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WHAT DO PEOPLE CARE ABOUT?
Posts
kentona
View playlists
CloseI always get philosophical about RMN when I chat with Solitayre on IRC. Anywho, the discussion led to assessing the current state of RMN, the state of the overall community, n00bs and their view on it all, how to get more people to RMN, Players vs Developers, reviews, staff and what it means, reviewing standards, and site mergers.
The point of all that is: What do people care about? Specifically, why do you come to RMN? What is it are you looking for? Do you find it? What would you like more of? What could you do without? Here I am thinking about what the site offers, and what you think it offers and how well it does in providing that need.
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me:
1. I like to show off my game(s), especially when they are in the midst of development. I thrive on the feedback they get and love the various input and suggestions I get from people to help improve the game. I really appreciate it when someone plays my game and lets me know about it, and am always flattered that they took the time to write a review. I like that my game was recognized in the Misaos. It makes me feel good to know that I've drawn people to RMN because they've played my game and enjoyed it.
2. It always impresses me to see the volume of reviews that RMN's community has generated. I know that some people think there is a pathetic lack of reviews (and in a strict sense, that is accurate) BUT it could be wayyy worse and has been far worse at other sites I've seen. I think we could do more to encourage more reviews though.
3. I would like to see a greater sense of fostering new developers. We could probably be a leader in this regard - encouraging new people to play and make games - but there doesn't seem to be a drive to do this. We have a pretty good collection of articles. Maybe we should make IRC roundtables a regular thing?
4. I care about events and the community. Its fun for me to run or participate in events that get peopel together making games. Action 52, Befuddle Quest, Release Something - I think they are great community building exercises.
5. I care about celebrating the games that merit them. I promote things like the Misaos and Staff Choice Awards because I feel it is important to officially acknowledge great games in some capacity or another. It is like an affirmation of quality.
6. I wish that we could get more players here at RMN, but I fear that there just isn't some mythical player base out there. We (mostly) make RPGs of the 2D top down variety - inherently "oldschool" niche in an already niched game genre (RPGs). Maybe we shouldn't devote so much time to trying to capture that and work instead on just making RMN better for the existing base?
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Anwyho, I rambled a bit. I want to know What do you care about when it comes to RPG making, RMN, RM scene, games in general?
The point of all that is: What do people care about? Specifically, why do you come to RMN? What is it are you looking for? Do you find it? What would you like more of? What could you do without? Here I am thinking about what the site offers, and what you think it offers and how well it does in providing that need.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
me:
1. I like to show off my game(s), especially when they are in the midst of development. I thrive on the feedback they get and love the various input and suggestions I get from people to help improve the game. I really appreciate it when someone plays my game and lets me know about it, and am always flattered that they took the time to write a review. I like that my game was recognized in the Misaos. It makes me feel good to know that I've drawn people to RMN because they've played my game and enjoyed it.
2. It always impresses me to see the volume of reviews that RMN's community has generated. I know that some people think there is a pathetic lack of reviews (and in a strict sense, that is accurate) BUT it could be wayyy worse and has been far worse at other sites I've seen. I think we could do more to encourage more reviews though.
3. I would like to see a greater sense of fostering new developers. We could probably be a leader in this regard - encouraging new people to play and make games - but there doesn't seem to be a drive to do this. We have a pretty good collection of articles. Maybe we should make IRC roundtables a regular thing?
4. I care about events and the community. Its fun for me to run or participate in events that get peopel together making games. Action 52, Befuddle Quest, Release Something - I think they are great community building exercises.
5. I care about celebrating the games that merit them. I promote things like the Misaos and Staff Choice Awards because I feel it is important to officially acknowledge great games in some capacity or another. It is like an affirmation of quality.
6. I wish that we could get more players here at RMN, but I fear that there just isn't some mythical player base out there. We (mostly) make RPGs of the 2D top down variety - inherently "oldschool" niche in an already niched game genre (RPGs). Maybe we shouldn't devote so much time to trying to capture that and work instead on just making RMN better for the existing base?
