes. Still, way too hard to begin with, I think.
- Didn't like the choice of music for the battle theme. The Trooper's a great tune and all but in a so-called tactical RPG where one is required to think (and think HARD at that, I mean, you're using 7 characters after all, and dealing with about as many enemies at a time, where thanks to the incredible damage output one wrong move can break you), heavy metal music isn't the best choice. I know there's a custom soundtrack or whatever in the making but I thought I should bring that up.
- Minor setback here but I couldn't see the logic in an inaccurate healing move (Janos').
- Profanity that didn't fit with the setting. "Dispense with all the fucking formalities?" Seriously?
The Good:
- Loved the class/spell system. Really well balanced, and loved the feeling I got whenever my more-or-less well thought-out party won a battle.
- The ''survival' aspect of the game - several battles at a time with no escape in sight - left me pretty satisfied whenever I reached a save point. I thought this was a great concept especially once I had a good idea of the amount of damage monsters could do.
- Horace is funny as.
Don't be discouraged by my elaborating more on the bad points than the good! This is a pretty fun game. I may be positive about it just because I haven't encountered the evasion problem yet, but hey, you never know.
Oh, thanks YM! I almost missed this because it was posted as a comment on Solitayre's review (which is not my game) instead of directly as a comment or review on my game. (Hint.) Anyway I appreciate that the game you played seems to resemble the game I made and my testers tested, more than the one that Solitayre played.
Other thoughts:
Two things. One, I'm sure that it's been used for centuries, but I'm not quite convinced that it's been used to color sentences so much as it is today, i.e. "what the f--k" and "mind your f--king business." I'm not saying it hasn't, but it does pull me away from my suspension of belief. Which brings me to point two. It's unfair, but I think amateur writers, particularly for amateur games and even more so for writers of medieval fantasy games, are subjected to higher scrutiny for their choices. Language in particular, one who reads hard cursing from an amateur writer becomes critical, wondering if the writer just did it to make it edgy. When you read it in paperback, people aren't that critical, because hey, it's published and sitting in your hands, the guy had to know what he was doing.
If this distinction is really that important, well then it's a good thing I'm not an amateur writer (see PM). At first I was going to be obnoxious and put the link right in the words "well then it's a good thing I'm not an amateur writer" but then I realized some of the downsides of that.
I don't think the word fuck is used as much as a "punctuation" mark here as it is in say, Iron Gaia: Virus. Martin's honest use of realistic profanity was one of the reasons I loved Song of Ice and Fire. But I mean, I think I just on a whole other planet from your hypothetical reader because the presence or absence of cursing has never caused me to to view any work in a positive or negative light. The truth is, profanity is just another tool in any writer's toolbox. I am made deeply uncomfortable by anyone who assigns any further importance or absolute value to it, it seems like a deeply puritanical, reactionary, anal retentive kind of attitude.
Like said above, people are used to playing games and reading stories that make no use of this profanity, regardless of historical accuracy.
Um, are people from the 1950s for some reason? Or have they just missed the last thirty or so years of American culture and the entire body of work of David Mamet, Quentin Tarantino, et al. and all of their many imitators? I hope no one misinterprets this and comes out with an irrelevant argument about me imitating anyone or me saying that this is okay because they are doing it. That's not the point. The point is how can you be shocked by cursing?
At this point I feel it is jarring when a work DOESN'T have profanity. Like reading Starship Troopers by Heinlein for the first time (I later read it was supposed to be a children's book) I was like, this is about soldiers, where's all the fucking cursing? Since soldiers, like sailors, have a well deserved reputation for that. When I encountered alternatives (Heinlein likes the phrase "Shucks, and other comments") they were decidedly lame.
I did, then I would be spending x frustrating hours playing the game the way Max wanted it to be played.
Your interpretation of my intentions is ass backwards, sir. I'm saying play the game however you like it and I trust you will enjoy it and have a great time. I'm saying this to everyone. I very much doubt that Solitayre's experience with the game will be the norm, because it is not what anyone else reported. Solitayre was the first person to tell me that the game was too hard. (DE made beta comments, but then I addressed all those comments so I assumed those issues were addressed.)
I'm only passingly familiar with these books (enough to recognize influences) but it is not just the use of certain words that bothers me. I have enjoyed works that make profuse use of profanity before. There's just something about the way Max uses it that seems profoundly wrong. It's like the cadence is off, it interrupts the flow, and I never feel it adds anything to the dialogue. I don't know if I can really explain it more than that.
