IDDALAI'S PROFILE

Hiya,

Please remove me from the Pokemon RMN Version devs list.

I think you're doing a great job at managing the project and it's disheartening to see how there's almost no new posts on the game page or your blog posts (I'm to blame for that too).

Good luck,

Cheers!

(I tried to send a PM but it failed over and over again)

You guys read like chapters from a self-help booklet!

Shall I give you the gift of despair?

Muahahahaha!!!2111!!!

...*cough cough* erm... sorry, I let my villain persona take over for a moment there.

@Gourd_Clae : You are behaving awful.
Banding together with Darken to further mock me just a post after your supposed apology shows how disingenuous your previous post was.
From my viewpoint, you hide behind a “holier than thou” mask and use that as an excuse to behave like an ass-hat.
That's an awful attitude.

Calling me “Sephiroth/Kefka (or Cefca if you're really edgy)” is akin to how people used to call others “Hitler” to discredit them in forums more than a decade ago.
It's a dirty trick that devalues your contributions.

I was going to address your full posts... but then you kind of started writing like Don Corneo, so I'm dropping the convo (see, I can do it too!).

@Gourd_Clae & Darken : If you really believe that noticing how modern art and modern videogames can be lower quality when compared with older art and older videogames is a sign of fascism, then you are bat-shit insane.

You two would find fascism in a cabbage.

author=Sidewinder
That being said, I also don't think iddalai's right about modern artists being inferior to older ones, either.

That's not what I said, but fine...

I was looking through some old files and found a few rare RPG Maker games. English, German, Spanish, Russian and 2 translations of older games.

I think some of these haven't seen the light of day for more than 15 years.

You guys may find this interesting: https://www.dropbox.com/s/3qhv1bp1tcf8503/Old%20or%20Rare%20RM%20Games.7z?dl=0

Some of the games contained here:

Return of Dreams
Jack Edge
Absolute Zero
Demon Story
SMQ - Mansion Demo

This topic I made about old 2001 rm2k game images and screensaver, may also interest you: https://rpgmaker.net/forums/topics/26792/?post=940583#post940583

No, AI ""art"" isn't ethical.

author=Roden
In fact they were happy to, and the overwhelming majority disagreed. They reassured me. Only I was vulnerable to self-doubt in that regard, due to my own experiences. But they knew what I knew, that there is no difference. The toolset one uses to create does not dictate the quality of the creation.

I expected them to agree with you, but didn't expect them to enjoy the question.
I still disagree.

author=Roden
As Bob Ross once said: "Talent is a pursued interest. Anything that you're willing to practice, you can do."

I like Bob Ross as much as the next guy, but he essentially stole the method from his master and then pretended to have developed it himself and made a living of it.
Not really someone I would quote due to his ambiguous moral and ethics.

As for talent, iddalai once said: "You either have talent or you don't."

You may hone your skills and they may allow you to be as good as the most talented, but you may never have talent you weren't born with. Talent is an unfair advantage that life has given to some people. Life is rarely fair and hard work is no substitute for raw natural talent.
Some people simply have a natural inclination to doing some things, and if they practice at those things they will get even better, in comparison someone without talent will have a harder time competing.

author=Roden
Pray tell, what religion did the ancient cave painters follow? What religion compelled our earliest ancestors to draw their hunt onto the wall of their homes?

Nonsense. Art is born of the soul, not of doctrine.

Did you study art and the history of art? Because I did.

I know it's not enjoyable to listen, but art was born of religion. Emphasis on "was". Times have changed and art changed with them. Religion is no longer as prevalent and therefore art now exists in function of the artist.

The ancient cave painters worshipped Gaia (or women in general for having the gift of giving life), represented as small statuettes of fertile women. This was before they stopped worshipping women and started worshipping men through the use of mehnirs (AKA giant erect penises).

Wall painting also represented religious rituals in addition to big hunts (which can be argued to be part of the rituals).

Later on, when religion took over the world, there were only 2 types of art, the large majority was depicting bible scenes (heaven, hell, etc) to impress the faithfuls and the rest was depictions of rather rich people.

Greece worshipped the male body, so what do we get? A ton of male nude statues (their depiction of the female body was rare) and get this, most of the depicted males were religious figures (Zeus, Hercules, etc) or rich folk.

And so on.
Until we get to Dada which said "fuck this, I'm drawing a moustache in Mona Lisa!" and hence proclaimed art to be dead so that it could be reborn through the artist, after being released from the shackles of religion.

author=Roden
Your rose glasses are showing. Over time we only remember, or indeed, history only preserves the greatest of the great in art. It's ignorance to assume that any one period of time produced an undeniably lower class of creation, because you only remember the pinnacle of what time has passed.

I collect movies, so I know this. People say "movies were better back in the 80s/90s/70s/etc, but every era had the same amount of low quality drivel being shovelled into it. The difference being that as time passes we don't remember it. The same will be said of today's era once it reaches a proper age.

This isn't really what I argued about, but I'll indulge.

It's ignorance to believe that quality didn't degraded.
You're assuming I haven't done my homework, simply because you didn't do yours.
If you believe that modern movies are as good as movies from decades ago, then you are deceiving yourself and there's no reason for me to keep this up since we will be running in circles.

I won't deny that there was crap being produced in every time period. That hardly contradicts what I said. There is always crap being produced! But the ratio of crap to quality has changed, as did the quality standards, all of which for the worse. Acting, camera angles, cinematography, soundtrack, plot, writing. A random bad movie from the 80's has better chances of being better quality than a random average movie from today.

And by comparison one of Black and White's best can kick the ass of most 80's movies (or any other non-B&W era).

This doesn't mean that there aren't exceptions, but they are just that.

