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[POLL] WHAT IF FINAL FANTASY V...
Poll
If Final Fantasy V was released in places other than Japan during the SNES craze, how do you feel its exposure could have affected the gaming scene? - Results
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I haven't played the fan translation SNES romhack, but I think it's safe to say that Final Fantasy IV was the best.
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2
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8%
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I have played the fan translation SNES romhack and I think that Final Fantasy IV was the best.
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0
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0%
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I have played the fan translation SNES romhack and I feel Final Fantasy V is the better title.
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2
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8%
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I have played the fan translation SNES romhack and I think that Final Fantasy VI was the best.
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10
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43%
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I haven't played the fan translation SNES romhack, but I think it's safe to say that Final Fantasy VI was the best.
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4
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17%
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5
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21%
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Posts
Corfaisus
"It's frustrating because - as much as Corf is otherwise an irredeemable person - his 2k/3 mapping is on point." ~ psy_wombats
7874
Corfaisus
View playlists
Closeauthor=Ratty524
I'm wondering what people have against Mystic Quest. It seemed okay to me when I tried it, maybe a bit too easy?
It was essentially the kiddie Final Fantasy for slow-witted Americans to ease us into complex systems like mashing A to win, hence why it was sold as Final Fantasy USA in Japan.
author=CorfaisusYes, I did. Like I specified from the onset, I replayed FFIV, V and VI very recently back to back, and then started VII. (and Chrono Trigger.)
My question to you: Have you actually played FF6 recently, and did you find yourself forced to come back for whatever reason (stupid bullshit/just not as fun as it used to be)? Are you sure that it hasn't become like FF7 or Super Mario 64 in that it was amazing for its time but is now absolute hell to play? I'm going through FF5 again right now, making it a point to do the most "painful" activities (get all Blue magic) and I have yet to lose steam.
It's easy to justify shit when you're 6. When you're 20+, not so much.
I never finished FFIV before, I played FFV a decade ago but got lost/bored when I got my sub, and had wrapped FFVI 4 times when I was a teen, and I never finished VII. I was determined to finish them.
FFIV (played the remake on DS) was great game, but fucking balls-hard in a not-balanced or fair way. So I am glad I finished it, glad I got to experience the MOON, but I will never play it again.
FFV just hurt just how generic its characters and story and progression was, and I LOVE generic RPGs (I've made like 4 of them). The class system is cool (and partly inspired my games), but it feels hobbled by how limited you are in your ability to experiment with different skills/builds. It is very clearly "YOU MUST BUILD OPTIMAL PATH TO WIN", which detracts heavily from my enjoyment of such a diverse class concept. I really had to push through to finish it by the end. I hope to play it again using a GBA emulator because everyone seems to rave about it, so I must be missing something.
FFVI was even more glorious than I remembered. The massive jump in artistic quality of the sprites, the battlers, the battle animations, music, over FFV was very welcome. The story captivated me again, and (now with 15+ more years of life experience) the depth of the characters surprised me. Some of the dialog though was pretty cheesey and had me shaking my head. I still love this game.
I've only gotten like 20mins into FFVII this go-round, and haven't touched it since. Still, I think it has aged better than people give it credit for. It has one of the best opening sequences of any RPG, for one.
and lastly, Chrono Trigger is still godly.
author=Corfaisusauthor=GreatRedSpiritBut what does it mean?
Salsa's Y Burn
That's what I want to know! Between all the pirate talk and the dingleberries it was basically nonsense. It's the worst localization SE has done, only memorable from its mistakes and unintentional names like AdamnGolem. Or the awful load times, but that's getting into when Square finally put their English script to work with something they lost the source code and original assets for and trying to cram it into a radically different platform. It wouldn't have been looked fondly of back in '93. Than god the FF5A localization was so outstanding, it's the exact fit of what FF5 is, wacky episodic anime adventures, and not being dry like the source material.
author=Corfaisusauthor=Ratty524It was essentially the kiddie Final Fantasy for slow-witted Americans to ease us into complex systems like mashing A to win, hence why it was sold as Final Fantasy USA in Japan.
I'm wondering what people have against Mystic Quest. It seemed okay to me when I tried it, maybe a bit too easy?
Somebody should've slipped whoever made that decision a copy of Wizardry 4
e:
author=kentona
FFIV (played the remake on DS) was great game, but fucking balls-hard in a not-balanced or fair way. So I am glad I finished it, glad I got to experience the MOON, but I will never play it again.
Part of the bad balance is FF4DS is designed around returning or more experienced players. FF4 SNES, any version, rolls against chewing on the controller all the way up to the Sealed Cave and even then it never gets significantly harder. Several endgame enemies have AI scripts that react on counter attacks and mix that with queuing up attacks in the ATB can lead to trouble.
