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WHY ARE WE SO FAR APART?
Posts
JosephSeraph
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Closethis is a translation from a facebook text i posted right now after bursting in tears:
"The internet is wonderful, but in the end it is so detrimental to human contact...
People are vulnerable beings, filled with thoughts, anxieties, affection, dreams and fears. They express themselves with words, but also with their voice, their gaze, their breathing, their tempo, gestures, posture, habits. In any live conversation, daily, words are responsible to just a fraction of the communication there happening, even if the mass of the information ends up being unconsciously stored, us unaware to it.
Isolating people on a world where they're already alone. meticulous, calculated writing. fears and anxieties hidden deep within carefl prose, sentiments becoming hard to prove or even show. People become meme machines, their persons being atrophiated to just their effervescent political views, sense of humor and fitting in different social patterns. All patters, by the way, including so called anti-normative people.
Everyone, so distant. Everything, so cold. I speak of the internet, but it is evident that the whole of the world is like that. And it hurts.
It hurts to know so many people's names, but in the end not knowing anyone. no one knows who I am. I'm jo, an artsy boy who sometimes looks and acts like a girl, who is nice and sometimes overly emotional, likes to cheer people up and can disappear and avoid social contact. Me. That's probably everyone's picture of me.
BUT NO. I AM SO
MUCH
MORE
THAN
THAT
ALL OF YOU
ARE SO MUCH MORE
THAN THAT
IT'S INSANE. IT'S JUST INSANE.
Everyone, alone. Living an illusion of connection based on social comes-and-goes.
One is a feminist. The other is a right-wing. The other is a gamergate thingie.
One is a fan of beyoncé, the other is a fan of shakugan no shana. (i couldn't localize this part too well, sorry)
There's nothing wrong or strange in being any of these things.
But isn't it sad? Be known as only that? Nobody knowing who you are, beyond your tastes and socially programmed behaviour?
(this part is personal but still kinda relevant)
And you? How do you feel? I must be being silly. maybe it's my age. Maybe its hormones, maybe i should go to the psychiatrician. Sorry.
I'm just tired of being alone.
"The internet is wonderful, but in the end it is so detrimental to human contact...
People are vulnerable beings, filled with thoughts, anxieties, affection, dreams and fears. They express themselves with words, but also with their voice, their gaze, their breathing, their tempo, gestures, posture, habits. In any live conversation, daily, words are responsible to just a fraction of the communication there happening, even if the mass of the information ends up being unconsciously stored, us unaware to it.
Isolating people on a world where they're already alone. meticulous, calculated writing. fears and anxieties hidden deep within carefl prose, sentiments becoming hard to prove or even show. People become meme machines, their persons being atrophiated to just their effervescent political views, sense of humor and fitting in different social patterns. All patters, by the way, including so called anti-normative people.
Everyone, so distant. Everything, so cold. I speak of the internet, but it is evident that the whole of the world is like that. And it hurts.
It hurts to know so many people's names, but in the end not knowing anyone. no one knows who I am. I'm jo, an artsy boy who sometimes looks and acts like a girl, who is nice and sometimes overly emotional, likes to cheer people up and can disappear and avoid social contact. Me. That's probably everyone's picture of me.
BUT NO. I AM SO
MUCH
MORE
THAN
THAT
ALL OF YOU
ARE SO MUCH MORE
THAN THAT
IT'S INSANE. IT'S JUST INSANE.
Everyone, alone. Living an illusion of connection based on social comes-and-goes.
One is a feminist. The other is a right-wing. The other is a gamergate thingie.
One is a fan of beyoncé, the other is a fan of shakugan no shana. (i couldn't localize this part too well, sorry)
There's nothing wrong or strange in being any of these things.
But isn't it sad? Be known as only that? Nobody knowing who you are, beyond your tastes and socially programmed behaviour?
(this part is personal but still kinda relevant)
Only one, only one person...
...
...That's all I want. To share who I am with a single only person.
