THE CUSTOMER IS ALWAYS RIGHT - PERCEPTION OF DESIGNER & PLAYER "RESPONSIBILITIES" IN AMATEUR & COMMERCIAL VIDEO GAMES

I have experienced that as well when it came to my maps. Hey I know I could improve on them, and got valuable advice from people on how to go about doing it, but when push comes to shove, do people really pay attention to the maps. As long as they are playable on, and have some zaz...do they really care while their playing.

I also remember of an older man PMing me regarding Dragon Fantasy II, and how to get through certain parts of the game. Turns out that when he reached the final boss, he thought that he was under-leveled and didn't have a good enough party... and so decided to start over AGAIN. Then within a week he'd reached the end of the game once again, and finally completed it. That was an awesome feeling. Lol. Not only that, but he thought the game was amazing, which made it feel even better! Ha ha.

Even to receive one message (or series of messages from a single fan) like that can make it all worth-while. At least in my opinion. =P

author=LockeZ
Will it? What if they're all just as dumb as the vocal ones?

The vocal ones are generally the ones who are game designers so I really have no problem with them being the ones who give feedback... Since, on average, you would expect them to be better at pointing out accurate issues than people who have no experience making games.

lol "game designers" the only thing that makes us different from the people playing these games is that we have a point and click program that can make games. that's it... Your point is going into that 12 year old "oh you thought that movie was shit well why don't YOU make a good movie then huh?" mindset

author=Darken
lol "game designers" the only thing that makes us different from the people playing these games is that we have a point and click program that can make games. that's it... Your point is going into that 12 year old "oh you thought that movie was shit well why don't YOU make a good movie then huh?" mindset

...what? I have ten years of experience making computer games, while people who haven't made computer games have no experience making computer games. If you don't think years of experience at doing something makes someone more qualified to talk about doing it, then what does?

I mean, obviously the first time I picked up RPG Maker, your statement was true. But really, you think no one who uses RPG Maker learns anything about making RPGs from doing so, or ever gets any better than they were when they first started? Really?

author=Space_Monkey
No one puts something on the internet because they don't want feedback.

Sometimes I post stuff in the spirit of "Hey guys look at this cool thing I made" not "Tell me what's wrong with this."

You're absolutely the worst kind of person. Get off my internet. Seriously, get the fuck off this site, your unbelievable vanity is not welcome. We don't need you here, masturbating about how awesome your own game is, and unwilling to listen to any help or advice. That's all that is, egotistical masturbation.

Good God Locke, calm down.

author=Space_Monkey
Sometimes I post stuff in the spirit of "Hey guys look at this cool thing I made" not "Tell me what's wrong with this."

author=LockeZ
You're absolutely the worst kind of person. Get off my internet. Seriously, get the fuck off this site, your unbelievable vanity is not welcome. We don't need you here, masturbating about how awesome your own game is, and unwilling to listen to any help or advice. That's all that is, egotistical masturbation.

:)

I respectfully disagree sir. See, I do not feel that it is vain to share something without inviting criticism of said creation. I don't get upset when people "critique" my work but that's not the reason I put it on the internet.

If I was standing on the street handing out free paintings that I made would you stop and tell me what was wrong with them? When you see street performers playing an instrument, do you stop and tell them how it would sound better if they did it in this style or that?

I'm just doing this hobby for fun, not to make a career out of it. Once I'm done with my game I'll probably release all my maps, graphics, etc. for the public to use for their own enjoyment. When that day comes, I hope you'll forgive the "egotistical masturbation" of not asking what's wrong with them.

I do always try to tell people if I know something they're doing wrong, yes. It would be extremely selfish of me not to give them help if I'm capable of doing so.

author=LockeZ
Trolling isn't a thing I'm capable of. I am, however, possessed of an endless tempest of fury, eagerly awaiting release, regarding any and all possible subjects of discussion.

I like that. It also resembles somewhat a feeling i have.

LockeZ, you said earlier in the topic that you want to help people get better but it's sounding more like you want people to accept your idea o what good game design is. You're a little too aggressive with that, bud. It seems to me that everything you say is lined with this conviction that your speaking an absolute truth that cannot be questioned. You often raise some good points but things spiral out of control in the following banter. Try being more open-minded and objective to what OTHER PEOPLE THINK. Your not the only brain on the planet.

This whole topic has been a very interesting read! Even though it went off topic it was all good topics. I even got sidetracked and read all the comments on the review of Max's game that he linked to. Reading that was a good comparison. It's interesting to see what kind of discussion takes place without the members who usually spark the flame wars that shut down so many great topics in progress.

I don't really have anything important to say(that hasn't already been said) and there was some little stuff I wanted to respond to but now I forget haha

Oh, here's one, LockeZ was saying how game designers(fellow RM'ers) might give better feedback or notice things that standard gamers wouldn't. I totally agree with this, because after my experience making games I started seeing games in a whole new way. As I'm playing games, in the back of my mind I'm thinking about how the game might be coded; using switches and variables and branches, it opened my mind to what might going on behind the scenes of a game. So when I'm play testing a game it helps me understand what might be causing a problem in this game and I might be able to give better, more specific feedback(the switch stuck ON, instead of, the door wouldn't open) or even find the true root of the problem. This doesn't mean that gamers won't give good feedback, just that fellow amateur game makers are more likely to give better feedback.

@ Link : I don't think it's "good" or "better", they're just more precise in what THEY want to say.
@LockeZ : I'm very careful to say "I think", because i also(?) tend to hammer my words a bit!