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Solitayre
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CloseI kinda dislike this attitude we have about games that get popular.
I'm completely ambivalent about featuring Pom. I haven't played the game myself.
I'm completely ambivalent about featuring Pom. I haven't played the game myself.
It's not like games aren't allowed to be popular. Like I said, it's not a question of whether it deserved it or not. I'm glad for Me-Patra's lucky break, but this is something of an extreme case. Would we even be considering Pom if it weren't so outrageously popular? Perhaps we should get the creator of Miley Cyrus' Twerk Ball to post that game here, since I'm sure it's getting millions of hits as well.
A cute game with custom graphics and a 4-star review would attract my attention. I am all for games that makes it easy for me to make a frontpage banner for.
author=Solitayre
I kinda dislike this attitude we have about games that get popular.
I'm with Soli on this one; we really should be encouraging success, and we shouldn't turn on someone just because they see some. We all want our games to be played, y'know? I don't agree with talking down people for being popular or "overrated".
Anyway, RMN does do a lot to promote hidden gems and other less popular/viral games.
from kentonaIt got its reviews due to its rise in popularity as well. It could have just as easily flown completely under the radar were it not for PewDiePie.
A cute game with custom graphics and a 4-star review would attract my attention.
I don't mean to sound so negative, but I honestly would rather see other games featured. Not because they're more deserving or some nonsense like that, but because Pom has received more exposure than most developers ever dream of. If not for that, I'd actually be in favor of it. The game has more going for it than an outside glance would suggest.
But it has more views and downloads than any other game on RMN, has been at the top of RMN's buzzing list for months, and giving it any more than it already has is beating a dead horse harder than this whole discussion.
author=Solitayre
I kinda dislike this attitude we have about games that get popular.
I'm completely ambivalent about featuring Pom. I haven't played the game myself.
author=slashphoenix
Anyway, RMN does do a lot to promote hidden gems and other less popular/viral games.
We feature games that are unique and awesome in their own way. Not through their download count/popularity. Like something that you can proudly say this is a staple of good gameplay. Idk, play POM so you can see why I wouldn't really recommend it since it doesn't really count as an awesometastic indie game despite its charm? I wouldn't want people to start making games with bad grammar even though it's intentional in PoM's case. But PoM's battles aren't well thought out too, there's no deep mechanics and you just mash attack or not because of story reasons.
Don't get me wrong, I LIKE Pom for what it is, but I think we're doing the indie game community a disservice for featuring it due to some of the reasons listed above and not listed. We're featuring this because it's cute and popular, not because of how it is as a game.
Like seriously, when we see a featured game, we want more games like that. Do you want more games like Pom Gets Wifi? Because honestly I want more AAG or ABL classics than cutesy, dawww, joke games.
ubon
66
author=halibabicafrom SatedI get the feeling this (and its comments) would be an amusing read.
maybe I should review Pom so it has a(nother) review with something approaching an accurate score...
I get the feeling we need another ~*~super cool irreverent misanthrope~*~ who ~*~tells it like it is~*~ about a well-trod subject like we all need more holes in our heads. curb your narcissism and spare us from something I can already practically anticipate word for word.
e: also I could really go for more cutesy dawww joke games, honestly! pretenders to the whole 'serious magnum opus' throne are generally super-tacky and horrible. it all hinges on execution, obviously, but people are a little less likely to disappear up their own asses when they aren't working under the illusion that they're god's gift to games.
author=mawk
e: also I could really go for more cutesy dawww joke games, honestly! pretenders to the whole 'serious magnum opus' throne are generally super-tacky and horrible.
eh, I like battles and well thought out game mechanics than casual games that you beat in less than an hour and here have some dialogue that isn't so serious. I mean at least Pom has character development and some semblance of a story, but it's not something I'd call a featured game. We might as well feature Heir of the King and 7Towers.
ubon
66
sure, but it's at least earnest. since you mention it, I legitimately have no respect for A Blurred Line (and a few other idolized rm games), because without the nostalgia it's really just a horribly pretentious re-tread of a lot of typical dystopian cyberpunk plot points with bonus coolkid-luddite nonsense thrown in around Paradise. it's an aimless, heartless muddle of popular 'mature' subjects thrown around in a way the author thought would become popular.
while I agree that pom shouldn't be featured, I don't believe that relative seriousness should be at all a necessity for these things. when rm kids try to be serious, their heads inflate and they float away to a world where it's impossible to look at your own work objectively. it's exactly why 'magnum opus' has become a pejorative. we already heavily encourage horrible cargo-cult philosophies, and without some variety in our scope we'll never change that.
e: I guess what I'm saying is that we basically agree insofar as these things should be examined based on their content rather than their tone or the hype surrounding them. in doing so, though, we need to be careful that we're not just encouraging people to retread things we're nostalgic for -- because that accomplishes exactly the opposite.
while I agree that pom shouldn't be featured, I don't believe that relative seriousness should be at all a necessity for these things. when rm kids try to be serious, their heads inflate and they float away to a world where it's impossible to look at your own work objectively. it's exactly why 'magnum opus' has become a pejorative. we already heavily encourage horrible cargo-cult philosophies, and without some variety in our scope we'll never change that.
