CONNECTICUT SHOOTING

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Tau
RMN sex symbol
3293
author=CNN
Newtown, Connecticut (CNN) -- The sound of gunfire, confusion, a lockdown and then an evacuation. Witnesses, students and parents told frightening stories Friday about a school shooting that police say left six adults and 20 children dead.

Many details of the attack were still unfolding, but the sight of dozens of emergency vehicles and police spread across the wooded campus made it clear Sandy Hook Elementary School has become the nation's latest infamous crime scene.
For now, evacuated children are being comforted and reuniting with their parents at a nearby firehouse where, outside, an American flag flies at half-staff.
There, couples enter and exit, some leaving without children and walking silently and tearfully past a nearby cemetery. One couple, escorted by firefighters seemed especially shaken -- eyes bloodshot and lips trembling -- stricken by the events of a clearly devastating day.

Witness: 3 went into hall, 1 came back How the school shooting unfolded 3rd grader describes shooting from class
In the hours following the morning attack, parents rushed to the school after first hearing the news. They reunited with their children, clutching them and then hurrying away.

Support crucial for kids after trauma Lynn Wasik wrapped her arms around her 8-year-old daughter, Alexis, cloaked against the cold in an oversized jacket. The girl described her ordeal after police and teachers barged into her third-grade classroom and ordered her and her classmates to hide in a corner.
"Everybody was crying," Alexis said. "And I just heard the police officers yelling."

Her mother said she first learned about the emergency through an automated phone call message. She said the message wasn't clear about the school where the incident had occurred. In a panic, she raced to Sandy Hook, eventually finding Alexis unharmed.

"My heart is in a million pieces for those families," said Lynn Wasik. "Who could do something like this? It's just sickening."
Slain principal worked to keep students safe
Like Wasik, other parents wrapped their arms around their children as they hurried away from the scene.

The FBI presence became much more evident in the afternoon. Several federal officers in tactical gear were coordinating with state and local law enforcement. Officers from the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives arrived to join the investigation.

"I was in the gym at the time," student Brendan Murray told CNN affiliate WABC. "I heard screaming and I thought a custodian was knocking down things. Police came in, teachers yelled to get to a safe place. Police were knocking on the doors -- police were at every door, leading us down, quick, quick."
Brendan said he later joined classmates and ran to the firehouse "really quick. We were all really happy that we were all alive."

At the firehouse, counselors such as Rabbi Shaul Praver lended a hand to help the traumatized. Some suffered from "terrible anxiety," Praver told CNN. "It's very hard to console parents in this situation," he said. "There's no theological answer to this. What you have to do is hug them and just be with them and cry with them."
'Hope my mom is ok': Tweets from the shooting
'Why? Why?' Teary-eyed parents continued to emerge from the firehouse. Some were talking on cell phones, using words like "chaotic" and "devastating."
Others were openly weeping into their phones as they walked up a wooded roadway leading away from the school.

"Why? Why?" one woman cried as she walked away. Earlier, a woman who lives near the firehouse described seeing "a bunch of children with a bunch of adults" apparently evacuating toward a nearby park. "I seen five children running up through our back field," the woman told CNN. "And by God, those poor little guys were running."
Temperatures weren't far above freezing at the time of the evacuation. Adults led children away from the school. Many of the kids wore no coats and were dressed in brightly colored clothing. They marched in a line -- one behind another -- with their hands resting on the shoulders of the children in front of them.

How do we stop the violence?'Pop, pop pop' Children and adults shared their versions of the attack. One parent who was inside the school at the time of the shooting described hearing a "pop, pop, pop," sound around 9:30 a.m. In the room with her were the school's principal, vice principal and the psychologist. All three left the room and went into the hall to see what was happening. The parent ducked under the table and called 911.

"I cowered," she told CNN's Meredith Artley. The shooter "must have shot a hundred rounds."

Later the parent said she saw two adults lying dead in the hallway, in a pool of blood. Although school shootings have become sadly familiar in 21st century America, violence is not common in this picturesque 300-year-old town of about 27,000.
"I can't believe -- in a small town like this -- we've never had anything like this happen," a father of a Sandy Hook student told local CNN affiliate WTNH.
"I was pretty shaken up. I did not know who or what happened."
"It doesn't seem possible," said another parent. "You have something happen so close to home. ... I guess I'm still in shock."

Timeline: School violence in the U.S.
At the Stone River Grill, just a few blocks away from Sandy Hook, residents sat quietly watching TV news announce every dark detail of the tragedy.
"It's insane," said grill employee Jill Richelsoph. "This is a really nice community. We've never had anything like this." Surrounded by restaurant co-workers Richelsoph shared a conversation she had with a friend whose 5-year-old daughter attends Sandy Hook.

