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Damage Reduction Change, Demo Coming Tomorrow
Red_Nova- 12/17/2017 03:16 PM
- 1763 views
Man, math sucks, don't you agree? Who honestly likes to do a bunch of calculations in your head when you're just trying to relax and have fun with a game? Based on the feedback I've gotten from you and some RL friends, most players seem to agree, and have offered an idea to reduce the mental load when trying to figure out a good strategy.
People have been asking for this for a long time, but I've been putting it off because I had no idea how to easily implement it. However, a few days ago, I stumbled across a way to implement this change with minimal frustrations. As I went on testing, I refined this method more and more until I was happy with the result. As such, I've decided to implement this into the game itself. The way Stamina reduces damage has now been tweaked to be easier to read at a glance.
In the old version, nonmagic damage was reduced by the combined values of a battler's Armor and Stamina. In this new system, damage will be reduced by the % of a battler's SP/maxSP. Take this battle in the prologue for example:
The Savage Wolf highlighted has roughly 50% of their SP remaining. Therefore, all nonmagic attacks, after being reduced by the enemy's Armor stat, will be cut in half. Foes with no SP remaining will take full damage from attacks, and enemies will shrug off attacks if they have full SP.
Not only does this simplify damage, but it also makes it easier to estimate at a glance how much damage you can do without investigating enemies individually. When using AOE moves like Mia's Lightning Draw, you can also get a rough estimate of how much damage you can do just by looking at the target's meters without having to do all that math in your head.
Oh, so I now know that Lightning Draw will do a lot of damage to the left enemy, but I should probably reduce the SP on the right enemy before using it. Man, I'm glad I didn't have to go to each enemy individually and do the math to see how much damage I'll do.
This helps balance out the cast and encourage teamwork, as well. Powerhouse characters like Aeyr won't be able to just wipe out enemies with strong single strikes, while physically weaker characters like Trill can still put in damage without taking the time to reduce enemy SP all the way.
"But Nova, can't that be exploited? Can't I just keep two party members at full SP and fight with the third one? Or maybe just chuck items that ignore SP damage while keeping myself super safe?"
No, you can't.
Remember, items are limited, and you often won't be able to backtrack and resupply every time you run low. As for using only one character, remember enemies will also use magic attacks that ignore SP damage reduction. So, while you turtle with high SP, enemies can still destroy you. Plus, it's been set so that characters with low SP are more likely to be targeted by enemies than characters with high SP. So while the other party members can shrug off damage, enemies will be tearing apart the character that has been exerting themselves trying to carry the entire fight.
DEMO:
You'll get to see this in action soon enough. I've finally finished putting the demo together. All that's left is to import all the RTP sound effects used and disable RTP requirements, and I'll be ready to release it. Expect the demo to come out TOMORROW!!
Thanks to everyone again for following this project! I'm really excited to let you play this new demo!
People have been asking for this for a long time, but I've been putting it off because I had no idea how to easily implement it. However, a few days ago, I stumbled across a way to implement this change with minimal frustrations. As I went on testing, I refined this method more and more until I was happy with the result. As such, I've decided to implement this into the game itself. The way Stamina reduces damage has now been tweaked to be easier to read at a glance.
In the old version, nonmagic damage was reduced by the combined values of a battler's Armor and Stamina. In this new system, damage will be reduced by the % of a battler's SP/maxSP. Take this battle in the prologue for example:
The Savage Wolf highlighted has roughly 50% of their SP remaining. Therefore, all nonmagic attacks, after being reduced by the enemy's Armor stat, will be cut in half. Foes with no SP remaining will take full damage from attacks, and enemies will shrug off attacks if they have full SP.
Not only does this simplify damage, but it also makes it easier to estimate at a glance how much damage you can do without investigating enemies individually. When using AOE moves like Mia's Lightning Draw, you can also get a rough estimate of how much damage you can do just by looking at the target's meters without having to do all that math in your head.
Oh, so I now know that Lightning Draw will do a lot of damage to the left enemy, but I should probably reduce the SP on the right enemy before using it. Man, I'm glad I didn't have to go to each enemy individually and do the math to see how much damage I'll do.
This helps balance out the cast and encourage teamwork, as well. Powerhouse characters like Aeyr won't be able to just wipe out enemies with strong single strikes, while physically weaker characters like Trill can still put in damage without taking the time to reduce enemy SP all the way.
"But Nova, can't that be exploited? Can't I just keep two party members at full SP and fight with the third one? Or maybe just chuck items that ignore SP damage while keeping myself super safe?"
No, you can't.
Remember, items are limited, and you often won't be able to backtrack and resupply every time you run low. As for using only one character, remember enemies will also use magic attacks that ignore SP damage reduction. So, while you turtle with high SP, enemies can still destroy you. Plus, it's been set so that characters with low SP are more likely to be targeted by enemies than characters with high SP. So while the other party members can shrug off damage, enemies will be tearing apart the character that has been exerting themselves trying to carry the entire fight.
DEMO:
You'll get to see this in action soon enough. I've finally finished putting the demo together. All that's left is to import all the RTP sound effects used and disable RTP requirements, and I'll be ready to release it. Expect the demo to come out TOMORROW!!