Congratulations, now I feel like the old man yelling at a cloud.

author=Gourd_Clae
I was using them as synonyms since they often come together. I said my lived experience contradicts your model of the world and you skipped over it. How do you reckon with that?

I see, but I don't agree they're synonyms.
I didn't skip over it. I replied with another question: Why is it that my worldview is problematic and not yours, pray?

I think it's fair, since you disagree with my worldview, that I ask why is my worldview the issue here and not your worldview.

But I'll tell you this: what am I to do when my life experience also contradicts your model of the world? Living in different locations can be enough to provide completely different outlooks.

author=Gourd_Clae
If easier, to you, means two parts of "more people are able to get their hands on art supplies" and "the act of art itself is inherently easier to do" than yeah i see how you might think it's easier. i would agree with you on the first part but again disagree on the second part bc it's been my experience otherwise.

More or less. Easier partly because of what you mention here, but also in the skill required. Which is what you disagree with.

author=Gourd_Clae
Here's a video about fascisms veneration of older art also with some cool modern art (that maybe isn't art?) thrown in:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v5DqmTtCPiQ

if you watch that iddalai, you might understand better my intentions with the note on fascism.
Going to leave the rest bc you're kind of starting to talk like sephiroth as you get further in the post. None of my post was meant to be aggressively inflammatory! I was being a little cheeky with the "no offense" part obviously, but i was just mimicking the (slightly nasty) tone in your other post where you go on about knowing what you say will bruise egos. Just figured you could take it in good fun, as you were dishing out hard truths yourself, sorry!

Well, I know I ruffled some (all?) feathers, but I hope I wasn't as offensive as you are being to me.

Dude, you implied I was a fascist! How could I not get inflamed!? And now you're saying I'm talking like Sephiroth? WTF

There was no nasty tone in what I wrote in my first post. I'm calling BS on that. If there's any nasty tone at all, it's after people stopped being polite.

Good fun? After what you implied? I can't take nothing in good fun after you grossly misinterpreted what I wrote.

Forgive me if I don't quite feel like watching that video since it came from a person who implied I was a fascist and still maintains the same position.
I feel like this should be against forum rules or something.

author=Irog

author=Strak
Ooh let's please not open that can of worms. This could very easily turn into a very toxic post if we go down that rabbit hole.

I believe that we, at RMN, can have a sound discussion including this point.

I'm not too sure about that, Irog :(

author=Irog

author=iddalai
Old school artists were made extinct when the all-digital platform arrived, and now the all-digital artists will be made extinct by these programs. Soon there will be no one who can be called an artist. The concept will disappear.

The sad reality is: if creating art cease to be viable, fewer peoples will develop good art skills.

I agree. Many other skills have been lost due to similar happenings (such as mechanising a process and removing the human component).

author=OzzyTheOne
Going back to whether AI art is ethical or not, I'd say it absolutley depends on how it is applied. One application where I personally don't see any issues is using it for inspiration, as in, have it come up with some sort of scene based on prompts and then make your own work based off of that. Kind of like a "concept artist" for the people that can't afford to find a proper concept artist. While there absolutely some unethical usages of AI art, I do think we should also try and focus on the positives.

But even if you're only using it for inspiration, that same concept art or inspiration should come from a person, an artist and not a program. It's still unethical.

We're tiptoeing around the issue here, there's only one reason for this to exist, which is to help people who don't have any art aptitude or the will to try it/spend time learning it, to be able to produce images.

author=OzzyTheOne
Personally, I don't think AI art will ever replace the actual artist, there's just a special level of nuance that can't be replicated with AI, and not to mention that an actual artist can perfectly fine tune a piece of art is necesarry.

I agree with the overall sentiment, but then I look around and many jobs and people have already been replaced by such programs.

Consider this, you believe that artists cannot be replaced (which I agree), because you were born in an era before AI art. But what will the following generations feel when asked the same question, since they were born in a world where AI art is common/the norm?
I'm inclined to believe that they will deem artists unnecessary.

author=OzzyTheOne
Touching ever so slightly on the digital vs physical art thing, I see them as both having the same issues. I don't really think that digital art makes art more accessible to the lower class, as getting any really good tablet for drawing costs you thousands of dollars. The same way a less wealthy individual can start out in art with cheap art supplies, a digital artist can start out with a cheap tablet and then upgrade if necessary. Now, I am absolutely no expert on what is more costly in the long run, drawing tablets for drawing digitally, or getting art supplies for drawing physicially, but I think both forms of art have their strengths and weaknesses and places in the world. Some things are easier with physical art, some things are easier with digital art, it's all a matter of what it's used for.

That's a really good point!
I'd like to add that anyone with a computer can create art using free programs. It won't be as high quality when using a mouse, sure, but they can. But the same can be said for someone with a piece of paper and a pencil (although I think that can be higher quality when compared with a mouse, unless you're making pixel art).

I also agree that both forms of art have theirs strengths and weaknesses, but I still maintain that physical takes more skill.

Holy Crap! SegNin is back! I mean, I never met you before or anything, but you have legendary status around here! :D
Welcome back!!

I took a look through the posts and unless I've missed it, no one's been able to find "The Manhatton Project" yet, right?
This was the game that SpoonyBard mentioned in the original "Final Fallacy" when we meet the deformed moogle character in the temporal vortex thingy.

Here's some more info. In "The Manhatton Project", Manhaton and RPG_Wizard (Wizz) were the main characters and the game was based on an IRC RPG Maker group (but I don't think it's the same game as the "IRC Project SE" since that one doesn't have a sex bomb and Wizz isn't blasted away as described by SpoonyBard in Final Fallacy when explaining who Wizz is).

In any case, great finds people! I see a lot of games have been found and archived, great work!

EDIT: by the way, Bob's Big Adventure was made by Rast.