SMASH BROS. TIER LIST

Really? Kirby's at the Bottom in SSBM? I kick my friend's butt as Kirby, Peach, Pichu, Jigglypuff and Marth when he's playing his best charrie, Ganaondorf. I get mine handed to me playing as pretty much anyone else tho x_o

WTF MY FAVORITE CHARACTER SHOULD BE WAY HIGHER ON THE LIST HE HAS MAD SKILLS WTF

Even science only accepts theories, y'know.

I acknowledge that tiers may be a fair indication of what characters are easier to win with than others, but I refuse to believe that any one character is better than any other just on these grounds alone. It's all in how you use them, and if two people of equal skill (which is a debatable proposition inandof itself) were to fight, they should not be handicapped by who they picked to play as. Brawl is a much better-balanced game than the previous installments were, and even characters that supposedly suck or got nerfed too badly (look at Fox, Yoshi, & Peach) are still useful. Just means you have to try a little harder, that's all.

Ike was the best character. :)

author=halibabica link=topic=2442.msg44039#msg44039 date=1226749232
Even science only accepts theories, y'know.

I acknowledge that tiers may be a fair indication of what characters are easier to win with than others, but I refuse to believe that any one character is better than any other just on these grounds alone. It's all in how you use them, and if two people of equal skill (which is a debatable proposition inandof itself) were to fight, they should not be handicapped by who they picked to play as. Brawl is a much better-balanced game than the previous installments were, and even characters that supposedly suck or got nerfed too badly (look at Fox, Yoshi, & Peach) are still useful. Just means you have to try a little harder, that's all.

Every fighter ever made would like to speak with you.

Okay to elaborate; tiers matter the most when both players are of a high skill; in casual play, even when both players are of the same skill, while one character is going to be better than another (a fighter with perfectly balanced characters does probably not exist), that character's full potential isn't likely to be used anyway so it wouldn't really matter.

However in pro play tiers are often so important matches can be decided at the title screen.

Case in point, Street Fighter 3rd Strike, which is considered one of the greatest fighting games of all time and is still played widely today. In this game, the top tier characters are Ken, Chun-Li, and Yun at the top. Let me emphasize Yun here; Yun is the BEST character in the game. Bar none. Period. He's not the strongest and he doesn't take hits too well, but he's incredibly fast, has fearsome priority, and has a special which eliminates his recovery time and makes him able to do pretty much infinite combos (in the hands of a pro). If you're playing a top pro that's using Yun, you might as well give up unless you pick a high tier character like another Yun, or Ken or Chun-Li. Because you're not going to win.

However in casual play it doesn't really matter because the average guy who's playing for fun wouldn't know how to play Yun like a pro would so to them he's just a guy that's pretty fast or something, so in that case, tiers don't necessarily matter that much.

So, why should casual players take tiers into account? If tiers are only most relevant in tournaments involving the professional players, then why should anyone care about it except them? I don't think I'll ever find myself in the same match as a pro, and tiers are defined by them anyway, so I don't see how they could ever apply to me.

Because it still matters to a certain degree. If one character is better than another, or even has a Rock-Paper-Scissors kind of advantage over the other, it's going to show in a match assuming both players have a rudimentary understanding of the game. They apply to you simply because it exists. It may not be as IN YOUR FACE and as crucial to victory as a pro player, but it's there.

It sounds like its an excuse to say "half the cast sucks no matter what so there because we said so." That's mostly why I'm so opposed to this stance. All the characters have potential, but because these handful of the "best" are singled out, people feel like they have to be the best characters to stand a chance, when it really depends on their skill level as a player.

This isn't true. It's more like 'half the cast is objectively better than the other half because of things like priority, speed, power, vitality, usefullness of special moves, etc because a perfectly balanced game with many characters is probably impossible to make'.

Sure, all of the characters have potential, but some ARE going to be better than others, and in many cases, pro or not, that's going to matter. That's why in many strategy guides there's always 'Matchup Faqs', which are guides to how to fight certain characters with other characters and such.

I also don't think you can compare this to fighting games like Street Fighter, as they're not at all similar in play style. I understand what you're saying, but I think it applies to such a limited number of players (ie the pros) that it shouldn't bother everybody else or influence how they want to play.

Smash and Street Fighter (along with King of Fighters, Fatal Fury, Tekken, etc) are fighting games. That's all that matters. This point has been brought up before and has always been countered because it's a fighting game with the fundamental mechanics similiar enough to make a comparison. As a matter of fact, tier lists can be applied to any game that has multiple characters period. (etc, Wakka is without a doubt a higher 'tier' than Auron, etc) But yeah, if you're not a pro, don't lose sleep over it, but you should at least be wary of it because it's going to make an impact.

author=ChaosProductions link=topic=2442.msg44487#msg44487 date=1226869513
My solution: Use the same character as my opponent. ;)

Lol that's exactly what I do

author=U.K.E.Productions link=topic=2442.msg44489#msg44489 date=1226869625
But what if your opponent is Yoshi? The what?

Lol your sig got owned by Karsuman

Yoshi sucks!
Yoshi ... Let me not say anything :-*

author=Feldschlacht IV link=topic=2442.msg44506#msg44506 date=1226870037
Hey hey hey guys, let's have our posts have more content, alright?

kk
Why Yoshi sucks:
B move - Eats an opponent and turns then into an egg. But it is extremely easy to get out of these eggs ...

Up + B - Throws an egg. First of all, if you even hit someone with this egg (Which is an accomplishment in itself) then you deal what? 3% damage ... o .... k ...

Down + B - Ah-riiing-paaa (Pronunciation lol). Yoshi ground pounds, in a feeble attempt to hit opponent. Again, easy to dodge.

Forward + B - Rolling egg. O.......K.... again

...

And other shit he has