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BIN LADEN DEFEATED
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GreatRedSpirit
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CloseFor the record, it *is* a good thing he's dead. Like you said it will hopefully destabilize Al Queda and reduce their ability to threaten NA+EU. It isn't a long term solution but it should help in the shortterm.
/armchair poster
*edit*
hurf durf
/armchair poster
*edit*
hurf durf
I meant military attacks on civilian targets (by the US/UK etc). Sorry for the misunderstanding.
"it was an accident" doesn't bring people's families back.
"it was an accident" doesn't bring people's families back.
It's common knowledge now that the USA invaded Iraq for economic reasons, right? (and not about terror/revenge/taliban or whatever)
author=kentona
It's common knowledge now that the USA invaded Iraq for economic reasons, right? (and not about terror/revenge/taliban or whatever)
Imaginary numbers in a computer, gotta catch 'em all!
(To clarify - referring to money, not terrorists)
Your post is long as hell Nightblade, so I won't quote it. I did however read it. With that said, I'm going to have to respectfully agree to disagree.
Yes, war sucks. It's fucking horrible that people have to die for some dumbshit political or territorial reason. But I guess I'm a pragmatist; there's no such thing as world peace. War will always exist, the means for war will always exist, and so will the reasons and the actions. The best thing that any entity or member of said entity can do is make sure that power (i.e. a military) is wielded for the right reasons and accordingly.
War is going to happen. It is an unavoidable and inevitable part of human nature, and it fucking sucks. But it's going to happen. What can be done?
For a lot of it. However I think its really naive to say that terrorists had little to do with anything. At best its hand in hand.
Do you watch Zeitgiest or something dawg?
Of course not, but what can you do? It fucking sucks, but it happens. What can be done about that in the big picture? Not just in this war, but in any war? (Hint: 'no more wars is an unfeasible and unrealistic answer)
Yes, war sucks. It's fucking horrible that people have to die for some dumbshit political or territorial reason. But I guess I'm a pragmatist; there's no such thing as world peace. War will always exist, the means for war will always exist, and so will the reasons and the actions. The best thing that any entity or member of said entity can do is make sure that power (i.e. a military) is wielded for the right reasons and accordingly.
War is going to happen. It is an unavoidable and inevitable part of human nature, and it fucking sucks. But it's going to happen. What can be done?
author=kentona
It's common knowledge now that the USA invaded Iraq for economic reasons, right? (and not about terror/revenge/taliban or whatever)
For a lot of it. However I think its really naive to say that terrorists had little to do with anything. At best its hand in hand.
Do you watch Zeitgiest or something dawg?
author=NewBlack
I meant military attacks on civilian targets (by the US/UK etc). Sorry for the misunderstanding.
"it was an accident" doesn't bring people's families back.
Of course not, but what can you do? It fucking sucks, but it happens. What can be done about that in the big picture? Not just in this war, but in any war? (Hint: 'no more wars is an unfeasible and unrealistic answer)
i'm just worried that yin/yang!! will kick in and a larger evil will arise to replace bin laden.
kind of like shendu in jackie chan adventures. aiyaaaaaah!!
Mog, it does suck yeah. All I'm saying is that we overstepped the mark by a long shot. And civilian casualties in the middle east outweigh civilian casualties in the west at an astounding ratio (I think it's something like 10:1).
As for the Zeitgiest thing. I'm willing to hear any refutation regarding the information about how the monetary system works and the implicit social, political, ecological and economic consequences of that system as layed out by The Zeitgiest Movement. (this is because if it can be refuted solidly then I will no longer believe what they say. I'm not particularly invested in my stance and I'll change it willingly if I can be shown better information.)
Saying "crazy conspiracy theorists" or any other (innacurate) ad hominem argument does not amount to a refutation of the cold, hard facts that exist regardless of political ideology or personal opinion. The "conspiracy theory" thing is a knee-jerk reaction to shallow things like presentation, tone and style and doesn't even have the decency to address the facts. Instead it just uses "lol u crazy!" to keep believing "it's just the way things are".