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Anwyho, I rambled a bit. I want to know What do you care about when it comes to RPG making, RMN, RM scene, games in general?
i will take the helm and field the inevitable response of 'nothing'. you may now continue the topic in peace
I come to RMN so that I can have a free place to upload my games, and earn a good chunk of server space by doing so. I care about how easy it is for me to do the former, and how visible my game is so that I can get more of the latter.
catmitts
4862
Who cares! I don't! Go jump in a bog! There is no family on this planet that will not taste the sting of my wrath!
I mainly like getting game critiques and reviews and things because I'm a whore but idk I would kind of like to talk about game design ideas and creativity and weirdness and stuff and uh it'd be nice to bring up ideas like this without having to get in some stupid debate about ORIGINALITY DOESNT MEAN GOOD or JUST MAKE FUN GAMES. Hey guys we're messing around with a whole new medium and there's a bunch of really interesting concepts and thoughts to kick around on basically every aspect of designJUST MAKE GOOD GAMES. Sometimes I will make a halfhearted attempt to talk about this stuff but there never seem to be enough common issues to get anywhere and it always turns very defensive. Mostly I hang around because I remember people from GW and I'm interested in seeing what everyone's up to.
I mainly like getting game critiques and reviews and things because I'm a whore but idk I would kind of like to talk about game design ideas and creativity and weirdness and stuff and uh it'd be nice to bring up ideas like this without having to get in some stupid debate about ORIGINALITY DOESNT MEAN GOOD or JUST MAKE FUN GAMES. Hey guys we're messing around with a whole new medium and there's a bunch of really interesting concepts and thoughts to kick around on basically every aspect of designJUST MAKE GOOD GAMES. Sometimes I will make a halfhearted attempt to talk about this stuff but there never seem to be enough common issues to get anywhere and it always turns very defensive. Mostly I hang around because I remember people from GW and I'm interested in seeing what everyone's up to.
Lennon
88
1. I care about originality. Fangames make me want to puke, to be honest.
2. I care about people being good members I guess, as in, not gloating or being egotistical about their projects, and not being jerks.
3. I care about being willing to accept criticism. People who shrug off criticisms bug me.
4. Finally, I care about "professionalism". I know this is an amateur community, but I expect people to try and make their game the best it can be in all aspects.
EDIT: Also, I care about not being picky. IE not using the engine its made in or the genre or anything like that to say a game is bad.
Maybe my list is bad but thats all I really think that I care enough about to post.
2. I care about people being good members I guess, as in, not gloating or being egotistical about their projects, and not being jerks.
3. I care about being willing to accept criticism. People who shrug off criticisms bug me.
4. Finally, I care about "professionalism". I know this is an amateur community, but I expect people to try and make their game the best it can be in all aspects.
EDIT: Also, I care about not being picky. IE not using the engine its made in or the genre or anything like that to say a game is bad.
Maybe my list is bad but thats all I really think that I care enough about to post.
StormriderAngel
100
Hmm definitely your number one(although unlike you i haven't much to show for my efforts yet) but I do thrive on feedback and hearing what people have to say, whether it's positive or negative(unless it's spam or joke comments). But even more so I like coming here to hear peoples opinions on other games and game design in general. Although most of the time, opinions seems to be relatively the same on what's good and what's crap, I learned tons just from lurking and reading though posts.
To be perfectly honest I would like to see a little less screwing around and spiteful arguments among members and more thought put into the subject at hand. Not to say I'm looking for all "serious business" topics or for topics to stay stagnant, but more focus on the game design subject and less of the personal opinions of another person.
I also would like to attempt to help out and be more active on the community when I'm not working on my game or playing someone else's. I've been sort of selfish in that way that I thrive on comments and give nothing back. Hey I'm working on it...slowly >.>
To be perfectly honest I would like to see a little less screwing around and spiteful arguments among members and more thought put into the subject at hand. Not to say I'm looking for all "serious business" topics or for topics to stay stagnant, but more focus on the game design subject and less of the personal opinions of another person.
I also would like to attempt to help out and be more active on the community when I'm not working on my game or playing someone else's. I've been sort of selfish in that way that I thrive on comments and give nothing back. Hey I'm working on it...slowly >.>
"We believe in nothing Lebowski!"