Considering part of my writing process is checking every line of dialogue for how it reads out loud, including rhythm, emphasis, and flow , to say nothing of characterization, I am surprised to see you mentioning cadence. Take the first instance of profanity, for instance. Mandon is so drunk and henpecked that he is swearing at his best friend and that he is swearing AT COURT. COURT, like the medieval sense. It is the first hint you get that Mandon may be a little bit out of control. It is confirmed much more clearly when he berates his wife and then Kevan.
I personally like when a setting makes up its own curse words. This allows for strong language without making the characters sound like foul mouthed teenagers. It I told you to "Pike off, berk!" you would know what I meant. I feel this gives the dialog more flavor without sacrificing its intent.
I like this idea. It not only adds a lot of character and uniqueness to the setting, but it lets the player "fill in the blanks" with whatever word choice they want. I like using my imagination.
I hate this bullshit. "Frag", "Drek", and "Slitch" were my least favorite part of the first three editions of Shadowrun which is otherwise my favorite game. I grew to love them because I love all things Shadowrun, but I was relieved in fourth edition when they were done away with and we were encouraged to course like grownups again. This is the kind of thing that is not done as an artistic choice, guys. It is done to bypass censors. Censors I thought we didn't have here (lol).
Guess it depends on your definition of "useful." As I mentioned, I wasn't sure my knight's Honorguard was actually doing anything, but since it is changing things behind the scenes I am willing to chalk this up to me just not noticing a big difference. I felt like Horace's Miasma spell wasn't worth both the enormous PP cost and the multiple turn cooldown. Janos' Let Them have It!" buff turned out to be not terribly useful either since the game seems geared more towards using skills to your reduce your incoming damage, and I never noticed a substantial damage increase when I used it anyway. My Pikeman's "Steel Blur" skill sure sounded useful since it hits twice with a short cooldown, but since enemies dodge so much it wasn't uncommon for both of his attacks to miss.
Honorguard is easily the cornerstone of most Knight-based strategies.
Miasma damages and poisons EVERY SINGLE ENEMY. All of them! It is great when combined with a defensive strategy of any kind as poison inflicts DoT!
Let Them Have It!!!!'s effectiveness depends entirely on how your party is made up. If you have a very high physical direct-damage party (Archers & Berserkers) or one that can shrug-off the debuff (Knights & War Priests) it can be one of the best skills in the game.
Steel blur...well enemies don't dodge that much. The vast majority of enemies in the game have an evasion rate of less than 10%, with the only outliers being bosses who have that evasion rate instead of (not in addition to) boss hp.
Are you really just going to continue to insist that we all just aren't playing the game right?
I've never said this once. What I'm really going to do, in all likelihood, is just stop making games anymore. No one should interpret this as "take my ball and go home"-ism, really it's more like a lab rat who has repeatedly been shocked by a cupcake finally learning to leave the cupcake alone. In fact, maybe I could have replaced this whole post with:
Okay, I get it.
Because I can spend hundreds of man hours and test to the nth degree to produce a game that has the perfect difficulty balance and then have people tell me it is wildly too hard and then have other people refuse to play it because of scathing reviews. This diminishing returns shit isn't cutting it. If this is how the effort of making a game at the level of To Arms! is rewarded than the cognitive dissonance is too great between the product I think I've made and the one people are playing. It is time to get out while the getting's good, before I get involved in any other project or get re-involved in this one. I had pulled a deep fade from the community since the start of June, but I forced myself to come back and finish this so I wouldn't have any loose ends. Well, no loose ends now.
I've never read any A Song of Ice & Fire books, but I was under the impression that they contain some pretty obscene profanity. So it seems a little strange to me that To Arms! would be recognized in the review as apparently drawing inspiration from that series, yet at the same time chastised for its occasional use of the word 'fuck'. Then again maybe Solitayre dislikes that about A Song of Ice & Fire too. If I'm wrong about the books, though, someone let me know--I'm just going off of hearsay with that.
You are right that To Arms! has much less obscenity than A Song of Ice and Fire.
I'm not sure I'd say the game started out easy but it was definitely reasonable. (My definition of easy is probably quite different from yours though, Max.) I used the same classes as Solitayre and I never ran into anything un-winnable, and I was only completely wiped out two or three times, IIRC, and it was just bad luck that could happen in any game.