As for the Zeitgiest thing. I'm willing to hear any refutation regarding the information about how the monetary system works and the implicit social, political, ecological and economic consequences of that system as layed out by The Zeitgiest Movement. (this is because if it can be refuted solidly then I will no longer believe what they say. I'm not particularly invested in my stance and I'll change it willingly if I can be shown better information.)
Saying "crazy conspiracy theorists" or any other (innacurate) ad hominem argument does not amount to a refutation of the cold, hard facts that exist regardless of political ideology or personal opinion. The "conspiracy theory" thing is a knee-jerk reaction to shallow things like presentation, tone and style and doesn't even have the decency to address the facts. Instead it just uses "lol u crazy!" to keep believing "it's just the way things are".
deboo
85
Thinking shit will end because he's dead (and in a very non-suspicious way - buried at sea?) is hard to believe. It would be ideal to think that his death will dampen extremist views, but honestly that just isn't going to happen. Four years ago, maybe, but al-Qaeda far from rely on Bin Laden anymore, if anything this is just a reason for more hatred, not a victory. The entire 'war on terror,' situation is one big, corrupt mess.
Unless Afghans stop getting shot, i'm not really up to a celebration. I can see the other side of the coin, but i wouldn't feel comfortable celebrating anyone's death; the word 'justice,' is thrown around too easily. The ability to dehumanise someone, even Bin Laden, is never a good thing. Let's provoke all the millions of people in Afghanistan, Baghdad, Iraq etc. etc. to take revenge on the people who killed their family so they can celebrate 'grand retribution.'
Also, he has 24 children?! damn wtf
Unless Afghans stop getting shot, i'm not really up to a celebration. I can see the other side of the coin, but i wouldn't feel comfortable celebrating anyone's death; the word 'justice,' is thrown around too easily. The ability to dehumanise someone, even Bin Laden, is never a good thing. Let's provoke all the millions of people in Afghanistan, Baghdad, Iraq etc. etc. to take revenge on the people who killed their family so they can celebrate 'grand retribution.'
Also, he has 24 children?! damn wtf
author=NewBlack
Mog, it does suck yeah. All I'm saying is that we overstepped the mark by a long shot. And civilian casualties in the middle east outweigh civilian casualties in the west at an astounding ratio (I think it's something like 10:1).
As for the Zeitgiest thing. I'm willing to hear any refutation regarding the information about how the monetary system works and the implicit social, political, ecological and economic consequences of that system as layed out by The Zeitgiest Movement. (this is because if it can be refuted solidly then I will no longer believe what they say. I'm not particularly invested in my stance and I'll change it willingly if I can be shown better information.)
Saying "crazy conspiracy theorists" or any other (innacurate) ad hominem argument does not amount to a refutation of the cold, hard facts that exist regardless of political ideology or personal opinion. The "conspiracy theory" thing is a knee-jerk reaction to shallow things like presentation, tone and style and doesn't even have the decency to address the facts. Instead it just uses "lol u crazy!" to keep believing "it's just the way things are".
you could always try to find contrary evidence yourself instead of asking someone else.
Why does everyone mention that lame ass movie?
There the works of a small army of economic theorists that disprove Keynesian economic theory.
Ludwig Von Mises, F.A. Hayek, Lew Rockwell, Murray N. Rothbard to name a few.
There the works of a small army of economic theorists that disprove Keynesian economic theory.
Ludwig Von Mises, F.A. Hayek, Lew Rockwell, Murray N. Rothbard to name a few.
J-Man
4684
author=tardisi'm just worried that yin/yang!! will kick in and a larger evil will arise to replace bin laden.
kind of like shendu in jackie chan adventures. aiyaaaaaah!!
Funny how I thought the same thing, and thought of Uncle when I thought that.
