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Karsu's Sketch Topic
Last Legend [Demo]
Review is pending on the site.
A couple comments that don't really fit in the review:
Ryne, right before you first meet him, is stuck up on a wall in the North East side of town.
Although not technically a bug, the Deal Soldiers when you defeat them at the pass and when you bust Tyler and Noel out have really weird movement.
Otherwise, the game's solid.
A couple comments that don't really fit in the review:
Ryne, right before you first meet him, is stuck up on a wall in the North East side of town.
Although not technically a bug, the Deal Soldiers when you defeat them at the pass and when you bust Tyler and Noel out have really weird movement.
Otherwise, the game's solid.
Generica - [RMVX..?]
MEWD HAS JOINED THE PARTY
STATISTICS:
Level: 4
Class: Ninny
Skills:
Plot Design/dialogue/brainstorming - I like writing.
Cutscene writing/scripting - I like putting together elaborate cutscenes, testing them a thousand times over and trying to make them look perfect. I like writing.
Dungeon/puzzle Design - I'm no Brickroad, but I like interesting dungeons.
Character Design
Bug-testing (I can be extremely nit-picky when I want to be. Especially with my own work.)
Medium Adept Event Editor - I can do a lot with the event editor, but I have a threshold of skill. When we start getting into custom system territory I'm probably useless.
Weak Against:
Balancing
Working out gameplay mechanics
Custom systems
Pixel Art beyond simple edits
Graphic work in general
Music composition
Sound effects (I am okay at scouring to FIND some, but couldn't make any to save my life.)
Grass type pokemon
A word about terminology:
That's confusing, but okay!
THE QUESTIONS
1. Everyone seems pleased with the idea thus far. No outright objections yet. If everyone is happy with it, we can go with it and start fleshing it out.
2. Try to mind that the more classes we have, the more balancing work has to be done. That just scares me since I'm bad at it, but if you guys are cocky enough to take it on, go right on for it.
2a. I'd vote that everything be gotten through a skill tree for their particular class. Get the player points to spend to choose what skills they want. Gets them a sense of control and more instant gratification for level grinding.
2b. Something like a scan ability? I don't know how many different feats we can have that fall outside the realm of 'MP draining attack that maybe has an elemental association/status effect'
2c. If the game has random encounters, I would like something like the 'Survivalist' skill (Like Fallout), that could effect the rate of travel on the overworld and the encounter rate. Though, I think that a game like this would flatter a Final Fantasy Mystic Quest approach to monster battles. (Them stationary on the map, a finite number of them, but they respawn when you leave the level. Something like that)
3. I'm, not quite sure what to add. Blank slate and pre-determined characters both have their appeals. You're more likely to feel possessive of characters who are blank slates, but well-written pre-determined characters are liable to be much more endearing and memorable. We seem to be leaning more towards blank slate characters, since that flatters this type of gameplay, but we'd probably need a charming supporting cast to compensate for the minimalist personality of the protagonists. Pre-determined characters would really only work if the class system was 'locked' and the player's customization came from how that job role developed. It's REALLY hard to give a character a distinct personality if their job is up in the air. It's something they, up until this moment, devoted their life to. You can't, for instance, have a super aggressive white mage just as easily as a super aggressive knight. If you have an unusual personality in a particular job class, it's begging to be fleshed out as to WHY they are so unusual. You can give each job class an arch-type personality, but you might as well leave them mostly blank.
The more freedom the player has on constructing his team, the less that team can really interact with each other. They're more a collective avatar for the player. Which works just as well, since the player can make decisions for them and determine what those characters are like in his own mind.
There's still the option of doing something like Fallout or KOTOR, where you meet interesting characters along the way and keep or discard them as they fit your team, but the plot premise here offers the chance from the get go for the player to design their own team to their liking without mucking around with plot narrative before finding a character they like.
What do the rest of you think?
STATISTICS:
Level: 4
Class: Ninny
Skills:
Plot Design/dialogue/brainstorming - I like writing.
Cutscene writing/scripting - I like putting together elaborate cutscenes, testing them a thousand times over and trying to make them look perfect. I like writing.
Dungeon/puzzle Design - I'm no Brickroad, but I like interesting dungeons.
Character Design
Bug-testing (I can be extremely nit-picky when I want to be. Especially with my own work.)