Once again, it's a relief to see someone who played the same game I made.
However, I did load older saves of my own accord a few times because I'm one of those people who can't stand characters dying! Once I came to terms with the fact that sometimes my guys were just going to get killed though, I never felt like the difficulty was overwhelming. I felt like I could have made the experience easier on myself with a different build or party setup, for sure, but never like I severely handicapped myself
What I am getting is that a LOT of people are "one of those people" and that strongly colors some people's reaction to To Arms! They were not able to adjust. I'm glad you were able to adjust.
One thing that bugged me: I got two recruits named Malcolm. Is it possible you could remove the possibility of same-name recruits somehow? Granted, it's not exactly a game where I need to know which Malcolm is being struck each time it says so, since I can just find out at the start of the next round, but it would be nice. I'd recommend allowing players to name their own recruits, but I understand you're trying to keep up a certain atmosphere and "Dicklord takes 126 damage" kind of undermines that. (of course if someone names their guy Dicklord they probably don't care about the atmosphere anyway)
The chances of that happening are really low. I could lower the chances further with a LOT of work (introducing more names into the random name generator) but the amount of work it would take to GUARANTEE that none of the recruits had the same name would be vast and wildly incommensurate with the size of the problem.
Also, this is just a thing from off the top of my head, but I think it would be nice if the Kryllor's Mending spell (I think that's what it was called) was very slow--perhaps even guaranteed to go at the end of a round--but Dazed the character 100% of the time; to counteract this, there could exist a reduced-effectiveness healing spell that doesn't Daze (or at least has a far lower chance of it) but goes at a normal or increased speed. I say this because I felt sometimes like I'd rather just not heal and take my chances so as to avoid the possibility of accidentally preventing one of my guys from attacking/using a skill that round. Then again, I'm obviously not as well-acquainted with the game as you are, so maybe there's some way this would upset the balance that I'm overlooking/unaware of.
How you say it should be is actually exactly how it is once Healing Sisters (who have good speed) are thrown into the mix! For the interrim, remember you can give priority healing tasks to high-speed characters like Archers who go FIRST. Also, the higher the dexterity of your alchemists, the faster their heals go off.
I agree with Solitayre that it would be nice to get a flat XP/JP bonus at the end of a mission, even a relatively small one, because it adds a lot to the sense of satisfaction.
That's a great idea! (Solitayre said that?) It's kind of built into the bonus XP/JP for beating the bosses (like Urclaw) but I could make it into a separate "Mission Complete" type screen (nothing fancy) without increasing the actual amount very much.
Along the same lines, maybe Janos could start with one of his orders, considering he's not really new to being Captain. Even a weakened version of one of the JP-costing skills if nothing else. (Also, again just off the top of my head; maybe an order that decreases both incoming and outgoing crit%? Not sure if you can do that with the scripts you're using or anything though. And again this could upset balance in some way I'm unaware of.)
I will consider this, but I have my reasons for not wanting to do this (the funnest part of the game is learning skills and you can't learn skills you start with, and I have a limited pool of ideas for Janos skills) and I believe that Horace, Janos, and Grenn's experience is reflected in their superior starting stats even if they are the same level as everyone else.
Well I think that's about all I have to say right now! Wasn't expecting to type that much. I'm hoping this is all coherent because I'm not willing to read it over. Take my suggestions with a few dozen grains of salt, considering it is almost 1:30 AM and I'm not really double-checking anything I just said.
It was both coherent and refreshingly fair. Thank you.
I'm sorry you feel that way, Max. I never meant what I said in any negative way, and I know this is a lot more than just me, but does it bother you that much that your game isn't for everyone? Like I said, it's very likely a solid product in its own rite, and I believe every word you said about manhours spent testing, re-testing, and beta-testing the game. I believe everything you said about the perfectly-tuned difficulty and the testers' comments to that effect. I believe you about the stylistic choices in the writing (which is really a non-issue, I honestly feel comments to that effect have kinda degenerated into a "lol, Legion game, gotta have F--K F--K F--K!" of which I am also guilty, but I would never seriously lower my opinion on a game on something like that).
