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Improving Difficulty
InfectionFiles- 10/12/2012 12:49 AM
- 5140 views
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CloseIdea 1 and 3 are good. A stamina system works for THIS game.
Idea 2 is arguable. I like to get stronger in video games. Why take that away from me in such a matter. I don't like it.
Idea 2 is arguable. I like to get stronger in video games. Why take that away from me in such a matter. I don't like it.
Avee
5794
I agree. Instead of beefing up the infected, how about introducing new, stronger enemies sooner?
Well, how I was going to go about it was that they only get slightly stronger, not by too much. But okay, you both agree it might not be the best idea and I can see why, so I'll think about it.
It wasn't a big point for me, I thought people might enjoy it? At some point I don't want battles to become repetitive, where you just click spacebar.
And that brings me to Avee's comment! I have been trying to implement new enemies slowly, I just have a limited resources and didn't want to pour them all into one area or chapter, y'know?
Chapter 2 starts with common infected as well as new ones, and I will be adding in some neat enemies from there.
I also didn't want chapter 1 to be super hard when coming to zombies, but it has its non-human infected so I didn't worry too much about it.
But I'm very glad to hear feedback already!
So, stamina system and the environmental damage will be a priority, thanks guys!
It wasn't a big point for me, I thought people might enjoy it? At some point I don't want battles to become repetitive, where you just click spacebar.
And that brings me to Avee's comment! I have been trying to implement new enemies slowly, I just have a limited resources and didn't want to pour them all into one area or chapter, y'know?
Chapter 2 starts with common infected as well as new ones, and I will be adding in some neat enemies from there.
I also didn't want chapter 1 to be super hard when coming to zombies, but it has its non-human infected so I didn't worry too much about it.
But I'm very glad to hear feedback already!
So, stamina system and the environmental damage will be a priority, thanks guys!
kumada
3917
My feedback:
-idea one is not bad for gimmick areas, but I think in general it's poison. Either the HP loss is too small to produce a noticeable effect, or it's too high and skeletons turn into necromantic landmines. Plus, the idea of taking damage from treading on a body seems weird. Broken glass or rusty wire or whatever, maybe. But even then, only with bare feet. My counter suggestion is that maybe some environment interactions are "noisy", and give nearby undead a speed burst towards you. Prying open doors, treading on loose debris, etc. Might be a pain to code, but if you're determined to have environmental hazards, this seems to be the way to go about it.
-idea two fits a more modern game design philosophy, but I think it's ultimately poison as well. In a survival rpg, that feeling of slowly clawing your way back from the edge is important. If the edge always scales with you, you lose that sense of accomplishment. While this does make balance easier, it makes your game a whole lot blander as well.
-idea three has the most promise, and will do a lot to add player skill to map navigation. I don't think you should crank up enemy speed alongside adding player sprint, though. There's other ways to increase the difficulty than immediately neutralizing the advantage you just gave your players.
-I'd like to suggest a fourth idea, and also echo the notion of adding new enemies more frequently. When I played your game during its earlier stages, I was impressed by how much I had to scrounge, and how much limited access to supplies really added to the difficulty of the game. I think that was actually a good way to balance the difficulty. Keep combat difficult, keep healing limited, but give the player a few more strategic options to work with (sprint, skills, maybe places to rest and recover a few times before food supplies run out.) This will keep players creative, and it'll keep the tone of your game from switching from horror to grindhouse.
-idea one is not bad for gimmick areas, but I think in general it's poison. Either the HP loss is too small to produce a noticeable effect, or it's too high and skeletons turn into necromantic landmines. Plus, the idea of taking damage from treading on a body seems weird. Broken glass or rusty wire or whatever, maybe. But even then, only with bare feet. My counter suggestion is that maybe some environment interactions are "noisy", and give nearby undead a speed burst towards you. Prying open doors, treading on loose debris, etc. Might be a pain to code, but if you're determined to have environmental hazards, this seems to be the way to go about it.
-idea two fits a more modern game design philosophy, but I think it's ultimately poison as well. In a survival rpg, that feeling of slowly clawing your way back from the edge is important. If the edge always scales with you, you lose that sense of accomplishment. While this does make balance easier, it makes your game a whole lot blander as well.
-idea three has the most promise, and will do a lot to add player skill to map navigation. I don't think you should crank up enemy speed alongside adding player sprint, though. There's other ways to increase the difficulty than immediately neutralizing the advantage you just gave your players.
-I'd like to suggest a fourth idea, and also echo the notion of adding new enemies more frequently. When I played your game during its earlier stages, I was impressed by how much I had to scrounge, and how much limited access to supplies really added to the difficulty of the game. I think that was actually a good way to balance the difficulty. Keep combat difficult, keep healing limited, but give the player a few more strategic options to work with (sprint, skills, maybe places to rest and recover a few times before food supplies run out.) This will keep players creative, and it'll keep the tone of your game from switching from horror to grindhouse.
Grimdark
0
Here's an idea: if you sprint and hit an enemy, they should have a free move against you. From the fluff perspective of things, you just literally ran into a zombie (or two, or three). A free swipe on you might not do too much damage over all, but it'll add up. It also makes you think carefully about when and where you run.
Other than my own suggestion, I really like what kumada had to say, on all accounts.
Other than my own suggestion, I really like what kumada had to say, on all accounts.
Yeah guys, I'm really liking the suggestions. It's broadening my thoughts when I add the run system to not make it broken. (don't worry kumada I'm not making the zombies faster, that was just an idea!)