Medium Adept Event Editor - I can do a lot with the event editor, but I have a threshold of skill. When we start getting into custom system territory I'm probably useless.
Weak Against:
Balancing
Working out gameplay mechanics
Custom systems
Pixel Art beyond simple edits
Graphic work in general
Music composition
Sound effects (I am okay at scouring to FIND some, but couldn't make any to save my life.)
Grass type pokemon
A word about terminology:
That's confusing, but okay!
THE QUESTIONS
1. Everyone seems pleased with the idea thus far. No outright objections yet. If everyone is happy with it, we can go with it and start fleshing it out.
2. Try to mind that the more classes we have, the more balancing work has to be done. That just scares me since I'm bad at it, but if you guys are cocky enough to take it on, go right on for it.
2a. I'd vote that everything be gotten through a skill tree for their particular class. Get the player points to spend to choose what skills they want. Gets them a sense of control and more instant gratification for level grinding.
2b. Something like a scan ability? I don't know how many different feats we can have that fall outside the realm of 'MP draining attack that maybe has an elemental association/status effect'
2c. If the game has random encounters, I would like something like the 'Survivalist' skill (Like Fallout), that could effect the rate of travel on the overworld and the encounter rate. Though, I think that a game like this would flatter a Final Fantasy Mystic Quest approach to monster battles. (Them stationary on the map, a finite number of them, but they respawn when you leave the level. Something like that)
3. I'm, not quite sure what to add. Blank slate and pre-determined characters both have their appeals. You're more likely to feel possessive of characters who are blank slates, but well-written pre-determined characters are liable to be much more endearing and memorable. We seem to be leaning more towards blank slate characters, since that flatters this type of gameplay, but we'd probably need a charming supporting cast to compensate for the minimalist personality of the protagonists. Pre-determined characters would really only work if the class system was 'locked' and the player's customization came from how that job role developed. It's REALLY hard to give a character a distinct personality if their job is up in the air. It's something they, up until this moment, devoted their life to. You can't, for instance, have a super aggressive white mage just as easily as a super aggressive knight. If you have an unusual personality in a particular job class, it's begging to be fleshed out as to WHY they are so unusual. You can give each job class an arch-type personality, but you might as well leave them mostly blank.
The more freedom the player has on constructing his team, the less that team can really interact with each other. They're more a collective avatar for the player. Which works just as well, since the player can make decisions for them and determine what those characters are like in his own mind.
There's still the option of doing something like Fallout or KOTOR, where you meet interesting characters along the way and keep or discard them as they fit your team, but the plot premise here offers the chance from the get go for the player to design their own team to their liking without mucking around with plot narrative before finding a character they like.
What do the rest of you think?
Last Legend [Demo]
Ah, dude. I've been playing your game, and if you screw up the trials in Ryne's scenario, they just stop working when you replay them.
Like, the one with the moving platforms, if you fail, whatever direction the platforms are pointing when the timer is up will be their direction when you restart. The game froze because the starting platform was pointing down when I retried.
The dragon race, the dragons weren't in place when I restarted and I couldn't go up the stairs again.
I got the other ones on my first try, but you might check to make sure the others reset themselves properly when you run out of time. Or you could just give a gameover if the player fails. There IS a save fairy after all.
I'll probably write a review for the game on the main site when I finish, unless you'd prefer feedback be kept here.
Like, the one with the moving platforms, if you fail, whatever direction the platforms are pointing when the timer is up will be their direction when you restart. The game froze because the starting platform was pointing down when I retried.
The dragon race, the dragons weren't in place when I restarted and I couldn't go up the stairs again.
I got the other ones on my first try, but you might check to make sure the others reset themselves properly when you run out of time. Or you could just give a gameover if the player fails. There IS a save fairy after all.
I'll probably write a review for the game on the main site when I finish, unless you'd prefer feedback be kept here.
Generica - [RMVX..?]
IS Generica a good name? The game doesn't seem particularly generic. A RPG with NES aesthetics that plays more like an open ended PC RPG? It's a good working title, at least, but not exactly marketable.
I'm in, yeah, but I hope you know how to allocate all of us to work on this thing.
I'm in, yeah, but I hope you know how to allocate all of us to work on this thing.