Ahem (honesty):
1. I want an audience to play and like my games. When my games are warmly and enthusiastically received, I like RMN. When my games are ignored or derided, I hate RMN. Anything in between is...anything in between. RMN, like the RPG Maker program, is an intermediary between my mind and the public, first and foremost. So...basically I would like RMN more if more people liked/played my games. This means trying to win misaos, trying to get featured game, with most things I release. Of course this isn't purely an ego trip, nor is it just a desperate desire for validation of the incredible effort I put into game making. It is because...this is something (in the broadest possible sense: be creative) I want to do for a living eventually. Having a demonstrable, established user base in any way, shape, or form is important. And if I can get that from doing something I love anyway...
2. I really am amazed at how much I can be entertained by playing other indie games. The quality of some of them is through the roof and even the mediocre ones are better than bad commerical games. This delights me.
3. I care about events and the community. Its fun for me to run or participate in events that get peopel together making/reviewing games.
5. I care about celebrating the games that merit them but I wish the Misaos did a better job of that. Right now I feel they are fairly broken. The same goes for the featured game.
6. "I wish that we could get more players here at RMN, but I fear that there just isn't some mythical player base out there."
I disagree. The mythical playerbase is there. They are the hundred people who download any given game for every ONE person who leaves a comment. I think the issue isn't attracting them, I think the issue is making them more vocal.
7. Like lennon I care about originality, being nice/pleasant (this community has an almost critical deficiency in that sometimes) and to some degree "professionalism". People who are nice to me, in particular, are golden. When people are mean to me, I want to leave (except for the part of me that wants to stay out of pure spite).
8. Heart and Soul. I would rather play a sloppy game that has heart than a polished one with no soul.
9. -Graphics. In a mathematical sense. I don't care about graphics. I really don't.
10. Writing. I want to play a game that will take me to a world and introduce me to characters I care about, that I have never seen before. I want to constantly hone my craft.
11. Mechanics. I want to play games with awesome numbers that are furiously addictive. I want to constantly hone my craft.
12. Wow this is really gay but I care about caring. I like seeing topics like this that indicate that some people have thoughts and feelings about the community and are not nihilists like, say, geodude.
Lucky Number 13. I LOVE writing reviews. I really care about giving valuable advice to developing developers (lol) and entertaining the community while I'm at it. Fortunately, all of my reviews have been really well received by the game's authors so I would probably love this less if that wasn't the case. I don't like it when my reviews are accepted and then denied after the fact for mystery reasons that seem highly subjective. Shouldn't they be denied during the submission process so I can work on them a little, fix wat's wrong, and submit them again? But more importantly, the only reason I don't write more reviews is that I don't enjoy playing a game when I am reviewing it...even if it is a good game and will get a good review. Having to make notes and take screenshots and look at everything critically really, really takes me out of the experience. This is the reason I haven't played more of Outlaw City.
Ahem (honesty):
1. I want an audience to play and like my games. When my games are warmly and enthusiastically received, I like RMN. When my games are ignored or derided, I hate RMN. Anything in between is...anything in between. RMN, like the RPG Maker program, is an intermediary between my mind and the public, first and foremost. So...basically I would like RMN more if more people liked/played my games. This means trying to win misaos, trying to get featured game, with most things I release. Of course this isn't purely an ego trip, nor is it just a desperate desire for validation of the incredible effort I put into game making. It is because...this is something (in the broadest possible sense: be creative) I want to do for a living eventually. Having a demonstrable, established user base in any way, shape, or form is important. And if I can get that from doing something I love anyway...
2. I really am amazed at how much I can be entertained by playing other indie games. The quality of some of them is through the roof and even the mediocre ones are better than bad commerical games. This delights me.
3. I care about events and the community. Its fun for me to run or participate in events that get peopel together making/reviewing games.
5. I care about celebrating the games that merit them but I wish the Misaos did a better job of that. Right now I feel they are fairly broken. The same goes for the featured game.
6. "I wish that we could get more players here at RMN, but I fear that there just isn't some mythical player base out there."
I disagree. The mythical playerbase is there. They are the hundred people who download any given game for every ONE person who leaves a comment. I think the issue isn't attracting them, I think the issue is making them more vocal.