4DS rebalances the game completely, party so most of the game isn't a facerollfest (Caignazzo doesn't immediately die when Tellah looks at him) but they also screw it up. The Tower of Zot trapped chest is infamous for this: You can fight the Flame Dog who'll open with a breath attack that can wipe most of your party before you even take an action. Or the Attack Node from the CPU can similarly wipe most of your party from full HP with its first action.
There's some mitigation steps in the game, such as the Draw Attacks augment so Cecil can actually try and tank which combos great with the Counter augment, both unmissable but iirc you get the counter first and don't know the draw attack is coming so that combo is hardly reliable from a design perspective. The lone debuff you get, Slow, actually works most of the time, most serious enemies are vulnerable to berserk which prevents the from using their strongest attacks, and Protect/Shell can be multitargeted. There's some ridiculous bonkers augments you can get too (cast two spells in one turn and make any spell multitarget are the top two) but those require knowing the augment system better than any newcomer to FF4DS will.
e2: tried breaking up a wall o' text
Corfaisus
"It's frustrating because - as much as Corf is otherwise an irredeemable person - his 2k/3 mapping is on point." ~ psy_wombats
7874
author=GreatRedSpiritauthor=CorfaisusThat's what I want to know! Between all the pirate talk and the dingleberries it was basically nonsense. It's the worst localization SE has done, only memorable from its mistakes and unintentional names like AdamnGolem.author=GreatRedSpiritBut what does it mean?
Salsa's Y Burn
That's why you play the SNES romhack; it was a labor of love and the people who translated it really nailed it until the GBA dethroned them.
I dunno man, the translation I played was rough. None of the Blue Magic skills were translated, huge chunks of dialog were missing, and NPCs rarely were translated. Also everything was really, really campy. I am partially blaming the translation for my inability to love FFV. ...but if it is the actual game that is that campy then idunno man.
author=Corfaisusauthor=Ratty524It was essentially the kiddie Final Fantasy for slow-witted Americans to ease us into complex systems like mashing A to win, hence why it was sold as Final Fantasy USA in Japan.
I'm wondering what people have against Mystic Quest. It seemed okay to me when I tried it, maybe a bit too easy?
I don't know, man. Considering most RPGs of its time were ass-kicking grind fests, it kind of stood out to me as a retro RPG that I could beat without getting too tired of it (the kickass soundtrack helped). It definitely wasn't the best game of the genre, but I don't think it was bad for what it was.
If FF5 came out during its prime it'd more likely than not have the Anthology localization, and it would be awful. I don't know what fan translation you're talking about, I used one back when SNES emulators where driven more by hacks than actual emulation (RPG Maker 2 was my first RM! I had to hit '8' to change some setting in how it draws to be able to see the text) and that's how I saw the best death scene in FF history. It's a fan translation though so my bet is it's either functionally mediocre at best or hot garbage at worst like the J2E FF4 fan translation, or Skyrender's FF6 translation, or some new FF7 translation that replaced Cait Sith with a whole new character called "Iscar Matthias", I shit you not. A labour of love isn't a sign of quality, just passion and effort.
e: bbcode is hard I swear
e: bbcode is hard I swear
author=kentona
FFV just hurt just how generic its characters and story and progression was, and I LOVE generic RPGs (I've made like 4 of them). The class system is cool (and partly inspired my games), but it feels hobbled by how limited you are in your ability to experiment with different skills/builds. It is very clearly "YOU MUST BUILD OPTIMAL PATH TO WIN", which detracts heavily from my enjoyment of such a diverse class concept.
Really? Yeah, I'd say there are some classes that are more objectively useful than others, but for the most part the game is playable using any class combination. I do agree there are a number of classes/skills that were totally outshined by others.
Part of my problems stemmed from being underleveled the entire game because I didn't invest in 15 hours of grinding.
Kentona, if you knew what was coming and had intimate knowledge of the jobs, their abilities, the bosses, and the battle system you totally could've beaten the game at the lowest possible level without grinding! (and then go the GBA postgame content w/ grinding but only for JP)
author=kentona
Part of my problems stemmed from being underleveled the entire game because I didn't invest in 15 hours of grinding.
Hmm... I never really found the FF's, especially V upwards, to be really focused on grinding, and some of them levels, for that matter. Dragon Quest is a series I think of when grinding your way up seems to be the only recourse a lot of the time. Final Fantasy seems to be more about tricks, equipment, and boolean strategy.
afaik level affects the following:
- Hit rate uses the difference between the user and the target's level. Maybe only for status spells, idr
- The Monk's barefist damage multiplier is based on level
- Goblin Punch's damage multiplier jump to 8 or something if the user and target have the same level
- HP/MP gains
- Lv.X spells
There's probably more but that's all I know from the top of my head
e: In FF5. 6 uses your level squared in its damage algorithms but I don't remember where else
- Hit rate uses the difference between the user and the target's level. Maybe only for status spells, idr
- The Monk's barefist damage multiplier is based on level
- Goblin Punch's damage multiplier jump to 8 or something if the user and target have the same level
- HP/MP gains
- Lv.X spells
There's probably more but that's all I know from the top of my head
e: In FF5. 6 uses your level squared in its damage algorithms but I don't remember where else
Yeah, level affects things to be sure, and FFV has one of the strongest corrolations between levels and strength, but with most FFs, there are so many tricks and benefits from equipment to mitigate threat, level doesn't matter as much as it might in other RPGs.
