FF7 REMAKE. IT'S A THING.

Sure, a hidden character who:
- you can take on a date (only the original three can do that... plus Yuffie)
- has scenes all through the game
- has more than one way to recruit (just in case you miss her the first time)
- is very verbal through the game (unlike Vincent, Cid and Cait Sith who don't really say as much)
- is quite fleshed out as a character

She's more of a character than some of the mains. She never felt tacked on. You're going to find Wutai if you play the game normally and you will meet her. Only horriblebad players miss her completely - the same horriblebad players who miss Vincent or never bother to beat Emerald weapon or get a gold chocobo.

If you miss Yuffie I have no choice but to conclude that you're not a good player of RPGs. And that's fine, really. Not everyone can be good at games, but hell, you're not playing the game right if you don't get the cool stuff. And Yuffie is cool.

Ammended to bad since you're right - horrible isn't quite the right connotation. Still, any decent player worth their salt would explore everything in a Final Fantasy game.

And I've never heard of anyone who missed Yuffie in all my years of talking about the game to others who had played it - and quite a few of them had FF7 as their first foray into RPGs. 'Ninja chick', as some call her, is not someone that's easy to miss. More people skip Vincent than Yuffie.

Hell, non-RPG players are bound to find Wutai a lot more easily because of the various areas that you have to find on your own (like the snow area and the Temple of the Ancients and the bone village.)

Once you get the Tiny Bronco, you're almost certain to find Wutai just by looking at the map and trying to find your way around. The way the shallows are set up, you have to go past the island to get to the Bone village, and Wutai is right there on the shore - and marked on your map, besides. Hell, you're right next to the island as soon as you gain control of the Tiny Bronco. Heading north along the shallows you can see Wutai, heading south you hit a beach on the island. It's practically shoved in you face.

Thing is, you find Wutai and you get Yuffie. No questions having to be answered. Seems I got that wrong (but then, I never not get Yuffie). You run into her all through the game, though, by fighting in forests, and there are plenty of those around - some areas are just forest. And the chances of running into her increases the further you go (at Rocket Town it's a 3/4 chance to find her in the forests). After running into her and triggering the scene all those times, you're bound to get the answers right at least once.

Wutai is practically shoved right in your face as soon as you get the Tiny Bronco. There's a beach just to the south of your position that is on the island, and you can see the town straight to the north... and the only way you can go is south or north because you have to follow the shallows. There's no way to miss it unless you do it deliberately, and even then there are times the plot doesn't tell you exactly where to go and you've got an airship. You are going to get Yuffie one way or another. It takes a very bad player (or deliberate avoidance) not to.

Yeah, edited. I never not get Yuffie first chance, but again, you have many, many chances to get her through the game. You can run into her on the island for Knights of the Round, even. XD

The chances of anyone not getting her is pretty damn small. Even if you do have to answer correctly to get her, you'd have more than enough chances to answer right - more as the game goes on.

Knowing to go back to Wutai after you get her is an issue since she doesn't really talk about her home much, but again, in the latter part of the game you get the airship and towns are automatically marked on the map, so it'd be a bad player who wouldn't be able to find Wutai or revisit at least once (and chances are you'll have Yuffie by then.)


Back to my point, though - you can easily make her a main by juggling a few things around. She's not a 'tacked-on' character (if anything, Cait Sith feels more tacked-on than she does) and she gets a fair bit of characterisation over the course of the game.

And I pointed out that even casual players have gotten her easily and with no issue. I know a fair few of them (sadly they don't like talking games :< ) and they had no issue finding her. They might not have liked her, but they got her in their team easily enough. She's weighted towards being easy to recruit because of the amount of times you meet her - and if worse comes to worse and you want to act like a dick to her because you're sick of her scene... well, congrats on the recruit. XD

Hell, even my mother got her, and FF7 was her second RPG (her first was Breath of Fire IV). Without help. ...she named her Ruffles. (then again, she named Cloud 'Camcro'. I... I don't even. Thank you Dad, for naming meeeeee ;^;)

But yeah, I could see them reworking the story a little to make both she and Vincent less haphazard recruits and more integrated with the story. It wouldn't take much with either.



(And oddly enough more people miss Vincent even though you have to visit the place where he hangs out. It's not even the safe, half the time - though that's part of it. The door he's behind is obscured when you go down to the basement and if you don't know it's there or that he's there somewhere, you rush straight past it and into a scene with Sephiroth. I was watching a blind LPer who got Yuffie the first time he met her, but missed Vincent completely (he got the safe open and knew there was someone to find in the basement, but just walked past that door without seeing it). He did go back and get him the next video (after being told in the video comments to do so) but even knowing someone was down there to find, he couldn't.) The 'having to talk to him more than once' thing also threw the guy for a loop.

This recent debate just points out how much this game had packed into it.

Current gen ain't gonna be able to be that emaculate, I just cannot see it happening, it would take YEARS.

Not to mention a lot of big fat ones. (dollars)

Well, that's one person who I've ever heard say that. And there were some areas where you were forced through forest that was very, very dense, but they should have upped her encounter amount in those areas (or added a special case of encounter at a certain point).

I think I also fall into the boat of people who were directly told how to get the optional characters before I ever played- having said that, I imagine that as a young lad of only 12/13 on my first play I don't think I'd have the patience to deal with her questions and get her.

But yeah, in the remake Yuffie and Vincent may as well be mandatory. You already have to trek through the areas of the game they show up in anyways, and they add a lot to the party/world/lore as well.

I've never beaten Emerald/Ruby weapon myself. Like most super-bosses it's fucking pointless. You spend hours of your life grinding up just to get what? A summon spell? Either that or you waste a bunch of time breeding Chocobos to get the same thing. I don't get the appeal, myself, but I'm pretty against super-bosses as a concept in the first place.

Oh, yeah, I get the angle of wanting to test your knowledge of the game. It just personally doesn't gel well with me, since... Hm. I'd want a more tangible reward given to the player for beating a super-boss, but it's hard to imagine what that could even be. For people who like them simply beating the boss is reward enough I suppose, but for someone like me who plays RPGs for story/worldbuilding/characters they don't hold much appeal as a concept.

I think the only JRPG I've had so much fun with that I beat the superbosses was the original FFI on GBA (not counting WarMech, as I didn't know it existed at the time).

To clarify: When I say I'm against super-bosses, I mean in terms of my own developmental mind. I would want to solve the risk/time - reward problem I see in them before I put any in anything that I make.

Oddly enough I think superbosses would work more as a concept in WRPGs like Skyrim or Fallout 3, as you could design entire swaths of the world and lore around them, and the player would have to seek them out in a more visually and atmospherically engaging way. That, and the fight could make better use of terrain, movement, action, just more direct, 'physical' player involvement in the mechanics of the game, and really get a better feeling of scale/danger across. I think Skyrim did have one (The 'Black Knight' or something?), but if I remember it was pretty lame.

author=Feldschlacht IV

author=pIZZA
as you could design entire swaths of the world and lore around them, and the player would have to seek them out in a more visually and atmospherically engaging way.

You can do that in any genre appropiate game. I just think you're (understandably) used to the Final Fantasy model of superbosses being 'lol im here for no reason now letz fite'

A superboss that's a major piece of the world/lore can be it's own reward, like you mentioned earlier.

Yeah, I realized after posting that I had just come up with a solution to my own problem in the end. I suppose that's to be expected, never really thought about it "out loud" before.

I just think that yeah, in terms of the super-bosses I am familiar with at the moment, I wouldn't bother with any. There's a lot of potential there though.