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Radnen
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I like to make video games, especially action RPG's.
I make games slowly. Call me slow. But quality is always better than quantity!
Moo.
I make games slowly. Call me slow. But quality is always better than quantity!
Moo.
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Game Drive Week 05
I have been having a discussion about lore, and I like the questions you are asking, Sam!
My game takes place in a galaxy far, far away... But in the past! The galaxy that is explorable is what's a generation I galaxy, as in it has only been 5 billion years since the Big Bang, and was among the first (stable) galaxies to be formed. Earth wouldn't have existed (we are either gen 2 or 3...). But this does not mean there isn't life. You get to travel through time and space to planets of other people that vary from all shapes and sizes. There are only 5-6 locations, however. I'm working solo, so I can't have like 35.
The places that are explorable are:
Planet Aldat (past)
Planet Sunrey (future)
Planet Telarus III (future)
Planet Aldat (future)
Planet Sunrey (past)
Planet Telarus III (past)
Aldat is a scientific planet of people who invented time travel, amongst other things. The scientists were known for their "unethical" treatments and it caused all kinds of problems to stir. The landscape is dotted with old war bunkers from the "mutant wars" that played a hand in killing most of the people on the furthest colonies. Some mutants may still linger, but most were mainly taken care of. The player gets to fight these rogues mutants at times throughout Aldat.
Aldat in the future is a slummy mech city whose made on the foundation of illegal drug smuggling. The mayor of the city is a leader of a gang who uses androids that target banks and what-not to do their bidding. I haven't written too much for this story arc, but expect elements from Logans run and Blade Runner... Maybe a bit of Repo Men as well.
Sunrey in the past is a lush medieval place known for it's tranquil forests. It's landscape is dotted by temples of people who worship these intergalactic Keepers (read my blog for more info). You'll see shrines and temples like these across the whole galaxy, Sunrey becomes your first real example of them. Inside a temple (underwater, most of it) there are dangers - mutants - that suggest they came from Aldat's early years of testing. But why?
Sunrey in the future is going to be about colonization - like the U.S. revolutionary war. But I'm not sure if I'll add this or not...
Telarus III in the future is a desert landscape where lion-like people roam. They live as "prides" and there is "pridal" infighting causing tensions to rise between groups. You choose a side to fight for. They are fighting over a temple that was built to worship those Keepers. As fas as you'll know these lion-like people still do worship the Keepers while almost every other species has given up on them.
Telarus the III in the past is a land completely underwater. You ask yourself... Why? How is it that in the future there are land masses. This is where you'll find out what the Keepers do and what their purpose is. You'll explore and underwater society of Merfolk who were responsible for teaching the lion-like people in the future the religion of the Keepers. These Merfolk suffer from a disease that you get to help cure, but it gets tricky and you'll make some kind of decision in the future.
Yeah, take that for lore! I'm only warming up. If I make expansions you'll see more of these people and what-not.
My game takes place in a galaxy far, far away... But in the past! The galaxy that is explorable is what's a generation I galaxy, as in it has only been 5 billion years since the Big Bang, and was among the first (stable) galaxies to be formed. Earth wouldn't have existed (we are either gen 2 or 3...). But this does not mean there isn't life. You get to travel through time and space to planets of other people that vary from all shapes and sizes. There are only 5-6 locations, however. I'm working solo, so I can't have like 35.
The places that are explorable are:
Planet Aldat (past)
Planet Sunrey (future)
Planet Telarus III (future)
Planet Aldat (future)
Planet Sunrey (past)
Planet Telarus III (past)
Aldat is a scientific planet of people who invented time travel, amongst other things. The scientists were known for their "unethical" treatments and it caused all kinds of problems to stir. The landscape is dotted with old war bunkers from the "mutant wars" that played a hand in killing most of the people on the furthest colonies. Some mutants may still linger, but most were mainly taken care of. The player gets to fight these rogues mutants at times throughout Aldat.
Aldat in the future is a slummy mech city whose made on the foundation of illegal drug smuggling. The mayor of the city is a leader of a gang who uses androids that target banks and what-not to do their bidding. I haven't written too much for this story arc, but expect elements from Logans run and Blade Runner... Maybe a bit of Repo Men as well.
Sunrey in the past is a lush medieval place known for it's tranquil forests. It's landscape is dotted by temples of people who worship these intergalactic Keepers (read my blog for more info). You'll see shrines and temples like these across the whole galaxy, Sunrey becomes your first real example of them. Inside a temple (underwater, most of it) there are dangers - mutants - that suggest they came from Aldat's early years of testing. But why?