But I want some kind of negative effect to it, and I do like Grimdark's idea, because I want running to be tactical, not just so you can move through the game faster.
But I want some kind of negative effect to it, and I do like Grimdark's idea, because I want running to be tactical, not just so you can move through the game faster.
Avee
5794
I've been thinking about the survival horror genre lately and I believe several games put too much emphasis on the action and not enough on the survival theme.
For instance, survival in a zombie land would have your character focus on finding and building a shelter, stashing food, laying traps, etc. In other words do everything you can to avoid battle. Fighting zombies would inevitably happen, but the risks of you ending up dead would be so high that you'd want to avoid battle as much as you can.
I'd like to hear what you guys think about this.
For instance, survival in a zombie land would have your character focus on finding and building a shelter, stashing food, laying traps, etc. In other words do everything you can to avoid battle. Fighting zombies would inevitably happen, but the risks of you ending up dead would be so high that you'd want to avoid battle as much as you can.
I'd like to hear what you guys think about this.
bigtime
674
author=Avee
I've been thinking about the survival horror genre lately and I believe several games put too much emphasis on the action and not enough on the survival theme.
For instance, survival in a zombie land would have your character focus on finding and building a shelter, stashing food, laying traps, etc. In other words do everything you can to avoid battle. Fighting zombies would inevitably happen, but the risks of you ending up dead would be so high that you'd want to avoid battle as much as you can.
I'd like to hear what you guys think about this.
This idea sounds amazing to me. First off building shelter, perhaps having to gather wood, stone, food, would be awesome. All the while only being able to do a few battles at a time. Now honestly I do need battles and action, but if your laying traps and what not, it could be cool.
I love the idea and concept, Avee.
And I actually planned to have where you could set up shop in any building after you cleared it out of infected.
But that feels more like free-roam to me, and Infection has exploration, but not enough to deem all the work I'd have to put in to making every building able to be a shelter. (I already dislike making interiors as it is!)
I've been pondering with an idea after the Hallow's Eve event, which I sadly to finish anything to be playable. But it would basically be a survival horror Harvest Moon.
Implementing heavy survival elements like you're talking is probably too late for Infection, unless I add it as I go which would slow down the process.
I do agree with you completely though, all new "horror" games are all action where you can literally pick up from a limitless pile of ammo. Like wtf?
And I actually planned to have where you could set up shop in any building after you cleared it out of infected.
But that feels more like free-roam to me, and Infection has exploration, but not enough to deem all the work I'd have to put in to making every building able to be a shelter. (I already dislike making interiors as it is!)
I've been pondering with an idea after the Hallow's Eve event, which I sadly to finish anything to be playable. But it would basically be a survival horror Harvest Moon.
Implementing heavy survival elements like you're talking is probably too late for Infection, unless I add it as I go which would slow down the process.
I do agree with you completely though, all new "horror" games are all action where you can literally pick up from a limitless pile of ammo. Like wtf?
Grimdark
0
I think keep going in the same direction you're going with this game. However, I would love to see a survival horror Harvest Moon. Just that concept alone has me sold already; especially because it's coming from you, and you do quality work.
not to be rude, but as much as the game and game play and storyline seem pretty good...I dont know if its just me or it is in a hard difficulty? I mean its probably my own incompetence or clumsiness...but there are many zombies with rather high health, and the duo with really LOW damage weapons...and easily hurt along with the very low amount of health items...
author=Grimdark
I think keep going in the same direction you're going with this game. However, I would love to see a survival horror Harvest Moon. Just that concept alone has me sold already; especially because it's coming from you, and you do quality work.
I would really love to see this too! It's something I've been toying with and we'll see if it ever sees the light of day, from me anyways.
I appreciate the kind words. :)
author=shadowilinise
not to be rude, but as much as the game and game play and storyline seem pretty good...I dont know if its just me or it is in a hard difficulty? I mean its probably my own incompetence or clumsiness...but there are many zombies with rather high health, and the duo with really LOW damage weapons...and easily hurt along with the very low amount of health items...
Yess, this game is difficult. I'll give it that, and it's supposed to be difficult!
This game caters to people who enjoy the challenge, if you have the patience and the skill you can pull it off!
But as always, I take what anyone says into account because the game is constantly changing and I'm trying to see what works the best. I don't want it to be too soft or tooo hard, so maybe the next download update will be better.
sabin1981
197
I remember raging HARDCORE about the difficulty, the game really is downright merciless at the beginning .. but once you get the heal skill (or abuse "Break Free" combat skill as it not only used for shaking off grapple status, but it also heals you for 12HP each time ;)) it becomes a lot more manageable.
author=sabin1981
I remember raging HARDCORE about the difficulty, the game really is downright merciless at the beginning .. but once you get the heal skill (or abuse "Break Free" combat skill as it not only used for shaking off grapple status, but it also heals you for 12HP each time ;)) it becomes a lot more manageable.
It's hard! But it's definitely doable, just have to utilize every single thing you can, and not what is just handed to you, but what you have to find yourself.
Recently, I've been adding more areas(even be they small ones) all around chapter 1, which includes more healing items, and maybe a few weapons, etc. here and there.
And as always I've been messing with the stats and difficulty, looking for that perfect curve.
The enemies may be weaker, but overall you will level slower, which I think was one of the main problems the first few times around.
Hopefully by the end of this year if time allows, I'll have a fresh download update on here with HOPEFULLY some chapter 2 demo material.
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