LET'S DISCUSS FALLOUT 4 - SPOILERS (OBVIOUSLY)

Posts

I renamed my pistol the Devastator because it is pretty good at laying the hurt after I modded it a bunch. Sadly, I don't have much sniper ammo so I have to be careful with what I snipe, but afaik the bot doesn't move - I turned it on in the LP version and it just sat there. Even went up to it just asked me not to interfere, so I figured 'don't piss off the unstable robot libby' and moved on, leaving it to it.

Yeah, I flame-decaled the second suit because, hell, why not? It does look pretty cool-ish. I want it more decals! Also, you can unlock more items to make in your bases by filling side-quests for people, I found. Mama druggie wanted a chair made for her and it unlocked a neat-looking chair that I can now build when-ever I like. I'm hoping that there's a fair few of those kinds of things because that would be cool.

I was also hoping for the ability to find house schematics for building different shacks and house presets - that'd be cool. It'd be hella cool if you could get someone to check out various house types in your settlements and then give you schematics for them. It's fun how it is, but I can see ways for the system to go deeper.

Currently I rock a pistol and shot-gun mix, with some sniper fire when necessary.
Roden
who could forget dear ratboy
3857
author=Shinan
I meant about Pizza's specific grievances with the endgame.


Coming right up.

Endgame Spoilers:

Near the beginning and middle the story is actually really interesting. You hear about the Institute, and you see their Terminator robots and get into fights with them, and the game starts building up this story about their mysterious motivations that I was really in to. I wanted to know what their end goal with the Synths was, cause I figured it must be something pretty cool.

You meet Virgil and hunt down the Courser, and things are really starting to build up at this point. There's some great atmosphere and foreshadowing going on- although you can sort of see the cracks coming through when Virgil doesn't even seem to know anything about the Institute besides "they're the Institute". So you fight more Raiders (AKA the new Draugr) and get the stupid brain chip thing from the disappointing Courser fight. Woohoo.

Virgil gives you the plans for the Relay device, and you build it in your town, which is a good use of the town building mechanic. I liked it. I was hyped to finally get to the end game, and kind of expecting something like Raven Rock from 3, so I stocked up on ammo and supplies. Warping into the Institute everything seems like it's gonna pay off, with the mysterious "Father" talking to you and cool art design of the area.

Then you meet Father. He likes you, no, he's your son for some reason. I still thought it was going somewhere, so I was into it. Your son is the final boss? Pretty cool, right? Then he asks you to join the Institute.

And here we go. Here's the problem. There's no fucking endgame.

Nothing happens. You join the stupid Institute because the game doesn't really explain anything that's going on anymore, and you get sent to kill... Raiders. So you go do it, and then the game is like "NOW YOU SEE THE INSTITUTE'S TRUE VALUES", like, no, I fucking don't. EXPLAIN IT TO ME. The game proceeds to just be as confusing and vague as it possibly can be for the short remainder of its play time. Why are they building Synths? Genetic Purity? Okay, that's a word they throw around about Shaun, but it doesn't explain why they're sending Synths out to kill people in the Commonwealth. Why did they make a 10 year old Shaun Synth? To fuck with you? To replace Shaun and get you to leave them alone? Obviously not, since Father Shaun tells you he was hoping you found him. As it stands they pretty much made the 10 year old Synth to cover up a plot hole.

Why did they bother extending Kellogg's life for another 60 years? Sure, he was a good mercenary, but wouldn't it have made more sense to replace him with a Synth? If they can extend people's lives, then why are they worried about Father Shaun dying from an illness? (which is convieniently never explained at all other than a shoehorned way to put you in charge of the Institute as it's Guild Leader and hand the player more candy for nothing).

This is the issue. There's nothing going on in the endgame. The game doesn't care what you say, because there's no reason to say anything- side with them, side against them, it doesn't matter because all the guild missions lead to the same place anyways and the same foregone conclusion of "this is really fucking badly written, and super disappointing".

And like, the last mission is just... What? It's nothing. You just get some nuclear material to keep powering the Institute. There's no interesting morality or world affecting choice going on, even though the game acts like the Mass Fusion thing is going somewhere really important. You're basically just out getting the fucking groceries at this point. You have no fucking stake in anything. You're just a player, doing mission checklists because the game told you to. They don't even pretend to give you a reason to care anymore, because they're more concerned with their "No level cap, play forever!" shtick.

I would have liked some more development of the Institute. Give the player a reason to distrust them. Show them being evil, if you're building them up as villains so clearly. Have you make difficult choices about your now adult son, if you're forcing the player into the narrative of a grieving parent and taking away their ability to role-play it at all. Do SOMETHING with the world you created, not just throwing enemy hordes at people so they can grind levels for "fun".