In say, Dragon Quest, your stats are your strength, getting roasted by a spell or getting knocked silly by an ogre was the result of your numbers going against the enemies numbers. Compare say, Final Fantasy VI, where almost all of your non statistical advantages came from equipment.
In say, Dragon Quest, your stats are your strength, getting roasted by a spell or getting knocked silly by an ogre was the result of your numbers going against the enemies numbers. Compare say, Final Fantasy VI, where almost all of your non statistical advantages came from equipment.
I'm not disputing what you said, I'm elaborating on what level affects in FF5 and how most are niche uses. The link I posted above is breaking the game apart by knowing all of the tricks and making the game taste curb. It's always been a thing with the SNES FFs. Zeromus giving you trouble? Reflect a Flare or Holy onto him, the game won't process counter scripts for reflected magic! Neo Exdeath? One part of him isn't flagged as heavy and another is vulnerable to stone. My dog could beat Kefka. There's a youtube series of somebody beating every boss in FF7 with zero experience and items, only using leveled materia. Ultimecia's as much of a joke as Kefka. You can drop Necron while he's using Shockwave Pulsar after dodging Grand Cross. You can get all the way to Jecht in FF10 with a list of restrictions as long as my arm and lifting one of them is enough to beat the game.
It's one of the reasons why I love the series. I think FF5 has a nice balance of being challenging to new players while having a multitude of different ways to tear it wide open. It needs something better than the early SNES ATB though. Sure Atomos is vulnerable to sleep but by god the game won't tell you under any condition!
e:
I forgot
here is my ff fan badge :<
It's one of the reasons why I love the series. I think FF5 has a nice balance of being challenging to new players while having a multitude of different ways to tear it wide open. It needs something better than the early SNES ATB though. Sure Atomos is vulnerable to sleep but by god the game won't tell you under any condition!
e:
I forgot
here is my ff fan badge :<
Corfaisus
"It's frustrating because - as much as Corf is otherwise an irredeemable person - his 2k/3 mapping is on point." ~ psy_wombats
7874
author=GreatRedSpirit
If FF5 came out during its prime it'd more likely than not have the Anthology localization, and it would be awful. I don't know what fan translation you're talking about, I used one back when SNES emulators where driven more by hacks than actual emulation (RPG Maker 2 was my first RM! I had to hit '8' to change some setting in how it draws to be able to see the text) and that's how I saw the best death scene in FF history. It's a fan translation though so my bet is it's either functionally mediocre at best or hot garbage at worst like the J2E FF4 fan translation, or Skyrender's FF6 translation, or some new FF7 translation that replaced Cait Sith with a whole new character called "Iscar Matthias", I shit you not. A labour of love isn't a sign of quality, just passion and effort.
e: bbcode is hard I swear
Since I know I can't post a link to it, the name is simply Final_Fantasy_V_(J)_{T+Eng1.10}. Replace brackets with other brackets used for tags on this site. Seems fine to me.
author=kentona
The class system is cool (and partly inspired my games), but it feels hobbled by how limited you are in your ability to experiment with different skills/builds. It is very clearly "YOU MUST BUILD OPTIMAL PATH TO WIN", which detracts heavily from my enjoyment of such a diverse class concept.
I don't even know what you're on about. You've got more than enough to mix and match interesting combos with a main job as something with multiple benefits while sub-jobbing a more focused use. Maybe I'm just having a blast because I actually went out of my way to get Blue Magic that allows me to do whatever the hell I want so I'm allowed the extra leeway?
Right now, I'm speed-grinding by equipping Cara and Faris (two fastest characters in my party) with Gold Hairpins I procured through treasure chests and spamming L.3 Flare with them just outside the forest of the desert with North Mountain and Phoenix Tower in it on the Fused World (groups of Anku Heggus and Ammonas), netting me 4 AP along with all kinds of good EXP and Gil while I start mastering my jobs just for the fun of it. I don't even need to be doing it, but because it's so fast (OHKO 5 monster group) and I see immediate benefits so frequently, I actually want to. The game is rewarding me for going out of my way to get stuff that's kind of a bitch to get* and it feels good. That's a rare breed of grinding right there.