All that being said, is it really important to you to please people like Soli and I who aren't interested in that brand of difficulty? To that end I understand why you might feel it unfair that he post a review if he doesn't like the style of your game, but that's a fault of opinion and free speech, and your testers are welcome to give us more insight on their gameplay experiences in reviews of their own. If you'd really like to, we could discuss further my expectations of difficulty or acceptable standards, but I just don't feel it necessary, compared to Soli's comments and your taut responses to them. The "sweet spot" of difficulty is not universal, and while you may have achieved that in context to the style of gameplay in To Arms!, it's not going to be for everyone.
Let me be clear: I do not doubt the quality of To Arms! as you've described it. I believe every word you've said in its defense. In this tread, I have been provided with enough information to conclude that the game merely isn't one that I'd enjoy. And while I didn't need to create a wall of text explaining that, I wanted to give you the opportunity of witnessing the mindset behind how I came to that conclusion so that I could let you be the judge of whether or not it affects how you design or market your games.
Less importantly:
I acknowledge your accomplishments, and never meant to place you in a level amongst us who are truly amateurs, by definition. Setting aside technicalities and pride, I only meant to suggest that those here who aren't familiar with you and/or your published works are likely to view the game as any other on RMN: an amateur effort. I don't find amateur to be derogatory in any way, but I suppose if I had continued school and obtained a doctorate, I'd probably be a little disappointed when I wasn't addressed as doctor. Regardless, the opinion I gave above has nothing to do with you, and is out of your control, so please don't be disheartened by it.
Back on the topic of stylistic choices regarding dialogue, I want to de-emphasize the impact it really has on me. Yes, I watch movies, TV, read an occasional book, and even play an occasional game with cursing out the ears. I was de-sensitized to it a long time ago. As I got older and more mature, I actually began to re-sensitize. I'll explain, but know that this is just the opinion of a single individual and could be entirely ridiculous to yourself and others. Feel free to ignore.
I don't have unrealistic expectations for cursing and violence. Like you said, I expect stories about soldiers or other bromance ensembles like sports teams to obtain various levels of cursing. It's about immersion, you're supposed to believe characters are acting as they would in real life in the same circumstances. Sometimes it's done well, sometimes it isn't. In particular, there's the PG-13 phenomenon. Generally speaking, you're allowed one or two f-bombs in PG-13 movies without pressure to remove them (very few exceptions to this, like Hardball). Because of that, PG-13 movies always seem to have the one or two f-bombs almost out of obligation. See Yes Man as an example, one is bleeped out for cheap comedy which I thought was a little tasteless, and I think there's another in the movie given by Jim Carrey. Really, the movie isn't made any better by these words, and I think it detracts from the writing and the character, who spends another 90 minutes not saying the word.
You didn't address the fact that this particular case is medieval fantasy, probably because you expect the level of cursing to be the same amongst soldiers and mercenaries, which is fine. As a sidenote, I was also going to comment earlier that I'm not a big fan of made-up curses, or idioms for that matter. The content as a whole needs to be well-written and I need to be drawn in by everything else going on. Then, I will eventually accept the different vernacular (much like you mentioned with Shadowrun). Thing with medieval fantasy, or really anything else that isn't set in the modern world, is that you can define the limits yourself as to what's believable and what's not. I think we as consumers tend to follow archetypes to draw our own conclusions as to what and what isn't acceptable dialogue. For example, Lord of the Rings. The dialogue was written as the consumers might expect to hear from the characters, and the lines were delivered with a weight that also supports our expectations. Personally, I think the dialogue was much too dry and rigid. The only memorable performance was Gandalf, who often spoke and delivered his lines in a whimsical manner that was true to the books.
Anyway, my own thought on the matter is to not add cursing (heavier stuff) unless it's deeply characteristic (and this point is highly arguable, I can hear them now). I'd much prefer to get immersed in the characters by the meat of what they say, but to each his own. Max didn't do anything wrong, it's just a style choice. One screenshot comes to mind where Janos(?) says something like, "Well, what the F--K do you want me to do about it, eh?" It's a very natural sentence, something we'd expect just about any potty-mouth to say. I wonder, though, if "f--k" was left un-capitalized, would it suggest a different intonation? Something that flows uninhibited out of the mouth of a mercenary as easily as the the other words that construct the sentence? Depends on the context, I'm sure. Just a ramble, not a criticism.