Stories in Games: A Counterpoint to Usual Thinking
Sandboxing with a game is loads of fun and can turn up interesting, visceral results. Though I wouldn't really qualify it as a story. As a writer, anyway, I just see a lot of beauty in setting up a carefully invented scenario. I appreciate them a lot more than the momentary drama of a round of Smash Brothers. This isn't to knock the fun of a game that just gives you a world to play with. Games can certainly present a CONTEXT with which you can create your own situations and emotional reactions, but I still personally think that games with more direct pre-conceived narrative are especially gratifying (Provided the writer in question knows what they're doing.) Sandboxing pretty much puts YOU in the seat of writer, creator. That's awesome, but sometimes it's just as much fun to see what someone else has expertly crafted.
I really don't think narratives in games is a matter of 'either or.' Games with limitations on your choices and those that give you as much freedom as possible both have their appeal. You can have your Hotel Dusks right along side your Grand Theft Autos and still have a mountain of enjoyment either way you go. It's not really a matter of which is more true to the nature of gaming, since you can't really limit gaming as a medium. All that really matters is what you enjoy.
I really don't think narratives in games is a matter of 'either or.' Games with limitations on your choices and those that give you as much freedom as possible both have their appeal. You can have your Hotel Dusks right along side your Grand Theft Autos and still have a mountain of enjoyment either way you go. It's not really a matter of which is more true to the nature of gaming, since you can't really limit gaming as a medium. All that really matters is what you enjoy.
Generica - [RMVX..?]
It really depends on how much freedom you want to give the player.
If the group has predetermined 'roles,' that expand and go in different directions, it might be slightly easier to balance. Making the player make everyone from scratch makes the player more possessive of the group, though.
Either way, I think you just want to give the player a sensation of control over their character's growth (And satisfaction by rewarding them with the abilities they acquire)
Personality arch types are slightly more reasonable for cutscene and dialogue purposes. However, if the characters are pure clean slates, than they really don't have to talk at all. Their (your) actions will define who they are. (NPCs reacting accordingly as everything you do could effect reputation stats)
Pre-set personalities are a lot more dynamic to write for, though. Having generic responses defined by stats make for characters who aren't quite as 'real' but it's still neat to see your actions having consequences in your characters behavior.
I don't know if you want to get bogged down by a lot of characterization, though. But I could go either way.
If the group has predetermined 'roles,' that expand and go in different directions, it might be slightly easier to balance. Making the player make everyone from scratch makes the player more possessive of the group, though.
Either way, I think you just want to give the player a sensation of control over their character's growth (And satisfaction by rewarding them with the abilities they acquire)
Personality arch types are slightly more reasonable for cutscene and dialogue purposes. However, if the characters are pure clean slates, than they really don't have to talk at all. Their (your) actions will define who they are. (NPCs reacting accordingly as everything you do could effect reputation stats)
Pre-set personalities are a lot more dynamic to write for, though. Having generic responses defined by stats make for characters who aren't quite as 'real' but it's still neat to see your actions having consequences in your characters behavior.
I don't know if you want to get bogged down by a lot of characterization, though. But I could go either way.
Generica - [RMVX..?]
Dude, David Bowie danced with Muppets in Labyrinth. You can't deny that gives him a serious edge.
Something I need to ask: Are you wanting 'blank slate' characters, or pre-determined characters? Somewhere inbetween?
The protagonist is usually easiest to make a clean slate, since they are typically, in effect, you. If you give the player a lot of options, the game's leader is only an avatar for them.
You could have something like in Fallout or Baldur's Gate where team mates with distinct personalities join you depending on stats (Alignment, reputation, money, whatever) or quests (Do this guy a favor and he'll follow you to the ends of the Earth in gratitude)
Preset characters are easier to make interesting, because they can have distinct personalities, but if the entire party is made up of blank slates (see: Etrian Odyssey,) than you're just asking for an excuse for them to be adventuring. Which is much trickier, but by no means impossible to make interesting.
Do you have a preference, or would you rather try and work out the premise of the game before deciding on the characterization of the game?