In any event, BIN LADEN LOSES, ANTI-TERRORISTS WIN!
author=narcodisauthor=Cosmic_SeaIt also means justice and retribution for thousands upon thousands of families whose lives have been crushed by this man's actions at long last. Don't think that because you weren't personally affected that it doesn't matter.
To reiterate my point Bin Laden's deaths means nothing more than a jump in the sales of "Yes We Can" T-shirts.
A purely symbolic gesture with no real meaning.
What would be real retribution and justice if the government came about the 9/11
commission report which has more holes in it than a block of swiss cheese caught in a drive by.
The planes fire melting the support beams even though jet fuel does not burn nearly high enough to ever melt those structures, how they downplay the money angle, when you must consider that the money is probably the most important part.
Saying whoever bought and paid for that action is like saying endorsement deals and sponsorship dollars don't mean a thing to NASCAR, maybe the government is afraid that *possibly* might lead back to the government.
aside from all that, did they show his body?
I don't watch the news,. i read the newspapers but i haven't got the recent issues.
I know they showed Saddam's body.
and his execution, i remember watching that, and i remember how every joe-patriot who has so many American Flags all over his car and he can't even see out of window and mows over pedestrians every day on his to the shit-hole factory job, because he loves America so much would circle jerk to it with all his Toby keith look alike Klan buddies.
author=boobledeeboo
Thinking shit will end because he's dead (and in a very non-suspicious way - buried at sea?) is hard to believe. It would be ideal to think that his death will dampen extremist views, but honestly that just isn't going to happen. Four years ago, maybe, but al-Qaeda far from rely on Bin Laden anymore, if anything this is just a reason for more hatred, not a victory. The entire 'war on terror,' situation is one big, corrupt mess.
Unless Afghans stop getting shot, i'm not really up to a celebration. I can see the other side of the coin, but i wouldn't feel comfortable celebrating anyone's death; the word 'justice,' is thrown around too easily. The ability to dehumanise someone, even Bin Laden, is never a good thing. Let's provoke all the millions of people in Afghanistan, Baghdad, Iraq etc. etc. to take revenge on the people who killed their family so they can celebrate 'grand retribution.'
Also, he has 24 children?! damn wtf
No one really thinks it will 'end' anything. But we sure as hell shouldn't have just forgotten it and let him go. What were people expecting, for everyone to just give up?
Also, a quote from a friend that I think warrants a view;
If you really think this is meaningless, then you are equally as ignorant as the people you condemn for thinking this is the end of things.
And if you really think it's so pointless or that absolutely nothing will change or that this will have no effect on anything else, then why do we do anything? What's the point? Or better yet, what would be the correct course of action to end the war and create world peace?
You're right though. We probably should have just let him go. That would have been better.
I have to question how anyone could say this is meaningless. Yes, it's not going to end al-Qaeda or terrorism. But for almost ten years people could point to Osama still being alive and say that the United States hadn't carried out one of the most obvious objectives of the war on terror. That is no longer the case. A symbolic victory this large is still a significant victory, because perceptions are immensely important in politics. Anyone who doesn't think this is going to change perceptions is kidding themselves.
I always try to speak for myself but I think quoting others to muse over is perfectly cool as well.
author=Cosmic_Sea
I know they showed Saddam's body.
and his execution, i remember watching that, and i remember how every joe-patriot who has so many American Flags all over his car and he can't even see out of window and mows over pedestrians every day on his to the shit-hole factory job, because he loves America so much would circle jerk to it with all his Toby keith look alike Klan buddies.
I'm gonna go out on a limb here and say you have some derangement/fixative issues of your own to work out there, buddy.
Radnen
1806
Go read 1984 someday people, then you'll understand the true reason why America must create enemies to fight.
War is Peace ;)
War is Peace ;)
author=Cosmic_Seaauthor=narcodisA purely symbolic gesture with no real meaning.author=Cosmic_SeaIt also means justice and retribution for thousands upon thousands of families whose lives have been crushed by this man's actions at long last. Don't think that because you weren't personally affected that it doesn't matter.