"She's really shaken up right now," said Richelsoph. "I don't know how she's ever going to bring her daughter back to that school."
Also at the restaurant was Tracy Ryan, who teaches at another elementary school. Newtown's schools, she said, have helped to attract new residents from different parts of the state.
"People move here for the school system," she said. "It's got great schools. I'm just totally speechless."
"My heart goes out to those families."
Just a few weeks ago Newtown -- about 60 miles outside New York City -- was recovering from Hurricane Sandy, which downed trees and knocked out power to most customers. A year before, residents suffered through Hurricane Irene.

Source.



You guys have probably heard about this already. I don't understand how a country can live through yet another tragedy where 27 people are dead and do nothing. Yet they can declare war on terrorism? How can someone do this to children before Christmas.. Unthinkable.
LockeZ
I'd really like to get rid of LockeZ. His play style is way too unpredictable. He's always like this too. If he ran a country, he'd just kill and imprison people at random until crime stopped.
5958
author=tau
I don't understand how a country can live through yet another tragedy where 27 people are dead and do nothing. Yet they can declare war on terrorism?

Do nothing? They are going after the attackers with equal vigor in both cases. The attacker in a school shooting is just much easier to find, so the case is closed on the same day as it occurs, instead of being dragged out for decades like terrorist shootings.

Though I'm making an assumption that this is a typical school shooting. I like how this story is entirely public reactions, but doesn't actually say what happened. Just that there was "the sound of gunfire" and then dead people. Maybe it was a terrorist attack! Maybe it was a russian invasion! Maybe it was an armed robbery! Maybe it was a guy playing Call of Duty on his laptop, followed by a series of coincidental heart attacks!
Let's shower him with media attention and turn him into a minor celebrity, setting an example for future would-be school shooters.
http://o.canada.com/2012/12/14/interactive-mass-shootings-around-the-world-since-1996/

Little bit of info I've been chewing on for a few hours. There's so much to be said about this tragedy, but as with others of the same nature, I'm pretty much at a loss for words.

I've also stupidly been reading through some of the most insensitive posts on facebook that I've ever been subjected to from (mostly Republican) gun nuts all day. Things like "Aw, fuck, the anti-gun liberals are gonna have a hayday with this one" and "We need to realize this kinda thing rarely ever happens, the media just wants to give America a bad name". Obviously, I've been growing more and more sickened throughout the day.

Things need to change. There's no reason to keep ignoring these tragedies.
LockeZ
I'd really like to get rid of LockeZ. His play style is way too unpredictable. He's always like this too. If he ran a country, he'd just kill and imprison people at random until crime stopped.
5958
What? No one is ignoring it. The police sent in swat teams, while the media covered it on national news on every channel. That is the exact opposite of ignoring it.
And yet tomorrow it'll be forgotten, and nothing will have changed.

Stricter gun control and free mental health care are good places to start.
author=sbester
And yet tomorrow it'll be forgotten, and nothing will have changed.


No it won't. This will be all over the media for the next month.
LockeZ
I'd really like to get rid of LockeZ. His play style is way too unpredictable. He's always like this too. If he ran a country, he'd just kill and imprison people at random until crime stopped.
5958
author=sbester
And yet tomorrow it'll be forgotten, and nothing will have changed.

Huh? I'm sure by tomorrow the police will have apprehended the killer and the situation will be resolved. You can't seriously think the police are gonna give up within 24 hours.
Um... the killer is dead. Another guy was arrested as well, but I haven't heard details as to how he's connected, or even if. My issue is with gun laws, not with how the police are handling the crime.
Gun control is a very difficult topic in politics. Politics, by nature, is a terrible thing to discuss online. Going down that path requires quite a few fire shields.

Mental health screenings before purchasing firearms would be nice, although I doubt it'd pass any Congressional review.
LockeZ
I'd really like to get rid of LockeZ. His play style is way too unpredictable. He's always like this too. If he ran a country, he'd just kill and imprison people at random until crime stopped.
5958
Man no one's gonna be like "Oh shoot, I really felt like gunning down thirty people today. But I would have to steal a gun from someone, and I'm not sure I can do that." Gun laws prevent crimes of passion, not mass murders. I'm not saying gun laws would necessarily be bad, but they're irrelevant to this case.

On the flip side, if the third graders were allowed to carry guns, he'd have only been able to kill two or three people tops before getting shot back. Awesome idea, right?

Also T-Shirt hell needs to update their shirt again now I guess
author=sbester
My issue is with gun laws, not with how the police are handling the crime.