e: I guess what I'm saying is that we basically agree insofar as these things should be examined based on their content rather than their tone or the hype surrounding them. in doing so, though, we need to be careful that we're not just encouraging people to retread things we're nostalgic for -- because that accomplishes exactly the opposite.
author=mawk
sure, but it's at least earnest. since you mention it, I legitimately have no respect for A Blurred Line (and a few other idolized rm games), because without the nostalgia it's really just a horribly pretentious re-tread of a lot of typical dystopian cyberpunk plot points with bonus coolkid-luddite nonsense thrown in around Paradise. it's an aimless, heartless muddle of popular 'mature' subjects thrown around in a way the author thought would become popular.
I view ABL in a more game mechanic sense and how it applied multiple routes without going into the route that your choices doesn't matter aside from the ending and a few changes to scenes. ABL took that off the rails. I also like how it -tried- with the battle system. (I'm not a huge fan of Ara Fell though but that's a story for another time if we're talking about Classics)
AAG however was a labor of love.
eplipswich
2728
I think I would vote for either Homework Salesman or Heartache 101, but preferably the former.
ubon
66
I actually don't know what AAG stands for, come to think of it! or maybe I do but just forgot or something stupid like that. what is it?
author=mawk
e: also I could really go for more cutesy dawww joke games, honestly! pretenders to the whole 'serious magnum opus' throne are generally super-tacky and horrible. it all hinges on execution, obviously, but people are a little less likely to disappear up their own asses when they aren't working under the illusion that they're god's gift to games.
Isn't there already enough of those? Chrono Trigger (lolselfplugin), The New Desciples, Very Retrouville (to an extent)? The only thing that makes Pom distinguishable is that it actually pulls it off well. Despite this, Pom still fails at being an actual game. By adventure game standards, it was VERY bare bones and the in-game battles did nothing but stall the progression, and the fact that it was done 3 times in this made the "humor" associated with these fights get stale, fast. THAT is why I am heavily against it getting featured. The games that get spotlight demonstrate something that other developers can strive to achieve for. Pom just doesn't.
author=Archeia_Nessiah
We might as well feature Heir of the King and 7Towers.
- OPEN THE FLOODGATES!
And mawk, AAG stands for Alter A.I.L.A. Genesis created by Neok a few years back. (And yes, it is a fantastic game.)
If Pom DOES manage to get featured (not bloody likely at this point), we should put an asterisk besides it, kind of like how the hall of fame does it for most of their controversial athletes that manage to make it into the hall.
You guys make great fantastic points about why Pom should get featured and why it shouldn’t. That’s what I love about this whole discussion; everybody’s got a valid opinion. I say to end this, Kentona should just flip a coin and bare all the responsibility that comes with it. If it doesn't get featured - no problem. If it does get featured, sure there will be some minor rioting - but the site's traffic will increase and we'll get some more
ubon
66
author=Ratty524
Isn't there already enough of those?
I didn't know there was such a thing as 'enough' games!
and yeah, pom's execution had room for improvement, which is exactly why I said it shouldn't be featured. I definitely believe that games like pom and very retrouvaille and ghost party have their merits, though, and their place in game development.
the idea that simple but earnest games are some kind of fad and that the only games worthy for true consideration are cargo-cult magnum opuses is a little bit choking, don't you think? look past the veneer of respectability and engage with each game for what it is and how it's made and what kind of heart it has. dig?
author=mawk
I didn't know there was such a thing as 'enough' games!
and yeah, pom's execution had room for improvement, which is exactly why I said it shouldn't be featured. I definitely believe that games like pom and very retrouvaille and ghost party have their merits, though, and their place in game development.
the idea that simple but earnest games are some kind of fad and that the only games worthy for true consideration are cargo-cult magnum opuses is a little bit choking, don't you think? look past the veneer of respectability and engage with each game for what it is and how it's made and what kind of heart it has. dig?
I dig, mawk. My point was that games like Pom are actually nothing new in this, or any RPG Maker community's history, and we wouldn't be missing out on them if the game doesn't get featured.
Otherwise I do agree with you. It could be that I'm easily impressed, but I think you don't need to make a huge masterpiece of a project to make an enjoyable game. Heck, I had way more fun playing games short, simplistic games like Ankharia or Finstermen than some of the more overblown, story-driven RPG demos. I feel like if there is anything wrong with the community as a whole, is that more people put the bulk of their effort into a "compelling" storyline and a lot of the things the new final fantasy games are doing and not enough into how the game plays, which to me is very important because you are making a GAME to begin with.
On a side note, there are plenty of "simple but earnest games" that were already featured at some point (Ankharia comes up again, Pengui, and Super RMN All-Stars to name a few), so I don't think it's as big of an issue in this community as you make it out to be.
Actually, a lot of featured games end up being short, punchy, and sometimes quirky games. Particularly contest winners, if only because they're more likely to actually be completed.