*
author= RPGClassics.comLevel 3 FlareStill in Exdeath's Castle, stay on the lookout for Red Dragons. If you cast Wall on one and !Control it you can have it cast Level 3 Flare on itself, bouncing it back at one of your characters. Hopefully, it will bounce back at a Learner. In order to learn this spell, the Learner's level must be divisible by23 (typo). You can't have the dragon target the party directly with Level 3 Flare, so this is the only way.
You could either use a White Mage in this battle or a character with the leveled ability !Combine (as I did grinding from scratch in Barrier Tower to get L.2 Old from the Magic Dragons there, tyvm) with a Phoenix Down and Dragon Fang in your inventory. The rest is making sure that you have someone with Learning in your party (I ran in with 4 blue mages, half with !Combine, the other half with !Control) and that you can pull of a combo quickly enough to use the dragon to cast Flare on itself so it bounces back to you and then using a method of healing (Phoenix Down + White Wind all the way) so that you can learn it.
Not to mention using Dark Shock followed by L.5 Doom on Atomos at the balcony of Barrier Tower to take him out instantly (I fought him once before to make sure that I could "legitimately" and reset just so that I could gain the full benefit of the AP on my party).
Whenever I need to heal, I can use White Wind to get my party back up to fighting form (it's only really useful when someone still has a fair amount of HP and the MP to cast so you're kind of playing with fire on this one, but that's a cool risk right?).
All blue magic was untranslated, remember? it was useless because I can't read it. Also, having only 1 extra skill slot meant experimenting was a waste. You basically find one alternate skill that you find useful, then neglect the rest. And i didn't even know that the freelancer inherited stat bonuses until I read about it on GameFaqs when I was having trouble being one-shotted by Exdeath.
So basically, what the game looked like to me was "Grind a shitton on your preferred class, ignoring the rest, get your bonus, then use the freelancer".
So basically, what the game looked like to me was "Grind a shitton on your preferred class, ignoring the rest, get your bonus, then use the freelancer".
iirc Lv.5 Doom Statues in Baal's basement gives more AP and is still super fast. Or wait until Movers in the final dungeon if you aren't in an immediate hurry, they give three digit amounts.
I agree with this. I like FFT's job system more because you can customize your characters more. It joins with issues with blue magic too in that you don't know what you can learn as a blue mage and wasting slots on it is boring if you don't know if you'll even get anything out of it. It's also not the last time FF5 doesn't tell you anything, like how the Equip-X skills can give you the stat modifiers from that class if they're higher than your current class' modifiers.
There's a custom class mod for FF5A that gives each character three slots to customize with. The only one a character gets is based on their class, you don't even get forced to bring Fight! Kentona if you ever want to play FF5 again I heartily recommend doing so with FF5A (because it's 100% translated, and very well done to boot) with the above mod. Hopefully those two will make the game more enjoyable.
author=kentona
All blue magic was untranslated, remember? it was useless because I can't read it. Also, having only 1 extra skill slot meant experimenting was a waste. You basically find one alternate skill that you find useful, then neglect the rest. And i didn't even know that the freelancer inherited stat bonuses until I read about it on GameFaqs when I was having trouble being one-shotted by Exdeath.
So basically, what the game looked like to me was "Grind a shitton on your preferred class, ignoring the rest, get your bonus, then use the freelancer".
I agree with this. I like FFT's job system more because you can customize your characters more. It joins with issues with blue magic too in that you don't know what you can learn as a blue mage and wasting slots on it is boring if you don't know if you'll even get anything out of it. It's also not the last time FF5 doesn't tell you anything, like how the Equip-X skills can give you the stat modifiers from that class if they're higher than your current class' modifiers.
There's a custom class mod for FF5A that gives each character three slots to customize with. The only one a character gets is based on their class, you don't even get forced to bring Fight! Kentona if you ever want to play FF5 again I heartily recommend doing so with FF5A (because it's 100% translated, and very well done to boot) with the above mod. Hopefully those two will make the game more enjoyable.
Corfaisus
"It's frustrating because - as much as Corf is otherwise an irredeemable person - his 2k/3 mapping is on point." ~ psy_wombats
7874
author=GreatRedSpirit
iirc Lv.5 Doom Statues in Baal's basement gives more AP and is still super fast.
I'll check on that but I find my current method extremely useful as I don't have to worry about stocking up on extra items or status ailments and I can fly back to Carwen in a matter of seconds and rest at the inn for 10 gil. Not to mention I feel some kind of pride in this method because I found it myself by sarcastically casting L.3 Flare on a group of enemies on my way to pick up Bahamut.
I do need to pick up Odin, though, which I'll probably do jointly with getting Syldra.
RedMask
1139
Wow, I'm still the only one who choose FF IV. Don't worry Cecil I'm still your friend lol.