I love myself. I'm a complete person. I love my kinda failed sense of humor, my caring of others, i understand and accept my failures, working them out. I love how I laugh and cry for very little, and how sensitive I am to random things that happen during the day.I admire my strength and capability to hunt after my dreams with no stop, even if I do falter.
I love myself, and I can't put it into words. That's the point.
I'm complete. But the only person who knows the complete me, who cares about knowing, in fact... is me.
...
...That's all I want. To share who I am with a single only person.
I love myself. I'm a complete person. I love my kinda failed sense of humor, my caring of others, i understand and accept my failures, working them out. I love how I laugh and cry for very little, and how sensitive I am to random things that happen during the day.I admire my strength and capability to hunt after my dreams with no stop, even if I do falter.
I love myself, and I can't put it into words. That's the point.
I'm complete. But the only person who knows the complete me, who cares about knowing, in fact... is me.
And you? How do you feel? I must be being silly. maybe it's my age. Maybe its hormones, maybe i should go to the psychiatrician. Sorry.
I'm just tired of being alone.
*huuuugs*
So true. This can true for any social contact .. but it doesn't have to be. I love being a social butterfly and talking to strangers when I can (I had my downtime, but I am going back to it). There is a street artist I talk to every now and then, the staff of my favorite restaurant (and various guests), random other students. Small talk and little bits are not enough to get to truly know a person. And I believe that is alright!
There is all kinds of different depths in friendship, companionship or just regard for one another as fellow human beings. However, really getting to know each other takes effort, earnest curiosity and honesty.
The internet has this appearance especially because it has a great comfort - never before could you reach out to anyone at your leisure at any given location at any given time. People gather for the same topics, interests or broader fields. You could find people you really connect well with, who are similar to you. Yet it is easiest to just stay platonic and ride along.
Some people do not seek deeper contact because they have that with their irl friends already. Some are afraid of it, some just skip it etc etc..
The tools are there, and social contact is all about making yourself vulnerable and open up different parts of you - just like you're doing right now, Jo. It already tells us a little bit more about you and how you feel about things.
I think .. we are constantly discovering little details about ourselves and other people, we are changing in smaller or bigger ways and witnessing this process alone and being part of it, is an exhilerating thing. There are only few friends I have grown close to.. and really only one I grew very close to online, and it takes work, and you end up fighting and crying, and laughing and smiling .. sharing and caring. And it's just really awesome. There are bad times but it all comes down to love and respect for one another.
Being seen is a huge driven force to me, and so is seeing and understanding others. And not having that is indeed very sad .. I still feel lonely a lot, and there are many things that aren't going well just yet. I won't be able to finish university as I am right now, nor will I be able to work, but I am getting there day by day. Reaching out to more people as well .. opening up to more people and just having fun out there.
But .. I know I have people caring about me, people who know me well, however few they may be, and I don't care if they don't "fully" understand every part of me. I am eternally grateful and thankful for that. It's the biggest blessing I had in my life. I can be so many many things, so that's okay. The fact they stay curious and open to whatever it is I can be is more than enough.
We .. are just born as social creatures :) and it's "easy" to not reach out to people, but it makes you happy when you do
So true. This can true for any social contact .. but it doesn't have to be. I love being a social butterfly and talking to strangers when I can (I had my downtime, but I am going back to it). There is a street artist I talk to every now and then, the staff of my favorite restaurant (and various guests), random other students. Small talk and little bits are not enough to get to truly know a person. And I believe that is alright!
There is all kinds of different depths in friendship, companionship or just regard for one another as fellow human beings. However, really getting to know each other takes effort, earnest curiosity and honesty.
The internet has this appearance especially because it has a great comfort - never before could you reach out to anyone at your leisure at any given location at any given time. People gather for the same topics, interests or broader fields. You could find people you really connect well with, who are similar to you. Yet it is easiest to just stay platonic and ride along.