All that being said, is it really important to you to please people like Soli and I who aren't interested in that brand of difficulty? To that end I understand why you might feel it unfair that he post a review if he doesn't like the style of your game, but that's a fault of opinion and free speech, and your testers are welcome to give us more insight on their gameplay experiences in reviews of their own. If you'd really like to, we could discuss further my expectations of difficulty or acceptable standards, but I just don't feel it necessary, compared to Soli's comments and your taut responses to them. The "sweet spot" of difficulty is not universal, and while you may have achieved that in context to the style of gameplay in To Arms!, it's not going to be for everyone.
Let me be clear: I do not doubt the quality of To Arms! as you've described it. I believe every word you've said in its defense. In this tread, I have been provided with enough information to conclude that the game merely isn't one that I'd enjoy. And while I didn't need to create a wall of text explaining that, I wanted to give you the opportunity of witnessing the mindset behind how I came to that conclusion so that I could let you be the judge of whether or not it affects how you design or market your games.
Less importantly:
I acknowledge your accomplishments, and never meant to place you in a level amongst us who are truly amateurs, by definition. Setting aside technicalities and pride, I only meant to suggest that those here who aren't familiar with you and/or your published works are likely to view the game as any other on RMN: an amateur effort. I don't find amateur to be derogatory in any way, but I suppose if I had continued school and obtained a doctorate, I'd probably be a little disappointed when I wasn't addressed as doctor. Regardless, the opinion I gave above has nothing to do with you, and is out of your control, so please don't be disheartened by it.
Back on the topic of stylistic choices regarding dialogue, I want to de-emphasize the impact it really has on me. Yes, I watch movies, TV, read an occasional book, and even play an occasional game with cursing out the ears. I was de-sensitized to it a long time ago. As I got older and more mature, I actually began to re-sensitize. I'll explain, but know that this is just the opinion of a single individual and could be entirely ridiculous to yourself and others. Feel free to ignore.
I don't have unrealistic expectations for cursing and violence. Like you said, I expect stories about soldiers or other bromance ensembles like sports teams to obtain various levels of cursing. It's about immersion, you're supposed to believe characters are acting as they would in real life in the same circumstances. Sometimes it's done well, sometimes it isn't. In particular, there's the PG-13 phenomenon. Generally speaking, you're allowed one or two f-bombs in PG-13 movies without pressure to remove them (very few exceptions to this, like Hardball). Because of that, PG-13 movies always seem to have the one or two f-bombs almost out of obligation. See Yes Man as an example, one is bleeped out for cheap comedy which I thought was a little tasteless, and I think there's another in the movie given by Jim Carrey. Really, the movie isn't made any better by these words, and I think it detracts from the writing and the character, who spends another 90 minutes not saying the word.
You didn't address the fact that this particular case is medieval fantasy, probably because you expect the level of cursing to be the same amongst soldiers and mercenaries, which is fine. As a sidenote, I was also going to comment earlier that I'm not a big fan of made-up curses, or idioms for that matter. The content as a whole needs to be well-written and I need to be drawn in by everything else going on. Then, I will eventually accept the different vernacular (much like you mentioned with Shadowrun). Thing with medieval fantasy, or really anything else that isn't set in the modern world, is that you can define the limits yourself as to what's believable and what's not. I think we as consumers tend to follow archetypes to draw our own conclusions as to what and what isn't acceptable dialogue. For example, Lord of the Rings. The dialogue was written as the consumers might expect to hear from the characters, and the lines were delivered with a weight that also supports our expectations. Personally, I think the dialogue was much too dry and rigid. The only memorable performance was Gandalf, who often spoke and delivered his lines in a whimsical manner that was true to the books.
Anyway, my own thought on the matter is to not add cursing (heavier stuff) unless it's deeply characteristic (and this point is highly arguable, I can hear them now). I'd much prefer to get immersed in the characters by the meat of what they say, but to each his own. Max didn't do anything wrong, it's just a style choice. One screenshot comes to mind where Janos(?) says something like, "Well, what the F--K do you want me to do about it, eh?" It's a very natural sentence, something we'd expect just about any potty-mouth to say. I wonder, though, if "f--k" was left un-capitalized, would it suggest a different intonation? Something that flows uninhibited out of the mouth of a mercenary as easily as the the other words that construct the sentence? Depends on the context, I'm sure. Just a ramble, not a criticism.

