7. Like lennon I care about originality, being nice/pleasant (this community has an almost critical deficiency in that sometimes) and to some degree "professionalism". People who are nice to me, in particular, are golden. When people are mean to me, I want to leave (except for the part of me that wants to stay out of pure spite).
8. Heart and Soul. I would rather play a sloppy game that has heart than a polished one with no soul.
9. -Graphics. In a mathematical sense. I don't care about graphics. I really don't.
10. Writing. I want to play a game that will take me to a world and introduce me to characters I care about, that I have never seen before. I want to constantly hone my craft.
11. Mechanics. I want to play games with awesome numbers that are furiously addictive. I want to constantly hone my craft.
12. Wow this is really gay but I care about caring. I like seeing topics like this that indicate that some people have thoughts and feelings about the community and are not nihilists like, say, geodude.
Lucky Number 13. I LOVE writing reviews. I really care about giving valuable advice to developing developers (lol) and entertaining the community while I'm at it. Fortunately, all of my reviews have been really well received by the game's authors so I would probably love this less if that wasn't the case. I don't like it when my reviews are accepted and then denied after the fact for mystery reasons that seem highly subjective. Shouldn't they be denied during the submission process so I can work on them a little, fix wat's wrong, and submit them again? But more importantly, the only reason I don't write more reviews is that I don't enjoy playing a game when I am reviewing it...even if it is a good game and will get a good review. Having to make notes and take screenshots and look at everything critically really, really takes me out of the experience. This is the reason I haven't played more of Outlaw City.
See, I don't care so much for the games themselves since I don't make the time to play them. I hope that people don't take that the wrong way because I simply don't take the time to play ANY games, RM or commercial or otherwise. Maybe I am bad for the community?
And I don't care for the cynicism and crassitude, but I can tolerate it. What I can't stand is apathy. Maybe its because I have an overabundance of passion for designing my own RPGs, but it bugs me that people don't want to have their say or add any input on something (even topics like these!) for whatever reason! "I don't have anything to contribute" is not only a terrible attitude, but wrong!
And I don't care for the cynicism and crassitude, but I can tolerate it. What I can't stand is apathy. Maybe its because I have an overabundance of passion for designing my own RPGs, but it bugs me that people don't want to have their say or add any input on something (even topics like these!) for whatever reason! "I don't have anything to contribute" is not only a terrible attitude, but wrong!
Good topic. I won't comment much on what other people are saying, but I am reading everything. Here's what I care about:
Other people playing my games, first and foremost. I don't think it's selfish or egocentric, it's just obvious. I don't make games for me, I make them for people to play. Doesn't mean I work in every aspect of the game trying to please people, but... well, I think the final product is always supposed to be fun for others. I like people to play my games, read my reviews, and comment on my posts. Yes sir, I do.
In that aspect, I'm not really pleased. I feel that a lot of what I do is overlooked, or plainly ignored. I don't take it personal, I don't think RMN dislikes me, it's just that I'm not part of the very small group that gets massive input and feedback on everything they do. I'm part of the very large group that dwells in the shadows of RMN. And by that I mean people care too much about what they're doing, and not enough about what other people are doing. That's a huge tendency I've been noticing, and it has to do with us not having many players. Well, we have a lot of people, but these people are not motivated to play other people's stuff.
I care about a positive attitude towards gamemaking. When kentona made the Culture of crass, apathy and cynicism topic, I was one of the first to reply, and I said something like "I don't see any of it, RMN is beautiful". But that's not my opinion anymore. I've been witnessing too much cynicism, too much harshness, and too little helpfulness. I'm not gonna repeat what's been said on the topic mentioned above. It's just that people seem to enjoy themselves more by showing apparent superiority by making mean comments on noob projects than actually trying to help those projects. And the meanest people are the ones who don't even seem to like playing stuff. What I'm saying is that I feel a generalized disdain for amateur games, even in a community like this. I care about this attitude.
I care about fun, not only playing games, but writing/reading reviews, topics, etc. This is just a hobbie for most of us, so no reason to be too serious about everything. I have no complaints about this.
