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Alichains
637
Alichains
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CloseI've generally found that when people complain about "radical Feminist", they're never talking about the actual radicals, bit rather anyone who dares point out that there might actually be a problem. I've long since learned not to take any claims about radical feminism or "Political Correctness(Read: Being a decent human being) seriously.
@Pianotm Correct me If I'm wrong, but aren't people getting worked because they think she claimed that men are inherently violent and she actually said something closer to "violent media normalizes violent behavior". I find this hilarious because I had to read a book for a 100 level history class (Demonic Males by Richard W. Wrangham) that claimed exactly that. Of course since the author and professor are both male...
Breitbart quotemined a woman named Shirley Sherrod in order to make her seem like she was racist against white people, which got her fired. As you can probably guess, Breitbart is about as far away from ethical journalism as you can possibly get.
@Pianotm Correct me If I'm wrong, but aren't people getting worked because they think she claimed that men are inherently violent and she actually said something closer to "violent media normalizes violent behavior". I find this hilarious because I had to read a book for a 100 level history class (Demonic Males by Richard W. Wrangham) that claimed exactly that. Of course since the author and professor are both male...
Actually, yes. I will straight up admit I'll need insight on this if only because the way I gather news is odd to begin with
Breitbart quotemined a woman named Shirley Sherrod in order to make her seem like she was racist against white people, which got her fired. As you can probably guess, Breitbart is about as far away from ethical journalism as you can possibly get.
author=slashphoenix
There are some pretty extreme feminists out there, but Anita ain't one of 'em. TERFs, though...
The main problem with Sarkeesian is that like her direct predecessor (Sarkeesian 1.0) one Jack "Murder Simulator" Thompson, she is a lying, lying, liar.
@Alichains:
"Political Correctness(Read: Being a decent human being)
Oh yeah, there is so much correlation between Political Correctness and being a decent human being that it's not completely insane to read one for the other.
Seriously, what you are saying when you say "I've long since learned not to take any claims about X seriously" is "I am indoctrinated to see only one side of this issue".
author=Alichains
I've long since learned not to take any claims about rape or "sexual assault" seriously.
Replace X with, say, "rape" and do you see how problematic this is kind of indoctrination is? (I'd have gone with the Holocaust instead, but did not want to invoke Godwins.)
author=slashphoenix
I find it really odd that Anita is treated as this radical feminist when her clips on video games are just pointing out examples of sexist cliches in games. The videos even start with her saying that the point is not to make people feel guilty for playing those games, but rather just to get people to realize that the cliches are there in the first place.
There are some pretty extreme feminists out there, but Anita ain't one of 'em. TERFs, though...
I apologize if I made it seem that way, I don't really think Anita is extremist- at least not as much as the really bad examples. I just don't pay a lot of attention to radicals so I have no names to give.
I DO however dislike Anita, and think that she cherry picks and over-exaggerates a lot. To me it feels like she's somewhat blinded by her own beliefs on the subject. Also, while not at all something she can control, her fanbase is a pretty toxic group of people that's overjoyed at the opportunity to throw even mildly incorrect depictions of women under the bus as if they were the scum of the Earth.
(I've been witness to someone calling Pom-Pom from the recent Mario games "incredibly sexist". Fucking Pom-Pom.)
Alichains
637
Replace X with, say, "rape" and do you see how problematic this is kind of indoctrination is? (I'd have gone with the Holocaust instead, but did not want to invoke Godwins.)
Congratulations. you do algebra. Unfortunately it doesn't make it a valid point.
up. So she's like 90% of the people on Youtube. How terrible...
I don't know if you have like...statistics...that 90% of people on YouTube are liars, or whatever but if that were true...yes, it would not be good. Because lying is not good. Is Anita Sarkeesian the only liar? No. Is she the only liar with way too much media attention using her lies and media attention to attack videogames in a puritanical, misleading, and reductionist way? Yes. And that is also not good. Sarkeesian is Jack Thompson in stupid hoop earrings.
And algebra makes a valid point in this case because some mindsets are problematic no matter what they are applied to! Saying "I've long since learned not to take claims about X seriously" is problematic where X is any real observable phenomenon, including radical feminists being despicable.
And algebra makes a valid point in this case because some mindsets are problematic no matter what they are applied to! Saying "I've long since learned not to take claims about X seriously" is problematic where X is any real observable phenomenon, including radical feminists being despicable.
author=Alichains
up. So she's like 90% of the people on Youtube. How terrible...