AAA games don't even give a fucking shit about interesting experiences anymore. They give you the most bland, surface level, marketable "fun" stuff like Gun Building and Settling the Wasteland, then don't develop it because they're scared that 10% of the populace won't like the game if it's too in depth. They're scared to put effort and love into their work, or really let their ideas grow and take off, and it shows when the whole thing falls to fucking pieces because of it.

So yeah, I'm not buying And Fallout or Elder Scrolls stuff anymore. After Skyrim and Fallout 4 it's fucking pointless, cause they clearly don't give a shit about making anything good or fulfilling beyond marketing based box features at this point.


I probably didn't explain as well as I could, since I just did a stream of consciousness about it. I'd have to really sit down and analyze the game to get a good read, and maybe at some point I'll take the time to do that for the big name Bethesda properties of late that have been hollow, AKA Skyrim and Fallout 4.
Don't get me started on the walls. Sometimes I'll have them just so and they will still be red. Move them just across a tiny bit and there's a fucking hole between the two walls. >.<;

Also filing cabinets are a bitch to place against walls. They just won't do it. Annoying! Lucky it's fun, though.

@pizza - I probably won't check that hide tag for a while. Like I said, I've yet to complete the stories of Skyrim and Fallout 3 yet (and luckily not yet been spoiled for either!!!) so it may take a while for me to get to the end of the storyline. I will actually do it, though, since the LP will be following the story (one reason I started it was to make sure I finished the story at least in this game).
Hmm. Sounds like they fell into the ancient hole of just don't giving a shit and being bad writers.
http://imgur.com/gallery/LbwYR
I'm just gonna post this here to show some of the fun shit you can run into if you don't go in guns blazing. Some of the writing is just so well done and interesting. XD
Roden
who could forget dear ratboy
3857
Well, I'm glad they put so much effort into those little conversations that most people will never hear. Shame they didn't do that for the rest of it.
I can practically smell the salt from here~ XD
Roden
who could forget dear ratboy
3857
Pizza is a very salty food, after all.
salty is as salty does. ^.^
I blew up three times today. Twice to the same damn explosive. The first time I survived super mutants only to be taken down by mosquitoes and (and a mine/granade - I think it might have been an ambush by raiders at the same time as the mozzies). XD

It's fun to just follow traders on the road, though. You get to see so many neat new sites you didn't before, and they lead you to settlements you might have missed, which is cool. I'm having fun just roaming the land, providing protection like a good little do-gooder, my attack dog at my side... even if he did set off a mine that one time. :/
Hahahahahahaha

Followers are always the worst.
Ratty524
The 524 is for 524 Stone Crabs
12986
That dog did it on purpose.

I don't know if I should go by what anyone is saying in this thread because I haven't played any Fallout game ever.
You know... you can tell the dog to stay and they will...


I ran into my first major bug and it's a doozy! Yay!

Basically, I had three power armour. One full, one almost full and one that I'd removed all the armour from in order to fill up the second one. Anyway, I'd just made a dedicated area for the armours and was moving them into it one at a time. Got into the frame armour and... could not get out. At all.

So, clever person than I am, I decided to jump in another armour and see if I'd get out of the frame to get in the other. Ha. ha. ha. No. It didn't get out at all - I climbed into the armour with my frame still on. And now I've lost the frame - which I can deal with - but I also cannot see my Pip-Boy unless I'm in power armour.

I googled and found a few fixes and tried them out to no avail. Unfortunately, there's no way to get my pip-boy back, so instead I have to wander everywhere with my power armour - the one thing I didn't want to do. >.<;
Max McGee
with sorrow down past the fence
9159
Nice one, Dogmeat. Brilliantly done.

I fucking love this game. The amount of content available seems absolutely staggering and the variety of playstyles available makes playing even the same content over and over again different ways very palatable. I am super hooked (I logged like 8 hours today) and only see myself getting more hooked over time.

For those that don't know, that's John Cena.

I literally thought it was the "son I am disappoint" meme guy.

So right now I am walking my main PC to Level 24, when second and third PCs are at Level 18 I'm going to start my fourth and final character and get him to Level 12. I've set up a rotation of sorts. I haven't gotten any further than the Memory Den on my furthest penetration of the main plot.

Character I: Wyatt, Intelligence/Science
Character II: Marc, Strength/Endurance melee beast. Essentially Guts from Berserk. In the Wasteland.
Character III: Anne. Agility/Perception sneaky sniper lady. Most efficient build so far, for sure.
Character IV: Strand. Charisma monster. Based on the Fear The Walking Dead character of the same name. Not yet built.