Some people do not seek deeper contact because they have that with their irl friends already. Some are afraid of it, some just skip it etc etc..
The tools are there, and social contact is all about making yourself vulnerable and open up different parts of you - just like you're doing right now, Jo. It already tells us a little bit more about you and how you feel about things.
I think .. we are constantly discovering little details about ourselves and other people, we are changing in smaller or bigger ways and witnessing this process alone and being part of it, is an exhilerating thing. There are only few friends I have grown close to.. and really only one I grew very close to online, and it takes work, and you end up fighting and crying, and laughing and smiling .. sharing and caring. And it's just really awesome. There are bad times but it all comes down to love and respect for one another.
Being seen is a huge driven force to me, and so is seeing and understanding others. And not having that is indeed very sad .. I still feel lonely a lot, and there are many things that aren't going well just yet. I won't be able to finish university as I am right now, nor will I be able to work, but I am getting there day by day. Reaching out to more people as well .. opening up to more people and just having fun out there.
But .. I know I have people caring about me, people who know me well, however few they may be, and I don't care if they don't "fully" understand every part of me. I am eternally grateful and thankful for that. It's the biggest blessing I had in my life. I can be so many many things, so that's okay. The fact they stay curious and open to whatever it is I can be is more than enough.
We .. are just born as social creatures :) and it's "easy" to not reach out to people, but it makes you happy when you do
Sooz
They told me I was mad when I said I was going to create a spidertable. Who’s laughing now!!!
5354
Lemme clue y'all in: differing levels of intimacy are a normal part of everyday life, and nothing about the extra nonverbal details in the real world prevent people from slotting one another into little boxes.
While it's not a good idea to have one's social interactions ONLY on the internet, it's not some great deprivation that's doomed humanity to a loss of connection.
Hell, I'm a lot more open on the internet than in real life, because social anxiety makes it harder for me to communicate in realtime meat space. Give me the ability to think, arrange my thoughts, and type them out, and I can actually communicate! (Granted, I'm fairly reserved in general about personal subjects for various reasons, but still! Communicating! Socializing! Without major levels of dread!)
If you're feeling disconnected to other people, all you have to do is talk to them. PMs exist. Email exists. You can have as much or as little contact with others, online or off, as you choose to.
While it's not a good idea to have one's social interactions ONLY on the internet, it's not some great deprivation that's doomed humanity to a loss of connection.
Hell, I'm a lot more open on the internet than in real life, because social anxiety makes it harder for me to communicate in realtime meat space. Give me the ability to think, arrange my thoughts, and type them out, and I can actually communicate! (Granted, I'm fairly reserved in general about personal subjects for various reasons, but still! Communicating! Socializing! Without major levels of dread!)
If you're feeling disconnected to other people, all you have to do is talk to them. PMs exist. Email exists. You can have as much or as little contact with others, online or off, as you choose to.
^^ Truth. *chuckle* You do it, you get it.
It felt daunting for a long time, but it's just a matter of convenience.
It felt daunting for a long time, but it's just a matter of convenience.
SnowOwl
5188
The point of life isn't necessarily to find someone that gets you.
Maybe you should try going outside. There's a whole new world there.
Maybe you should try going outside. There's a whole new world there.
Corfaisus
"It's frustrating because - as much as Corf is otherwise an irredeemable person - his 2k/3 mapping is on point." ~ psy_wombats
7874
"All seek inner peace out of life, though the path and what exactly that peace details is something only we can decide for ourselves. Regardless if this be of the Divine or otherwise, all life strives towards and end that those who live would deem significant."
Someone else's answer might not be the one for you. Find your own answer and pursue it. If you feel like you're alone and you want someone to communicate with, go out and find somebody.
And no one will truly understand who you are no matter how much you try to communicate every piece of you; most times, we don't even fully understand ourselves. You can't be disappointed by such things.
Someone else's answer might not be the one for you. Find your own answer and pursue it. If you feel like you're alone and you want someone to communicate with, go out and find somebody.