This is really grabbing at straws. Even IF that made up on the spot statistic were true, being a part of a large group of bad people doesn't make you less of a bad person.
author=Alichains
Breitbart quotemined a woman named Shirley Sherrod in order to make her seem like she was racist against white people, which got her fired. As you can probably guess, Breitbart is about as far away from ethical journalism as you can possibly get.
Yes, yes.. I actually read up on that one a bit after I posted the reply..
This is why I don't gather my news from one, or even a few sources. I aggregate news/opinions from as many places as I can find it and (after tossing out the more extreme ones) form an opinion based on that
Which is what sort of peeves me off on GG: all I can get are damn harassment narratives from the main news sources and blogs while it's difficult to find enough neutral/not-horridly-biased pro- articles and blogs. I don't care if all MSM demonizes something/someone, I still want to know all the neutral/pro shit on the story else my opinion can become horridly skewed.
she actually said something closer to "violent media normalizes violent behavior". I find this hilarious because I had to read a book for a 100 level history class (Demonic Males by Richard W. Wrangham) that claimed exactly that. Of course since the author and professor are both male...
I play/watch violent media and yet all I can usually muster are a few angry words. It's a case-by-case thing, IMO. Some will be influenced by what they play/watch and others, well, won't. It's still horridly wrong to say "Well X just shot up a school, and he so happens to have a copy of DOOM.. THE GAME TOTALLY MADE HIM DO IT! IT INFLUENCED HIM TO DO BAD!" or "HE'S A GAMER! THAT MEANS GAMES MAKE PEOPLE VIOLENT ARAGHAGH" without anything to seriously back that up (because a lot of the time it turns out that the kid was going through some serious shit before they snapped)
Granted you may or may not have been arguing that point, I still find the claim to not hold much weight as of yet.
>So this may end up being the longest thread on the forum...
Shit, Doom nothing. I once watched a prosecutor accuse a boy who murdered his sister of being influenced by Final Fantasy VII. She pointed out that it was the boy's favorite game, and that these "devilish video games" (exact words) were all evil and conditioned people to seek a target and destroy it.
Hasn't it been proven time and again by studies that violent media, especially games can reduce violent urges? If you have a non-life threatening, non-anything threatening way to let out your anger then it's probably the better choice.
It's like how cursing helps alleviate anger better than making up "nice swears" like "poop" and "darn" and shit like that.
It's like how cursing helps alleviate anger better than making up "nice swears" like "poop" and "darn" and shit like that.
author=Pizza
Hasn't it been proven time and again by studies that violent media, especially games can reduce violent urges? If you have a non-life threatening, non-anything threatening way to let out your anger then it's probably the better choice.
It's like how cursing helps alleviate anger better than making up "nice swears" like "poop" and "darn" and shit like that.
That's why they call it pseudo-science.
Alichains
637
I'll admit I posted a little too emotionally there.
I wasn't. I admit to not being terribly familiar with Anita, I've never seen her videos and I probably won't. The thing is though, people seem rather quick to assume the worst of her (Like immediately assuming that she faked being threatened out of her home rather than what actually happened, which is that the case got sent to the feds), to the point where many of them seem just as dishonest, if not more so than they claim Anita to be.
Honestly, given how emotionally charged this issue is, it might be better to just lock the thread and let everything cool down for a while.
I wasn't. I admit to not being terribly familiar with Anita, I've never seen her videos and I probably won't. The thing is though, people seem rather quick to assume the worst of her (Like immediately assuming that she faked being threatened out of her home rather than what actually happened, which is that the case got sent to the feds), to the point where many of them seem just as dishonest, if not more so than they claim Anita to be.
Honestly, given how emotionally charged this issue is, it might be better to just lock the thread and let everything cool down for a while.
I admit to not being terribly familiar with Anita, I've never seen her videos and I probably won't. The thing is though, people seem rather quick to assume the worst of her (Like immediately assuming that she faked being threatened out of her home rather than what actually happened, which is that the case got sent to the feds), to the point where many of them seem just as dishonest, if not more so than they claim Anita to be.
Personally, I didn't form any opinions about Sarkeesian until I was able to develop my informed opinion. (With the exception of the gut reaction of WHY DOES ANYONE EVER NEED 160,000 TO MAKE FUCKING YOUTUBE VIDEOS WHY GOD WHY? that is.)