Sunrey in the future is going to be about colonization - like the U.S. revolutionary war. But I'm not sure if I'll add this or not...
Telarus III in the future is a desert landscape where lion-like people roam. They live as "prides" and there is "pridal" infighting causing tensions to rise between groups. You choose a side to fight for. They are fighting over a temple that was built to worship those Keepers. As fas as you'll know these lion-like people still do worship the Keepers while almost every other species has given up on them.
Telarus the III in the past is a land completely underwater. You ask yourself... Why? How is it that in the future there are land masses. This is where you'll find out what the Keepers do and what their purpose is. You'll explore and underwater society of Merfolk who were responsible for teaching the lion-like people in the future the religion of the Keepers. These Merfolk suffer from a disease that you get to help cure, but it gets tricky and you'll make some kind of decision in the future.
Yeah, take that for lore! I'm only warming up. If I make expansions you'll see more of these people and what-not.
Pacing VS Character Development
author=Darken"Lore" is implicit in any RPG. I may not be an RPG master by a long shot, but I do know "lore" is heavily involved, and I do know that if you aren't a good writer (sorry for being blunt earlier), then get some editors who do know how to write and help you mold the story.I think you're being really broad with your definition of lore. I myself have never seen good or original lore as it is just JRR Tolkien variants strung together
Lore well, is a broad concept, and has therefore a broad definition. It's like the word "Trope", no one can really claim an original trope nowadays.
Mass Effect had an original Lore.
Star Wars and Star Trek have the largest most written lores to date.
The Splinter Cell series, for what its worth has a lore involving the "third echelon".
Fallout has a lore of a fictional post nuclear world.
FF6 has a great lore of machinery and what-not.
Those were just quick examples. Lore defines a games history, and story. Not everything is a derivative or Tolkien's work. Tolkien derived his lore from actual folklore which is where the word "lore" comes from. And in post-modern literature, every idea has been taken. Lore just makes it look different. It's why people swear to god that Mass Effect looks a lot like Star Wars in nature, but has varying elements so as to call it "different". They are both space operas with good and evil, but where their differences lie is in how the galaxies are different. What species were added, what weapons are used, etc.
But for the basis of the OP's discussion, explaining lore based elements to define characters can slow the pace down. But RPG's were never games of fast pace (outside of the battle system, anyways).
Pacing VS Character Development
STOP TALKING ABOUT GAMES GOD DAMNIT.
When I meant "game" I meant RPG, as with what we all should use. Stop being so damn general in your posts, guys... Otherwise I'm sitting here thinking Pong has a story, and it clearly does not.
To save my own hide. I had earlier said: "games are defacto stories" I meant RPG's. :P
RPG's have interesting stories, and you'd better be a god damned good writer. RPG's aren't easy, they are indeed the hardest type of game to make, let alone write for. "Lore" is implicit in any RPG. I may not be an RPG master by a long shot, but I do know "lore" is heavily involved, and I do know that if you aren't a good writer (sorry for being blunt earlier), then get some editors who do know how to write and help you mold the story.
This thread was supposed to be about pacing vs character development. Not what constitutes a good RPG. But because lore and other things constitute character development, you are indeed slowing down the pace to explain things. This is where I'll let my argument stand.
Let's get back on track people.
Edit: Dang people post fast here... :/ Ghostman now has the right idea (as of top of page 4)... When earlier he did not.
When I meant "game" I meant RPG, as with what we all should use. Stop being so damn general in your posts, guys... Otherwise I'm sitting here thinking Pong has a story, and it clearly does not.
To save my own hide. I had earlier said: "games are defacto stories" I meant RPG's. :P
RPG's have interesting stories, and you'd better be a god damned good writer. RPG's aren't easy, they are indeed the hardest type of game to make, let alone write for. "Lore" is implicit in any RPG. I may not be an RPG master by a long shot, but I do know "lore" is heavily involved, and I do know that if you aren't a good writer (sorry for being blunt earlier), then get some editors who do know how to write and help you mold the story.
This thread was supposed to be about pacing vs character development. Not what constitutes a good RPG. But because lore and other things constitute character development, you are indeed slowing down the pace to explain things. This is where I'll let my argument stand.
Let's get back on track people.
Edit: Dang people post fast here... :/ Ghostman now has the right idea (as of top of page 4)... When earlier he did not.
