IS GRINDING A FLAW IN RPGS?

author=Versalia
the reward is incentive. lowering the reward is lowering the incentive. lowering the reward is at worst passive discouragement. having a powerful monster pop up to buttrape them is actively discouraging them.

this

also:
lowering the reward is a good indicator that you're at a proper level for what's to come (all of a sudden monsters give you 5-10 XP, you're probably good to go). introducing barbatos is an indicator that you're a piece of shit for even trying

author=arcan
So you guys are for broken grinding mechanics?

where the hell did you come remotely close to getting that idea

if this is re:Barbaros it is that he is the WRONG WAY of solving broken grinding mechanics, not that there is no problem with those mechanics

I agree that auto-leveling/auto-battling really defeats the purpose of a game, or atleast the battle system.
It's sooo lazy. You deserve to die if you LEAVE the console and let AI do all the work.

I also don't think grinding is a flaw in games, it's just part of that games gameplay, Pokemon being the perfect example.

Tough Love presented by cho.

Draw system in FF8 anyone?

author=tardis

author=cho
i don't think it's anyone's place to criticize how people play a single-player game.

yeah this. even as the developer, you have no business forcing everyone who plays your game to enjoy/experience it 'a specific way' because any other way they might enjoy/experience it is 'wrong.'

This is a very good point, however, as long as it doesn't interfere with the normal way to play the game, I feel that developer should be able to put things like Barbatos to mess with the people who mess with your game.

author=tardis
even as the developer, you have no business forcing everyone who plays your game to enjoy/experience it 'a specific way'

This is ony true to a certain extent, because you will Always fore people to play your game a certain way by even making it.

^ this is some mad entitled bullshit in itself

Warning: this post contains opinions, please use discretion when viewing this post!
In other words, I might be completely wrong about everything so dont take my word for it :P

author=tardis
once you release the game it is out of your hands and how people enjoy it is not up to you, nor does it influence you at all.

Precisely this, once you release the game it's entirely up to the player to decide how they play it.

Does that mean we should remove every "Game Over" in the game since they should decide how to play? I think we all agree that the answer to this at least is "No."

If someone wants to play without "Game Over"s then, it is up to them to do so. if they figure out a way to get around having to do battles themselves and automate it, then it's also up to them to figure out a way to get around whatever "Barbatos" might meet them when they do.

author=Felix20

author=tardis
even as the developer, you have no business forcing everyone who plays your game to enjoy/experience it 'a specific way'

This is ony true to a certain extent, because you will Always force people to play your game a certain way by even making it.

perhaps i should explain this a bit better. When you make a game you also make a way to play the game, if you didn't it wouldn't be a game now would it.
So in effect you are "forcing" them to play your game that way.
You can also add cheat codes and such things to allow them to change the way they play, or they themselves could change the way they play.
But no matter what is changed some of the game remains, the player then deals with what remains of the game.
If what remains of the game is figuring out a way of getting around Barbatos, then I don't see why that's any different than figuring out how to defeat a final boss.
In short I don't understand why something like Barbatos is any different than a normal hazard, he's easy enough to avoid so it's up to the player to do so.


Edit:

author=Crystalgate
I don't mind the idea of Barbatos, but I think you should be careful if you implement an anti play-the-game-in-another-way-than-intended feature. Punishing the player for playing your game in a way not intended will make doing so less fun for them. It will however not make playing the game as intended, any more fun.

while I dont entirely disagree with you I'd like to point out that a Game Over screen doesn't usually make a game less fun.
so why should Barbatos (unless of course he's imposible to avoid which (i think) he isn't) :)

oh stop semanticsing bro

or can you not recognize royal 'you' and were you under the impression i was attacking you personally aghaghagh gams

author=InfectionFiles
^ this is some mad entitled bullshit in itself

also i'm not sure you understand the definition of 'entitled'