I am a psychologist, and I see rpgmaker (and amateur gamemaking in general) as a fantastic instrument of projection and expression, so I care about how much I can get to know the game creator by playing his game. That's the reason I don't like cliches, or RTPs, or fangames, or overused stuff in general. They don't tell me anything about the guy behind the game. I'm not saying I try to analyze people through their games. I just like to get the sense of humanity from the game... the same sense you get when you're reading a good book, or looking at a crazy drawing. That's why I like original, not just because it's different, but because it reflects something that's personal to the gamemaker guy, not just to gamemaking standards. That's why I love games like catmitts's.
I care about events, awards, and stuff, but just because they make everything else make more sense.
I also really like writing/reading reviews. Not just to give feedback (because some times the guy who made the game doesn't read them or care about them), but I feel like they're a great opportunity to talk about gamemaking in general based on something concrete. They're way more productive than abstract forum topics.
I care about quality. I like custom systems, polished graphics, a nice soundtrack, smooth gameplay, intelligent writing... I love all of that. Yes sir, I do.
Other people playing my games, first and foremost. I don't think it's selfish or egocentric, it's just obvious. I don't make games for me, I make them for people to play. Doesn't mean I work in every aspect of the game trying to please people, but... well, I think the final product is always supposed to be fun for others. I like people to play my games, read my reviews, and comment on my posts. Yes sir, I do.
In that aspect, I'm not really pleased. I feel that a lot of what I do is overlooked, or plainly ignored. I don't take it personal, I don't think RMN dislikes me, it's just that I'm not part of the very small group that gets massive input and feedback on everything they do. I'm part of the very large group that dwells in the shadows of RMN. And by that I mean people care too much about what they're doing, and not enough about what other people are doing. That's a huge tendency I've been noticing, and it has to do with us not having many players. Well, we have a lot of people, but these people are not motivated to play other people's stuff.
I care about a positive attitude towards gamemaking. When kentona made the Culture of crass, apathy and cynicism topic, I was one of the first to reply, and I said something like "I don't see any of it, RMN is beautiful". But that's not my opinion anymore. I've been witnessing too much cynicism, too much harshness, and too little helpfulness. I'm not gonna repeat what's been said on the topic mentioned above. It's just that people seem to enjoy themselves more by showing apparent superiority by making mean comments on noob projects than actually trying to help those projects. And the meanest people are the ones who don't even seem to like playing stuff. What I'm saying is that I feel a generalized disdain for amateur games, even in a community like this. I care about this attitude.
I care about fun, not only playing games, but writing/reading reviews, topics, etc. This is just a hobbie for most of us, so no reason to be too serious about everything. I have no complaints about this.
I am a psychologist, and I see rpgmaker (and amateur gamemaking in general) as a fantastic instrument of projection and expression, so I care about how much I can get to know the game creator by playing his game. That's the reason I don't like cliches, or RTPs, or fangames, or overused stuff in general. They don't tell me anything about the guy behind the game. I'm not saying I try to analyze people through their games. I just like to get the sense of humanity from the game... the same sense you get when you're reading a good book, or looking at a crazy drawing. That's why I like original, not just because it's different, but because it reflects something that's personal to the gamemaker guy, not just to gamemaking standards. That's why I love games like catmitts's.
I care about events, awards, and stuff, but just because they make everything else make more sense.
I also really like writing/reading reviews. Not just to give feedback (because some times the guy who made the game doesn't read them or care about them), but I feel like they're a great opportunity to talk about gamemaking in general based on something concrete. They're way more productive than abstract forum topics.
I care about quality. I like custom systems, polished graphics, a nice soundtrack, smooth gameplay, intelligent writing... I love all of that. Yes sir, I do.
Erave
1444
I lost interest in game making because ever since Easy Mac/Easy Mac 2 (around 5-6 years ago) I never made a hit game that people cared about. Channel Changer was hyped a bit and no one really liked it (I remember winning categories like WORST CHARACTER and such which I found hilarious), also it was too much work and it was still in rm2k right when rm2k3 had become popular.
In all honesty, I just want to finish a full length light hearted game. Maybe get some solid feedback. My life picked up a lot. I went to college, I got more into music. I had no time to be wasting on an rpg maker project little people would play and even smaller would like.