Pacing VS Character Development
author=eplipswich
Too much lore is definitely not the way to go if it is handled badly. Lore can either make or break your game. Also, games don't need a whole load of lore to be fun and intriguing.
Fun, no. Intriguing yes.
Good lore is indeed written by a good writer. We are all good writers here, I presume? I mean, if all we use are RTP's or other peoples resources because we make story driven games then we should all be good writers. If not why the heck even make an RPG in RM?
Ergo, lore should always make your game, rather than break it. If you think you can't handle lore then get an education and come back. That's what I say.
Bug Tracker
If you want a lousy and cheap bug tracker you can open a blog and call it Bug Tracker and have people make replies to that. Of course, it's not going to be as neat as having a proper submission form.
It could even categorize by priority. A person could flag it as a high priority = game breaking (unfinishable quest) to low priority = visual (mapping error).
It could even categorize by priority. A person could flag it as a high priority = game breaking (unfinishable quest) to low priority = visual (mapping error).
Bug Tracker
Hey, it would be neat to have a simple form on your game page that tracks issues. Say you have a team of play testers and they have limited access to your "game page". They could then upload a bug or issue by filling out a simple form and hitting submit. Then it gets cataloged in a sub-section where I can read them and make the appropriate changes.
I think this site could do with a little more hands on approach to game design, don't you think? I've been using SourceForge as a bug tracker, but it's really for more open source projects and I don't think it should be included with stuff from RMN... Because most projects are already hosted here. So why not add a Bug Tracker into the mix?
I have no clue how hard it would be, but getting screenshots, game uploads, lockers, and blogs running would seem like a harder task than a simple form + submission button.
Also I say "limited access" because I don't want people spamming randomly the issue button. It's ideally for play testers... But I guess it could be open to anyone besides playtesters. The submissions could have a "remove" button so that the game admin, like me, could just remove and filter out the weird requests, or the completed requests.
I think this site could do with a little more hands on approach to game design, don't you think? I've been using SourceForge as a bug tracker, but it's really for more open source projects and I don't think it should be included with stuff from RMN... Because most projects are already hosted here. So why not add a Bug Tracker into the mix?
I have no clue how hard it would be, but getting screenshots, game uploads, lockers, and blogs running would seem like a harder task than a simple form + submission button.
Also I say "limited access" because I don't want people spamming randomly the issue button. It's ideally for play testers... But I guess it could be open to anyone besides playtesters. The submissions could have a "remove" button so that the game admin, like me, could just remove and filter out the weird requests, or the completed requests.
Pacing VS Character Development
author=LockeZauthor=DarkenloreZzzZZzZZzz
Lore is not boring? If your game has an enemy - of whatever kind - you have some lore there. Honestly, how can you make an interesting or good RPG without lore? Lore defines the story. Kefka for example has a heavy lore as a mage turned psychopath, it makes him the psychotic badass that he is.
CHALLENGE: Make an image for Featured Games
Someone should do a vector render, like with Adobe Illustrator or Inkscape, then you can resize it to any size without quality loss. Almost all icons are made this way, and produce the highest quality results. You don't have to be particularly good at it either. Here, I made this (in inkscape):
It can be in any size you guys wish it to be. 1x1 to 1000x1000+
It can be in any size you guys wish it to be. 1x1 to 1000x1000+
Pacing VS Character Development
author=Clest
What exactly do you mean by lore in this case Radnen?
...point is that setting should be the foundation of the story and gameplay in a way...
That. Making a setting, but with a history. Making enemies, players, NPC's. Local traditions in villages, peoples occupations, and other small-story elements all contribute to lore. Any small conversation - watercooler news in the game world - locations on a world map, creatures in forests or dungeons, a dungeons' layout. The history of a tower/castle/manor. These contribute to lore as well.
Lore is the driving point, not just setting. What's a setting without a history? Without some characteristics? Lore is what that's about. My game is heavy on lore - almost everything needs definition. Why do people dress a certain way? What does the local festival/holiday represent? Who is in charge of the town? How's his personality? These are things I put in my game so that the main story isn't the only thing driving the exploration.
Pacing VS Character Development
author=Jericho
You cannot keep the player playing if he does not care about what is going on.
Kind of an assumption there... In ARPG's the game could just be fun. As in, what keeps people playing is just killing and blowing shit up.
I think LORE is a great keyword to throw into the mix. Lore begs exploration and defines complexity in a game world. Good games have fantastic lore.
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