Thanks to everyone again for following this project! I'm really excited to let you play this new demo!
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CloseStamina in this game is beginning to remind me more and more of what I did for shields in Myriad Cypher. There are some differences, of course. In that game, "Shield Strength" was it's own stat, and a percent value of that stat was added to the defense-side of the equation, depending on how much energy the defender had. So, that game's damage calculation ultimately looked something like...
...that, depending on what was used.
Aside: Darigaaz, the post preview that included the code-tag looked horrendous.
(a.mat * 3) - (b.def + (b.mdf * b.mp / b.mmp))
# or...
(a.atk * 3) - (b.def + (b.mdf * b.mp / b.mmp))
...that, depending on what was used.
Aside: Darigaaz, the post preview that included the code-tag looked horrendous.
Red_Nova
Sir Redd of Novus: He who made Prayer of the Faithless that one time, and that was pretty dang rad! :D
9192
Wow that's really complicated! The formulas in PotF are much simpler. Most damage formulas are like this:
And replace atk and def depending on the attack property. That alone should let you predict the amount of damage you can do, since enemies will have varying Armor and SP stats.
The biggest detraction for me was the fact that I would have had to go into every single damage formula and edit the SP reduction. However, thanks to a new method in the Battler class, it's very easy to adjust the SP reduction once and have it apply to all skills.
You'd think I'd know something that basic since I've been coding for over 6 years now. Obvious solutions tend to fly over my head easily.
(a.atk * 1 - b.def) * (1- (b.mp/b.mmp))
And replace atk and def depending on the attack property. That alone should let you predict the amount of damage you can do, since enemies will have varying Armor and SP stats.
The biggest detraction for me was the fact that I would have had to go into every single damage formula and edit the SP reduction. However, thanks to a new method in the Battler class, it's very easy to adjust the SP reduction once and have it apply to all skills.
You'd think I'd know something that basic since I've been coding for over 6 years now. Obvious solutions tend to fly over my head easily.
Crystalgate
694
A complicated damage formula is not necessarily harder to use than a simple one. Sometimes it's even the opposite, you need a complicated formula to get it to do what you want it to do. As far as players goes, it's usually more a question of wether or not things work as is implied rather than how simple the formulas are. For example, a significant investment in raising your defense should result in a significant decrease in damage taken while a low investment should have a low impact. If this is true, the player will be able to decide wether they should invest in defense or something else even without knowing the formulas.
Anyway, this is a huge change. It greatly alters what is effective and what is not. For example, having a high max SP will no longer affect your defenses. Mia and Luke in particular gained a significant boost to durability on account of having a high max SP. Armor will also be less effective unless altered to compensate for the changes. On the other hand, it means that the SP reduction you take from equipping heavy armor no longer affects your defenses.
This is just the tip of the iceberg. Well, that makes a new playtrough more interesting since I'll need a new strategy. I wonder if the new meta is better or worse than the old one.
Anyway, this is a huge change. It greatly alters what is effective and what is not. For example, having a high max SP will no longer affect your defenses. Mia and Luke in particular gained a significant boost to durability on account of having a high max SP. Armor will also be less effective unless altered to compensate for the changes. On the other hand, it means that the SP reduction you take from equipping heavy armor no longer affects your defenses.
This is just the tip of the iceberg. Well, that makes a new playtrough more interesting since I'll need a new strategy. I wonder if the new meta is better or worse than the old one.
Red_Nova
Sir Redd of Novus: He who made Prayer of the Faithless that one time, and that was pretty dang rad! :D
9192
A complicated damage formula is not necessarily harder to use than a simple one. Sometimes it's even the opposite, you need a complicated formula to get it to do what you want it to do. As far as players goes, it's usually more a question of wether or not things work as is implied rather than how simple the formulas are. For example, a significant investment in raising your defense should result in a significant decrease in damage taken while a low investment should have a low impact. If this is true, the player will be able to decide wether they should invest in defense or something else even without knowing the formulas.
Yeah, that's true. It really depends on how intricate the player needs to be with the calculations.
Anyway, this is a huge change. It greatly alters what is effective and what is not. For example, having a high max SP will no longer affect your defenses. Mia and Luke in particular gained a significant boost to durability on account of having a high max SP.
A large SP pool can still lead to more durability. When you're trying to wear down an opponent's SP with Guard Break skills, you'll have to burn through more SP to get the desired vulnerability out of the enemy. The same is true for party members.
Armor will also be less effective unless altered to compensate for the changes. On the other hand, it means that the SP reduction you take from equipping heavy armor no longer affects your defenses.
In terms of raw numbers, you are correct. However, in practice, heavy armor must be used effectively by the player just like light armor. For example, if you decide to load down a character like Amalie with heavy armor and reduce her SP to something low like 4, yeah, you'll definitely be able to shrug off most physical attacks. However, since enemies now tend to attack allies who exert lots of SP, Amalie will be blatantly ignored while enemies tear apart the rest of the vulnerable party, even if Amalie is boosted by Provoke. You can up the chance of Amalie being targeted by forcing her to use her SP to increase her chances of being targeted, but then she won't be deflecting enemy attacks and will have to rely only on her armor stat.
With the lowered SP the character gets from heavy armor, their actions will greatly increase their chance of being targeted.
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