I have actually been playing a few games lately at RMN. Last Scenario which seems to me like a very solid, starter rmvx game. Not bad. I played this game called Exit Fate which reminded me of every other rm2k3 game after that one Stone game.
I watched my little brother play Hero's Realm, the maps had a lot of charm and you had seen everything in the game before. Seemed fun.
This post is not helpful at all.
In all honesty, I just want to finish a full length light hearted game. Maybe get some solid feedback. My life picked up a lot. I went to college, I got more into music. I had no time to be wasting on an rpg maker project little people would play and even smaller would like.
I have actually been playing a few games lately at RMN. Last Scenario which seems to me like a very solid, starter rmvx game. Not bad. I played this game called Exit Fate which reminded me of every other rm2k3 game after that one Stone game.
I watched my little brother play Hero's Realm, the maps had a lot of charm and you had seen everything in the game before. Seemed fun.
This post is not helpful at all.
Darken
3952
Oh hey I'm back just in time for more "RMN, we need to talk..."
I come here for the gams and to chill with the dudes and dudettes. I sometimes like to laugh at really bad random screenshots but apparently that is a big crime. I give feedback when I feel like it (especially if you actually have something to download) but I really don't have a huge agenda to HELP EVERYONE BY HELPING THEM IMPROVE (used to, if that means anything). I guess I am somewhat selfish in that regard. But people aren't completely helpless and just making stuff is enough to have fun and understand where you went wrong.
As for LOL RM SERIOUS BUSINESS. I like video games and I like making amateur games and I'll probably end up in some art career that involves making games, so I do take this place seriously. For those that don't and use that as an excuse to make a crappy game I didn't have fun playing, please don't post your gams here. As for my game I am pretty ambitious with the whole thing so good luck seeing anything from me. HOWEVER if I do finish the damn thing you can bet your fuzzy pickles that I will post it on RMN and RMN only. I don't really care for the downloads/misaos/5starreviews, but I'm sure most cool people here don't.
tldr: more downloads less screenshots ok?
I come here for the gams and to chill with the dudes and dudettes. I sometimes like to laugh at really bad random screenshots but apparently that is a big crime. I give feedback when I feel like it (especially if you actually have something to download) but I really don't have a huge agenda to HELP EVERYONE BY HELPING THEM IMPROVE (used to, if that means anything). I guess I am somewhat selfish in that regard. But people aren't completely helpless and just making stuff is enough to have fun and understand where you went wrong.
As for LOL RM SERIOUS BUSINESS. I like video games and I like making amateur games and I'll probably end up in some art career that involves making games, so I do take this place seriously. For those that don't and use that as an excuse to make a crappy game I didn't have fun playing, please don't post your gams here. As for my game I am pretty ambitious with the whole thing so good luck seeing anything from me. HOWEVER if I do finish the damn thing you can bet your fuzzy pickles that I will post it on RMN and RMN only. I don't really care for the downloads/misaos/5starreviews, but I'm sure most cool people here don't.
tldr: more downloads less screenshots ok?
and are not nihilists like, say, geodude.sorry can't stop just playing your game through for some lengthy critique
post=129405
HOWEVER if I do finish the damn thing you can bet your fuzzy pickles that I will post it on RMN and RMN only. I don't really care for the downloads/misaos/5starreviews, but I'm sure most cool people here don't.
I am one of the cool people who do care about downloads and
Darken
3952
post=129419
*insert 100000 word post here*
I like reading these, don't disappoint me now. ):
I am a psychologist, and I see rpgmaker (and amateur gamemaking in general) as a fantastic instrument of projection and expression, so I care about how much I can get to know the game creator by playing his game. That's the reason I don't like cliches, or RTPs, or fangames, or overused stuff in general. They don't tell me anything about the guy behind the game. I'm not saying I try to analyze people through their games. I just like to get the sense of humanity from the game... the same sense you get when you're reading a good book, or looking at a crazy drawing. That's why I like original, not just because it's different, but because it reflects something that's personal to the gamemaker guy, not just to gamemaking standards. That's why I love games like catmitts's.
I thought this was really interesting. That is all.