And I think this thread has been--with one exception--reasonably civil so far.
author=pianotm
Shit, Doom nothing. I once watched a prosecutor accuse a boy who murdered his sister of being influenced by Final Fantasy VII. She pointed out that it was the boy's favorite game, and that these "devilish video games" (exact words) were all evil and conditioned people to seek a target and destroy it.
author=Pizza
Hasn't it been proven time and again by studies that violent media, especially games can reduce violent urges?
Highly Relevant Video
Honestly, given how emotionally charged this issue is, it might be better to just lock the thread and let everything cool down for a while.
Perhaps not a lock, but let everyone disperse for a while and focus on something else (didn't that Revive the Dead contest finish recently?) then come back when/if something else occurs that's related to the matter
I know I should do this personally, for shizzle. But I don't think the thread needs a formal cooldown.
author=Max McGee
Personally, I didn't form any opinions about Sarkeesian until I was able to develop my informed opinion. (With the exception of the gut reaction of WHY DOES ANYONE EVER NEED 160,000 TO MAKE FUCKING YOUTUBE VIDEOS WHY GOD WHY? that is.)
Just so it's clear, she didn't need $160k, she convinced people to give her that much. I think the KS goal was under $2000.
EdgeOfChaos
1755
author=Liberty
As a feminist, I don't like how you think, Keinor. It's pretty insulting - because there are reasons for feminism to exist. Many, many of them.
I think this guy says it best, though:
So, you know, if you're really all for equality perhaps you should recheck what you think you know about feminism, what it means and how it works. After all, Westbarrow Baptist Church is not all of Christianity - just as mysoginistic assholes aren't all of the male population or mysadrist crazy ladies aren't all of the feminist agenda.
That seems to be a criticism of the MRA movement more than a defense of feminism. So, it doesn't really convince me as I already believe both are problematic. You don't have to either be an mra or a feminist.
That said, most of the claims made are utter nonsense. Of course I can think of ways I've been insulted not relating me to women. How about "nerd" or "no life" - frequently used online. Asshole, moron, etc... No, society doesn't "fucking hate" women, it's claims like this that make people not take feminism seriously...
Nerd, moron, asshole and no life are just as likely to be thrown at a woman as a man - I've been called them all more than once in my life. The person in question is talking about the complaints men make about that are different to ones that women get called. :/
And don't bother answering to me please. I've enough of your 'wah men wah' attitude every time I bring up valid points so I am choosing to ignore you.
Guys - that is an option. The site allows you to ignore people so if you're getting steamed/annoyed by someone ignore them for a while. It works wonders for your mental health.
Hover over the name of the person in question and click the Ignore link that appears.
And don't bother answering to me please. I've enough of your 'wah men wah' attitude every time I bring up valid points so I am choosing to ignore you.
Guys - that is an option. The site allows you to ignore people so if you're getting steamed/annoyed by someone ignore them for a while. It works wonders for your mental health.
Hover over the name of the person in question and click the Ignore link that appears.
EdgeOfChaos
1755
Again, I was addressing: "Can you think of a way you have been mocked that hasn't been related to something a misogynist society sees as feminizing" - the things I brought up obviously fit that.
author=LibertyYou claim society hates women and how much it sucks to be a woman, and I'm the one whining? Alright then. Your "valid points" seem to be "Society hates men!!", in which case, yes I will reject them. Anyways, I don't care if you are ignoring me, it's important to get this out in case anyone actually believes what they're reading.
And don't bother answering to me please. I've enough of your 'wah men wah' attitude every time I bring up valid points so I am choosing to ignore you.
TheNecromancer
3160
The only thing this thread will accomplish is to create bad blood between users. It's already clearly happening. Nothing will change because of this "discussion". No awareness of important issues(since this is a discussion between people who already consider themselves aware). No positive change to the attitudes of the people with harmful behavior. That seems to be a recurring theme of this whole GG thing.
I've been reading off and on and it all sounds like nonsense to me! This is starting to give me the same shuddering feeling as when I read comments on youtube videos or CBC news stories :/ Which is a first for RMN forum talk.
I'm not suggesting locking or stopping the discussion or anything like that. Just relaying my disappointment. Carry on.
I've been reading off and on and it all sounds like nonsense to me! This is starting to give me the same shuddering feeling as when I read comments on youtube videos or CBC news stories :/ Which is a first for RMN forum talk.
I'm not suggesting locking or stopping the discussion or anything like that. Just relaying my disappointment. Carry on.