As of right now I am playing on Hard and generally finding the game substantially too easy which is a first for me. I'm not normally that guy, you know? Normally, Normal is plenty hard for me. I played New Vegas on "Hardcore" because I found it much more immersive, but I don't think I often took the actual difficulty setting above normal. I didn't have this problem until I got good at playing which took a few dozen hours. Does it get harder again later on?

Because right now it's doing that weird Bethesda/open world thing that sometimes happens where the beginning was pretty rough but it got easier later on. My main character can afford and source enough Fusion Cores to just operate his power armor continuously which feels like cheating. My third character is an Agility/Perception sneak sniper and she is a preposterously efficient killing machine. The only thing holding her back is that silencers/suppressors for most guns don't unlock until a relatively high level, due to the arbitrary level restrictions on every level of the all-important Gun Nut perk.

Disclaimer: I am playing this on console, as I have every single Bethesda Elder Scrolls/Fallout game. I know, I know, PC people, I'm doing it wrong. But if I gave myself access to mods, I think I'd literally never do anything else.

Anyway, this is what's really bothering me about the game:

Having played male and female characters...Why the frak is everyone you can travel with presumably bisexual?

Sidenote: they seem to have put all of the companion/romance stuff way more "up-front" than in previous Fallout games. I played dozens of hours of New Vegas before finding more than one or two companions, and as far as I can remember in my hundreds of hours of playing previous Fallout titles I have never successfully "relationship'd" anyone. It seems way more "front and center" here, more of a "feature" and less of an obscure, easily-missable easter egg.

Or I guess more accurately, "player-sexual". Don't get me wrong, I have nothing against bisexual people. My girlfriend and my best friend are both bi. And I haven't found every companion yet, I'm sure. Maybe there's someone squirreled away that's actually straight or actually gay or even asexual (besides I assume/hope to God Codsworth).

But it seems really ridiculous to me the game's assumption that everyone you meet is "flexible" based on your actions and your charisma. The attempt seems to be to give the player more options but the result for me is that it confuses things in a way that kills immersion. I am fine with keeping relationships with companions platonic. I don't need this Bioshock romance crap. I am fine with having it as an option for some characters but having that big "Flirt" option pop up with every companion as their story progresses is distracting as fuck. I mean, is Paladin Danse so wooden because he has no idea how to have human emotions anymore underneath all of that bravado and powered armor, or is he just a gay man with a big gay crush on me playing coy? The "Flirt" option certainly muddies the waters a bit.

I decided from the outset that poor dead Nate was the last man that my pre-War lady sniper would ever love, and when I failed the flirt check with Piper I had no idea if her sexual orientation was a factor or if I just didn't have enough points in Charisma.

Having played a little more but still not consummated any relationships with any companions, I am starting to understand that "sexual orientation" is kind of a null concept here.

And I am not sure what is up with the difficulty values for the Charisma check to "flirt" in relation to this. The idea that a guy is going to go gay for another guy (or for that matter that a lesbian is suddenly going to get weak at the knees for a dude) if they're just charismatic enough is actually borderline offensive. That's...not how it fucking works. I ain't gonna fuck a dude, no matter how charismatic he is. The same goes for my lesbian friends.

If Danse was straight or Piper was a lesbian or whatever they would feel more like actual characters or actual people and less like "romance options". (The option to flirt with Nick Valentine hasn't come up yet, and I'm honestly hoping it won't, regardless of my character's gender, because come on people, why would he even have genitals?)

TL;DR some characters should be straight or gay instead of everyone being conveniently bisexual. Characters having actual identities, including SEXUAL identities, would be less damaging to immersion than having everyone "available to romance" all the time, which sure as hell gets in the way of building actual characters when you have to make everyone transparently "player-sexual".


Unrelated note: so where are all the prostitutes? Is this a Fallout game or what?

Fair warning, this table just spoilered me hard. But it also allayed a few of my concerns. I didn't check it because I was super pissed about the "romance anyone" thing or anything, it's just that my third and forth characters are not supposed to be nice people so I was looking for where to find the companions that don't like it so darn much when you're NICE to people.

Edit 2: You know what, just don't click that table. It has an almost toxic concentration of spoilers. I got freaking whammied by it.

Edit 3:
*spends 45 minutes talking about Fallout 4*
* loses 45 minutes of playing Fallout 4*

d'oh!
Maybe they're just pan. More about the person than the gender. So, meaning, they're exactly as you said - player-sexual. Frankly, I have no qualms about that at all.