And no one will truly understand who you are no matter how much you try to communicate every piece of you; most times, we don't even fully understand ourselves. You can't be disappointed by such things.
author=Sooz
Hell, I'm a lot more open on the internet than in real life, because social anxiety makes it harder for me to communicate in realtime meat space. Give me the ability to think, arrange my thoughts, and type them out, and I can actually communicate! (Granted, I'm fairly reserved in general about personal subjects for various reasons, but still! Communicating! Socializing! Without major levels of dread!)
Isn't this part of the issue that Jo is bringing up, or maybe I'm misinterpreting his post?
The internet is kind of a means of cheating real life. You can start and end conversations as you please with the minimal impacts of consequence. You don't even have to act like yourself.
Like, what you are describing right now, and it's something I may be going through myself given how often I come to this site daily, is the compulsion to use the internet over conventional, real-time means of social interaction, and it results from having a difficulty your ability to communicate in those real-time environments. In this case, I feel like we're simply using the internet to account for something we are deprived of in life, and is that even right?
Eh, I like both. Why can't we have both? I'm gonna have both.
At the end of the day you have choices. How you live is up to you so make a choice or two and don't blame some vague fear of whatever on how you chose to live and interact with others. We're here because we like to be, but it's a choice to be here and one that you can decide to change. So if you want to go out and meet new physical people, do it. I mean, really now. :/
Like, really, even knowing people IRL doesn't guarantee you get to know more of them than you do on the internet. People hide shit IRL that they won't on the internet. How many people do you ~really~ know? I don't even know my family that well and I've lived with them all my life. Like, seriously, touch and sight aren't the be-all, end-all to knowing people. They can give you some extra information, sure, but people lie with their appearances and body language too. A person can hug you and hate you despite that fact.
You can never really know all of a person. Ever.
Not even if you could read minds - people do shit that surprise themselves all the time, what hope does an outsider to the mind have to understand a person when they don't even understand themselves or know themselves completely? None. Don't get so riled up about not knowing everything about everyone, you'll just drive yourself insane.
People will lie, people will cheat and will hurt you and will be wonderful and be silly and funny and awesome and whatever where ever you meet them, so it's not a big deal.
At the end of the day you have choices. How you live is up to you so make a choice or two and don't blame some vague fear of whatever on how you chose to live and interact with others. We're here because we like to be, but it's a choice to be here and one that you can decide to change. So if you want to go out and meet new physical people, do it. I mean, really now. :/
Like, really, even knowing people IRL doesn't guarantee you get to know more of them than you do on the internet. People hide shit IRL that they won't on the internet. How many people do you ~really~ know? I don't even know my family that well and I've lived with them all my life. Like, seriously, touch and sight aren't the be-all, end-all to knowing people. They can give you some extra information, sure, but people lie with their appearances and body language too. A person can hug you and hate you despite that fact.
You can never really know all of a person. Ever.
Not even if you could read minds - people do shit that surprise themselves all the time, what hope does an outsider to the mind have to understand a person when they don't even understand themselves or know themselves completely? None. Don't get so riled up about not knowing everything about everyone, you'll just drive yourself insane.
People will lie, people will cheat and will hurt you and will be wonderful and be silly and funny and awesome and whatever where ever you meet them, so it's not a big deal.
LockeZ
I'd really like to get rid of LockeZ. His play style is way too unpredictable. He's always like this too. If he ran a country, he'd just kill and imprison people at random until crime stopped.
5958
You blame a communication tool, which lets you express yourself to people that you couldn't otherwise, on the fact that you don't feel you're adequately expressing yourself to people. Absurd. It is not the internet that's flawed, it's you.
Sooz
They told me I was mad when I said I was going to create a spidertable. Who’s laughing now!!!
5354
author=Ratty524
The internet is kind of a means of cheating real life. You can start and end conversations as you please with the minimal impacts of consequence. You don't even have to act like yourself.