To reiterate my point Bin Laden's deaths means nothing more than a jump in the sales of "Yes We Can" T-shirts.
What would be real retribution and justice if the government came about the 9/11
commission report which has more holes in it than a block of swiss cheese caught in a drive by.
The planes fire melting the support beams even though jet fuel does not burn nearly high enough to ever melt those structures, how they downplay the money angle, when you must consider that the money is probably the most important part.
Saying whoever bought and paid for that action is like saying endorsement deals and sponsorship dollars don't mean a thing to NASCAR, maybe the government is afraid that *possibly* might lead back to the government.
aside from all that, did they show his body?
I don't watch the news,. i read the newspapers but i haven't got the recent issues.
I know they showed Saddam's body.
and his execution, i remember watching that, and i remember how every joe-patriot who has so many American Flags all over his car and he can't even see out of window and mows over pedestrians every day on his to the shit-hole factory job, because he loves America so much would circle jerk to it with all his Toby keith look alike Klan buddies.
Taking out the leader of one of the worlds most violent terrorist organizations is meaningless, huh? Easy to say it has no real meaning if you weren't affected by it in the least bit. Furthermore, I feel like this is something America can unite behind during such a long dreadful era of pessimism and despair. They haven't shown his body, but ffs, it's been less than 24 hours since it happened. I don't think the first thing they want to do is parade the image of a carcass all over the country.
Oh, also
9/11 WAS AN INSIDE JOB, I RESEARCHED IT ON YOUTUBE
Do people really believe 9/11 was an inside job still? Seriously? To counter your one point of physical evidence, jet fuel doesn't burn at a high enough temperature to melt those buildings, but the buildings lose structural cohesion at a temperature way below their melting point. Every single piece of every conspiracy theory you've heard about 9/11 has been disproven. Have you read the 9/11 comission? Have you actually looked at all into the facts, other than what's been spoon-fed to you by Zeitgeist, Loose Change, etc? Seriously. Google "debunk 9/11 conspiracies", and tell me you don't find a million different cold hard facts that completely tear apart your boogeyman.
Fucking crawl out of your hole you sheltered juvenile. Fuck.
Hey everybody let's try to keep this civil. I know a topic like this tends to be emotional for people but let's remember that we're all friends.
Also, films like Zeitgeist and Loose change and stuff like it are highly sensationalized. Always research things on your own and don't take what anybody tells you at face value.
Also, films like Zeitgeist and Loose change and stuff like it are highly sensationalized. Always research things on your own and don't take what anybody tells you at face value.
Nightblade
2723
Taking out the leader of one of the worlds most violent terrorist organizations is meaningless, huh? Easy to say it has no real meaning if you weren't affected by it in the least bit. Furthermore, I feel like this is something America can unite behind during such a long dreadful era of pessimism and despair. They haven't shown his body, but ffs, it's been less than 24 hours since it happened. I don't think the first thing they want to do is parade the image of a carcass all over the country.
Oh, also
9/11 WAS AN INSIDE JOB, I RESEARCHED IT ON YOUTUBE
Do people really believe 9/11 was an inside job still? Seriously? To counter your one point of physical evidence, jet fuel doesn't burn at a high enough temperature to melt those buildings, but the buildings lose structural cohesion at a temperature way below their melting point. Every single piece of every conspiracy theory you've heard about 9/11 has been disproven. Have you read the 9/11 comission? Have you actually looked at all into the facts, other than what's been spoon-fed to you by Zeitgeist, Loose Change, etc? Seriously. Google "debunk 9/11 conspiracies", and tell me you don't find a million different cold hard facts that completely tear apart your boogeyman.
Fucking crawl out of your hole you sheltered juvenile. Fuck.
I have no words for how retarded this post is, so here's a waffle made out of legos instead :