If you're going for blank slate characters, how about this:
There was a big war to stop Generic Demon Guy. A big army went to go stop him, and LOST. Your group (Which you design, of course) is composed of survivors of the battle. You start out the game trying to just SURVIVE, because the world is now under complete control of Generic Demon Guy and is a place of complete danger. Your party has no delusions about being able to confront the demon (not yet, anyway) because he just decimated the entire army you belonged to. It gives you a non-leniar world to explore that can be approached in different ways. Quests would be readily available because EVERYONE is just trying to survive and you're this big attractive group of adventurers with weapons and skills who are able bodied to do what the common man can't. You have this big hopeless world, ala Fallout, with you as being someone who can DO something amongst the desolation.
That may still be too generic, but it can be fleshed out still. The villain can be toyed with to be more interesting.
Somebody give me an indication if I'm hot or cold with what you want.
Something I need to ask: Are you wanting 'blank slate' characters, or pre-determined characters? Somewhere inbetween?
The protagonist is usually easiest to make a clean slate, since they are typically, in effect, you. If you give the player a lot of options, the game's leader is only an avatar for them.
You could have something like in Fallout or Baldur's Gate where team mates with distinct personalities join you depending on stats (Alignment, reputation, money, whatever) or quests (Do this guy a favor and he'll follow you to the ends of the Earth in gratitude)
Preset characters are easier to make interesting, because they can have distinct personalities, but if the entire party is made up of blank slates (see: Etrian Odyssey,) than you're just asking for an excuse for them to be adventuring. Which is much trickier, but by no means impossible to make interesting.
Do you have a preference, or would you rather try and work out the premise of the game before deciding on the characterization of the game?
If you're going for blank slate characters, how about this:
There was a big war to stop Generic Demon Guy. A big army went to go stop him, and LOST. Your group (Which you design, of course) is composed of survivors of the battle. You start out the game trying to just SURVIVE, because the world is now under complete control of Generic Demon Guy and is a place of complete danger. Your party has no delusions about being able to confront the demon (not yet, anyway) because he just decimated the entire army you belonged to. It gives you a non-leniar world to explore that can be approached in different ways. Quests would be readily available because EVERYONE is just trying to survive and you're this big attractive group of adventurers with weapons and skills who are able bodied to do what the common man can't. You have this big hopeless world, ala Fallout, with you as being someone who can DO something amongst the desolation.
That may still be too generic, but it can be fleshed out still. The villain can be toyed with to be more interesting.
Somebody give me an indication if I'm hot or cold with what you want.
Generica - [RMVX..?]
I'm willing to contribute to brainstorming. I don't know if I'd be very useful as a full-on member of such a community project, though. I'm a writer-type, and this doesn't sound like a game that would rely on dialogue and plot as a driving force. I'm not so great with tinkering with mechanics, classes, monsters and skills. If you want a guy to help with plot and dungeon design, I'm willing to contribute.
I actually had a comedic premise for a exploration/skill learning based game occur to me today. Basically that the protagonist has absolutely no desire to be heroic, but is forced into it by having every opportunity to lead a mundane life snatched away from him. Not totally original, but I figured that if I wanted to make a game without much plot direction, that would be an amusing way to get things rolling without bogging the game down with a lot of plot significance.
You probably already have something in mind, though. But I thought I'd throw that out there anyway just in case.
I presume this is going to take place at the IRC channel?
I actually had a comedic premise for a exploration/skill learning based game occur to me today. Basically that the protagonist has absolutely no desire to be heroic, but is forced into it by having every opportunity to lead a mundane life snatched away from him. Not totally original, but I figured that if I wanted to make a game without much plot direction, that would be an amusing way to get things rolling without bogging the game down with a lot of plot significance.
You probably already have something in mind, though. But I thought I'd throw that out there anyway just in case.
I presume this is going to take place at the IRC channel?
RPG Gender Swap!
author=MK634 link=topic=66.msg853#msg853 date=1182319983
Illusion of Gaia:
Will as the femmine type wouldn't change much. I think Wilie could be interpreted as a gal's name so she could be Wilie Croft and no one would notice...
Unless you were Kara and Lily and by that extension Lance since Kara would have to be a prince for that to work and I don't see how or why a prince would have a pet pig. Lily and Lance are just pure interchangable except for the moments of confict between Lily and Kara over Will. So it's a NG.
Dude. Hamlet was pretty freaking awesome. If I were royalty, I'd totally have a pig like that.
Games - Tester
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