This is a cultural problem, not a gun control one.
Adon237
if i had an allowance, i would give it to rmn
1743
Such ridiculous comments coming from you, LockeZ. Maybe he/she means that the issue of (non-existant) gun laws won't be addressed, and the deaths of those children and adults will be ignored in that respect.
There is a point in there. After every mass shooting, it's become standard practice to say "Now isn't the time to talk about guns, it's inconsiderate." It's always too soon. Then the next shooting happens, and we talk about the last event in comparison, but it's still "too soon" to talk about gun control.

Gun control may or may not be the solution here. The popular idea on Reddit at the moment is promoting mental health by perhaps screening those getting guns, or just making therapeutic services available in general. Either way, we need a serious discussion about this on the higher political channels. Just pushing it to "not the time" after each shooting isn't getting anything done.
LockeZ
I'd really like to get rid of LockeZ. His play style is way too unpredictable. He's always like this too. If he ran a country, he'd just kill and imprison people at random until crime stopped.
5958
Ridiculous comments are my passion

Anyway, think of it this way. Tragedies like this are always the spark at the beginning of JRPGs that prompts the 11 year old hero to undergo a journey to avenge his burned-down hometown. If we can get the mayor of Newtown to banish four of these kids, they could turn into real heroes!

If I start making jokes about demon-controlled empires at this point, I'm afraid the FBI will flag me for wiretapping or something. I didn't mean anything by it, FBI guys who are now watching. It was just a video game reference. You just need to play Secret of Mana or something to get the joke.
I'm not familiar with alternatives and regulations being talked about for gun control, but I will say this...

Anyone who thinks that civilians shouldn't own guns has never lived in a city where their home is legitimately threatened by armed burglary. The vulnerability is palpable in some places. Not saying anyone here thinks that, just that I've heard it elsewhere from rich, sheltered, naive suburban peoples.

author=LockeZ
Man no one's gonna be like "Oh shoot, I really felt like gunning down thirty people today. But I would have to steal a gun from someone, and I'm not sure I can do that." Gun laws prevent crimes of passion, not mass murders. I'm not saying gun laws would necessarily be bad, but they're irrelevant to this case.


Pretty much all I think about it in this case.

Monsters do terrible things, regardless of their access to guns. Maybe if it can't get weaponry, it would use a car and run over a few dozen people.
author=Sauce
I'm not familiar with alternatives and regulations being talked about for gun control, but I will say this...

Anyone who thinks that civilians shouldn't own guns has never lived in a city where their home is legitimately threatened by armed burglary. The vulnerability is palpable in some places. Not saying anyone here thinks that, just that I've heard it elsewhere from rich, sheltered, naive suburban peoples.
how does owning a gun help here?
Blobofgoo
Legs are a burden. Return to snek.
2751
Whenever, I here about these things, I try to put myself in the victim position. I run several scenarios through my head. Then I wonder why the victim didn't do the thing. Really, I already know the answer. The victims are afraid. Int his situation the best thing the students could have done would have been to just throw books and stuff. The students probably could have taken down the shooter if they had been organized, but that would have taken a leader. Again, the fear factor plays in to this a lot. I don't think I would be able to do my own scenario.

I think the best we can do is try to make it harder for it to happen. Taking preemptive measures is the best way. It ismuch easier to stop something before it actually happens.
KingArthur
( ̄▽ ̄)ノ De-facto operator of the unofficial RMN IRC channel.
1217
author=Jude
author=sbester
My issue is with gun laws, not with how the police are handling the crime.
This is a cultural problem, not a gun control one.

This. Guns are always used as scapegoats to blame someone/something when shootings occur, but those who cry for gun control in these instances completely forget that guns don't kill, people do.

Hypothetically, if I really, really, really wanted to murder someone and I didn't have access to a gun I could just as easily pick up a common kitchen knife and go stabbing. The end result is the same and removing guns hasn't solved the core problem of there being murderers.

tl;dr: Guns are just tools, any tool is either great or horrible depending on how you use it.

author=kentona
author=Sauce
I'm not familiar with alternatives and regulations being talked about for gun control, but I will say this...

Anyone who thinks that civilians shouldn't own guns has never lived in a city where their home is legitimately threatened by armed burglary. The vulnerability is palpable in some places. Not saying anyone here thinks that, just that I've heard it elsewhere from rich, sheltered, naive suburban peoples.
how does owning a gun help here?

It's always nice to have a weapon to fight with if you're threatened, though whether you can make use of that weapon is a different matter entirely.

Plus it acts as a deterrent. Do you really want to rob that house where the guy living there potentially has a gun ready to blast you as soon as you break in?
chana
(Socrates would certainly not contadict me!)
1584
I think Kentona wanted to stress this paradox coming from someone who is against gun control :
"Anyone who thinks that civilians shouldn't own guns has never lived in a city where their home is legitimately threatened by armed burglary."