1) The "minimal consequence" thing only applies in certain situations, and/or if you're not planning on returning to a particular area.
2) You can do all this stuff IRL as well.
Like, what you are describing right now, and it's something I may be going through myself given how often I come to this site daily, is the compulsion to use the internet over conventional, real-time means of social interaction, and it results from having a difficulty your ability to communicate in those real-time environments. In this case, I feel like we're simply using the internet to account for something we are deprived of in life, and is that even right?
I never said I don't socialize IRL,* I just think that people forget that most of the "problems" of internet socialization are neither new nor inherent to the internet. Before we had internet, we had the telephone and letters, and those had the same lack of nonverbals as we deal with now.
* IN FACT:
author=Sooz
While it's not a good idea to have one's social interactions ONLY on the internet, it's not some great deprivation that's doomed humanity to a loss of connection.
LockeZ
I'd really like to get rid of LockeZ. His play style is way too unpredictable. He's always like this too. If he ran a country, he'd just kill and imprison people at random until crime stopped.
5958
The internet has made real life obsolete.
Loneliness is a state of mind....in this day and age, you're never truly alone - even if you want to be.
It's a bit harsh, but I agree with LockeZ on this one, Jo. You should probably have a think about what it really is that's making you feel so...distant.
It's a bit harsh, but I agree with LockeZ on this one, Jo. You should probably have a think about what it really is that's making you feel so...distant.
i'm sorry if it feels i'm talking about internet, in fact i wanted to talk about society in general and how people are unwilling of having any sort of deeper contact with their peers. In the beginning it was going to be about how frustrated I was I couldn't really put my feelings into words, but it really became something else.
People are so sealed off and living rhythmically, routinely and it feels weird.
Programmed answers, thoughts, behaviours.
http://www.videodetective.com/movies/waking-life-i-dont-want-to-be-an-ant/819281
this kind of says it i guess.
I'm not sure people will be able to connect with it though. I just feel people are unable to bother with exposing their own beings and actually connecting, while they hide themselves on dating apps sliding through people like you slide through food on a menu, posting half assed political texts they don't even truly believe in on facebook, et cetera. Its just a radom rant really....
I should take this to the psychiatrician, in fact. Welp.
Lots of interesting replies here, anyway. I'm enjoying it.
People are so sealed off and living rhythmically, routinely and it feels weird.
Programmed answers, thoughts, behaviours.
http://www.videodetective.com/movies/waking-life-i-dont-want-to-be-an-ant/819281
this kind of says it i guess.
I'm not sure people will be able to connect with it though. I just feel people are unable to bother with exposing their own beings and actually connecting, while they hide themselves on dating apps sliding through people like you slide through food on a menu, posting half assed political texts they don't even truly believe in on facebook, et cetera. Its just a radom rant really....
I should take this to the psychiatrician, in fact. Welp.
Lots of interesting replies here, anyway. I'm enjoying it.
Sooz
They told me I was mad when I said I was going to create a spidertable. Who’s laughing now!!!
5354
Yeah, this is nothing really new or unique to our society.
It seems like your issue is actually a personal one, not one of society, which yes, absolutely take it to your headshrinker! They can help you figure out solutions.
It seems like your issue is actually a personal one, not one of society, which yes, absolutely take it to your headshrinker! They can help you figure out solutions.
maybe it's a failing marriage, struggles at work, and inability to engage in hobbies he once enjoyed that's making him feel down.
...oh wait.
...oh wait.
While I will agree that society as a whole seems to become more and more emotionally detached from each other in any real sense, I would also point out that where this might account for example 9 out of 10 people, the other 1 out of 10 are still very much attached in a very real sense. One must be PROACTIVE about their associations, and to what level of depth can be achieved.
This is something each controls as an individual. If you are proactive in strengthening your immediate associations in a loving and kind way, you will draw people very close. :)
This is something each controls as an individual. If you are proactive in strengthening your immediate associations in a loving and kind way, you will draw people very close. :)
